A solution to this could be go genrate idf models more interactively as suggested Jon. We already have idfcyl and idfrect as references. I assume there is no reason to use IDF over STEP as the physical representation.
On Tue, 29 Sep 2020 at 21:01, Mário Luzeiro <mrluze...@ua.pt> wrote: > that would work for me too ;) > > Mario > > ________________________________________ > From: Jon Evans <j...@craftyjon.com> > Sent: 29 September 2020 19:53 > To: Mário Luzeiro > Cc: Seth Hillbrand; kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > Subject: Re: [Kicad-developers] 3D-Viewer: limit scale to positive values? > > Note Altium's solution to the use case of needing "easy basic models": it > can actually generate the models built-in. > > You just specify some parameters and it will generate cylinders, spheres, > or extruded shapes from a 2D contour. > > If we could add this kind of feature in the future, maybe we would not > need to support "stretching" generic models, as we could just generate the > right generic model parametrically (without "stretching" a source model) > > On Tue, Sep 29, 2020 at 2:50 PM Mário Luzeiro <mrluze...@ua.pt<mailto: > mrluze...@ua.pt>> wrote: > From my user experience: I use the 3 scale values on my projects. > I created unit solids (eg: 1mm cube, 1mm cylinder radius / thickness, etc) > and then I use it to quickly create shapes (by adjusting X,Y,Z scale) to > populate the board if I don't have the proper STEP model. > This is helpful to create round buttons, push buttons switch house > packages, displays (attached is an example I made just using 1mm cubes) > I'm using WRL but I believe it should work if I had used STEP scaled and > then export it for CAD purposes. > > If you remove scale at all, I will need to learn and use a new CAD > software :/ :) > > My suggestion is keep the scale but hide (or disable) it by default on the > UI and it should only be enabled by clicking on some checkbox, at that > time, displaying some message to the user "this is not a good idea for > CAD.." > > > > I'm not sure the history of why VRML was chosen as the first model type > that was supported > > Maybe at that time it was created was a very time consuming thing to > implement. > For STEP we need a 3rd part library (as it is very complex format). > On the current 3D-Viewer implementation, Cirilo worked alone on the model > importer code alone and it took some months of work.. > > Mario > > ________________________________________ > From: Kicad-developers <kicad-developers-bounces+mrluzeiro= > ua...@lists.launchpad.net<mailto:ua...@lists.launchpad.net>> on behalf of > Seth Hillbrand <s...@kipro-pcb.com<mailto:s...@kipro-pcb.com>> > Sent: 29 September 2020 19:01 > To: Jon Evans > Cc: kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net<mailto: > kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net> > Subject: Re: [Kicad-developers] 3D-Viewer: limit scale to positive values? > > I've never seen another package use VRML. Everyone uses STEP. I suspect > if we were implementing this today, we would look at the tradeoff on > support/benefit for VRML and limit ourselves to STEP as well. > > I like Ian's suggestion for unit options. > > -Seth > > On Tue, Sep 29, 2020 at 10:22 AM Jon Evans <j...@craftyjon.com<mailto: > j...@craftyjon.com><mailto:j...@craftyjon.com<mailto:j...@craftyjon.com>>> > wrote: > Do other EDA tools allow model scaling? Altium doesn't even allow VRML > import in the first place. > > On Tue, Sep 29, 2020 at 1:10 PM Seth Hillbrand <s...@kipro-pcb.com<mailto: > s...@kipro-pcb.com><mailto:s...@kipro-pcb.com<mailto:s...@kipro-pcb.com>>> > wrote: > Well, we've backed ourselves into a bit of a corner. VRML is specified in > meters, so if we're assuming inches, we're a bit off in left field. But do > we need three separate scale parameters? We could reduce to 1, correct? > > In the official footprint library, we have 7 footprints that specify > non-unity scaling. (Banana_Jack_[1-3], NS-Tech_Grove_1x04, Fuse_Blade_ATO, > Fuse_Blad_Mini, Oscillator_SMD_TXC0_G158). > > -Seth > > > > > On Tue, Sep 29, 2020 at 9:30 AM Ian McInerney <ian.s.mciner...@ieee.org > <mailto:ian.s.mciner...@ieee.org><mailto:ian.s.mciner...@ieee.org<mailto: > ian.s.mciner...@ieee.org>>> wrote: > We can't remove the scaling option until we make the VRML importer handle > proper unit selection. I have routinely run into the case where I go > OpenSCAD -> Wings3D -> KiCad and design a model using mm in OpenSCAD > because it makes for easier computations (all the datasheet values are > nicely given in mm) and then have to apply a scaling factor of 0.3937 to > all the axes in KiCad to make it the proper size because we seem to have a > hardcoded assumption about what unit system the VRML file is in. > > In fact, the KLC says: WRL files do not specify absolute dimensions. KiCad > normalizes model parameters to units of inches and the internal units > (dimensionless) of the WRL model must be scaled accordingly. > > -Ian > > On Tue, Sep 29, 2020 at 4:50 PM Seth Hillbrand <s...@kipro-pcb.com<mailto: > s...@kipro-pcb.com><mailto:s...@kipro-pcb.com<mailto:s...@kipro-pcb.com>>> > wrote: > There has been some discussion to removing the scale option here > altogether. The logic being that if you need the model scaled, you should > be doing this in your solid CAD not in your electronic CAD. I have come > around to this idea and it might be worth implementing rather than doing > the scale limiting. > > -Seth > > On Tue, Sep 29, 2020 at 4:52 AM Mário Luzeiro <mrluze...@ua.pt<mailto: > mrluze...@ua.pt><mailto:mrluze...@ua.pt<mailto:mrluze...@ua.pt>>> wrote: > Hi all, > > I'm wondering if it is safe to limit the scale of shapes to be positive > values? > > Applying negative scales will cause inverted shapes and render issues on > the models. > > Could be that anyone in the world is using negative scale values? > or should be safe to limit it? > > This is related with this issues: > https://gitlab.com/kicad/code/kicad/-/issues/5817 > > Mario > _______________________________________________ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net<mailto: > kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net><mailto: > kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net<mailto: > kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > > -- > [KiCad Services Corporation Logo] > Seth Hillbrand > Lead Developer > +1-530-302-5483<tel:+12126039372> > Davis, CA > www.kipro-pcb.com<http://www.kipro-pcb.com><https://www.kipro-pcb.com/> > i...@kipro-pcb.com<mailto:i...@kipro-pcb.com><mailto:i...@kipro-pcb.com > <mailto:i...@kipro-pcb.com>> > _______________________________________________ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net<mailto: > kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net><mailto: > kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net<mailto: > kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > > -- > [KiCad Services Corporation Logo] > Seth Hillbrand > Lead Developer > +1-530-302-5483<tel:+12126039372> > Davis, CA > www.kipro-pcb.com<http://www.kipro-pcb.com><https://www.kipro-pcb.com/> > i...@kipro-pcb.com<mailto:i...@kipro-pcb.com><mailto:i...@kipro-pcb.com > <mailto:i...@kipro-pcb.com>> > _______________________________________________ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net<mailto: > kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net><mailto: > kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net<mailto: > kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net>> > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > > -- > [KiCad Services Corporation Logo] > Seth Hillbrand > Lead Developer > +1-530-302-5483<tel:+12126039372> > Davis, CA > www.kipro-pcb.com<http://www.kipro-pcb.com><https://www.kipro-pcb.com/> > i...@kipro-pcb.com<mailto:i...@kipro-pcb.com><mailto:i...@kipro-pcb.com > <mailto:i...@kipro-pcb.com>> > _______________________________________________ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >
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