Axel sent me this reply about literature etc: *Hello,* > > *These questions do not bother me, quite the opposite. I much prefer to > exchange, enlighten and argue about facts, rather than the disdainful > silence that exists too often.* > > *I responded in part to Steven who relayed your query directly on the > Incubator. See here : > https://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/User_talk:StevenJ81#WP_Kotava_project_(avk) > <https://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/User_talk:StevenJ81#WP_Kotava_project_(avk)>* > > *In addition, what I can add:* > > *- Kotava has been in existence for 40 years (1978). People who take an > interest in it and practice it (kotavusik) do not make proselytism like > Esperantists or Interlingua speakers. On the other hand, they adhere to a > very "ideological" idea of the need for a neutral language of international > communication and know that, even if the language is exemplary in terms of > simplicity, flexibility and wealth, it requires a very voluntary approach > since his vocabulary is totally new. It's for this reason that we do not > find the "simple foragers" who think they can speak Esperanto from the > moment they say "mi parolas esperanton".* > > *- as I had the opportunity to describe it to Steven, there was an > interesting start of expansion in West and Central Africa in the 1990-2000 > years, leaded by several very motivated people at that time, but this > movement has been greatly reduced in the aftermath of the realities of the > basic communication needs of these populations. At present, most speakers > of Kotava are on the contrary mostly people very cultivated, of humanistic > and libertarian tendency, scattered everywhere.* > > *- the question about the English-speaking world is main, because > according to the very purpose of Kotava, most kotavusik are reluctant to > use English as a language of exchange and means of spreading (you can see > this document, a French translation of a Kotava text, which denounces the > paradox of the use of English: > https://fr.scribd.com/doc/130318117/PVM-Dakteks-Klaba-FR-Le-paradoxe-des-langues-artificielles-dans-la-communication-moderne > <https://fr.scribd.com/doc/130318117/PVM-Dakteks-Klaba-FR-Le-paradoxe-des-langues-artificielles-dans-la-communication-moderne> > )* > > *Thank you for your clarification at the time of the rocking of the > project.* > > *I remain at your disposal and that of the other Langcom's members for any > useful clarification.* > *Regards.* > *Axel* > ==/> > > And to complete more precisely on the Kotava literature, you can for > example take a look at the following sites: > > * *Kotavaxak dem Suterot*: publishing major translations (Maupassant, > Joyce, Zola, Dostoyevski, Maria Chapdelaine, Pirandello, Ghibran, Wilde, > Zweig, Molière, Chekhov, etc. https://fr.scribd.com/user/244033012/Kotava > -Ewalik > > * *Wikikrenteem*: about 800 original texts and translations in Kotava > http://www.europalingua.eu/wikikrenteem/?title=Emudexo > > * *Marjorie Waldstein's library*: various texts, translations of > proverbs, lexicons, grammars, various documents in Kotava, etc. > https://fr.scribd.com/user/657132/Marjorie-Waldstein > > Regards. > Axel >
man. 18. nov. 2019 kl. 22:20 skrev MF-Warburg <[email protected]>: > For the record, I have also asked user:Axel xadolik to comment. > > Am Di., 12. Nov. 2019 um 17:48 Uhr schrieb Steven White < > [email protected]>: > >> I highly doubt this would become a laughing stock. This project is >> actually one of the best, highest-quality, most serious projects I have >> seen in my three years (short two weeks) as a sysop on Incubator. That >> doesn't make your questions any less valid; I only share my perspective >> that this is a serious effort worthy of consideration. >> >> - Just now looking at Catanalysis, I see six contributors with at >> least 500 edits, four more with at least 100, and four more with at least >> 50. So this is not a project of only 3–5 people. >> - There are close to 5,000 mainspace pages. Very few are redirects. >> Many are short, but even those have good bibliographies, which is better >> than a lot of our projects do. >> >> I would mention two points about Jan's 27 September email to the list: >> >> - "Kotava indeed has an impressive text corpus." Is there a >> convenient list somewhere? >> - I would suggest you consider looking at >> https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kotava. It also has sourcing problems, >> to be sure. But this conlang, unlike many, comes out of the francophone >> world. So I'm not sure the lack of awareness in the anglophone world is >> the >> most appropriate measure of the language. >> >> Steven >> >> Sent from Outlook <http://aka.ms/weboutlook> >> >> ------------------------------ >> *From:* Langcom <[email protected]> on behalf of >> MF-Warburg <[email protected]> >> *Sent:* Tuesday, November 12, 2019 11:21 AM >> *To:* Wikimedia Foundation Language Committee < >> [email protected]> >> *Subject:* Re: [Langcom] Kotava Wikipedia >> >> I somewhat share the concerns mentioned by Amir and Jan van Steenbergen. >> What I would hate to see is that we approve a project and then become a >> laughing stock because it turns out to be an unserious thing in one way or >> another. >> >> Is there some proof here of any of: "independently proved number of >> speakers, use as an auxiliary language outside of online communities >> created solely for the purpose, usage outside of Wikimedia, publication of >> works in the language for general sale", as suggested by the admirable >> Language Proposal Policy? >> >> >> >> >> Jon Harald Søby <[email protected]> schrieb am Di., 5. Nov. 2019, 13:12: >> >> Any other comments other than Michael's repeated approvals? ;-) >> >> If not, we can move forward on this, but I'd like to hear the thoughts of >> at least a couple more committee members. >> >> tir. 1. okt. 2019 kl. 15:28 skrev Michael Everson <[email protected]>: >> >> There seems to be something wrong with my mail server. >> >> > On 30 Sep 2019, at 20:33, MF-Warburg <[email protected]> wrote: >> > >> > Michael, are you ok? >> > >> > Michael Everson <[email protected]> schrieb am Mo., 30. Sep. 2019, >> 21:24: >> > I support approval. >> > >> > > On 26 Sep 2019, at 22:47, Jon Harald Søby <[email protected]> wrote: >> > > >> > > Hi all, >> > > >> > > I'd like to hear your thoughts on the Kotava Wikipedia. Kotava is a >> conlang created in 1978, mainly known in French-speaking countries >> (according to the English Wikipedia). They have a very active test wiki in >> Incubator, with more than 3,000 articles, which makes it bigger than the >> Novial Wikipedia (which we approved in 2008) and about the same size as the >> Lingua Franca Nova (LFN) Wikipedia (which we approved in 2017). There are >> several active users, and sustained activity for many months. >> > > >> > > Does anyone have reasons for why we should not approve this project? >> > > >> > > -- >> > > mvh >> > > Jon Harald Søby >> > > _______________________________________________ >> > > Langcom mailing list >> > > [email protected] >> > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom >> <https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.wikimedia.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Flangcom&data=02%7C01%7C%7C04fa68c31aad471c149e08d7678c82d2%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637091725497635647&sdata=nvyXylUrFLw%2B86BC5u1VsWY%2F8GFDLeChYAKDTtd2074%3D&reserved=0> >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Langcom mailing list >> > [email protected] >> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom >> <https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.wikimedia.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Flangcom&data=02%7C01%7C%7C04fa68c31aad471c149e08d7678c82d2%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637091725497635647&sdata=nvyXylUrFLw%2B86BC5u1VsWY%2F8GFDLeChYAKDTtd2074%3D&reserved=0> >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Langcom mailing list >> > [email protected] >> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom >> <https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.wikimedia.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Flangcom&data=02%7C01%7C%7C04fa68c31aad471c149e08d7678c82d2%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637091725497645659&sdata=bKy5ktXT5UTXAkGbw2hREHpNh4FNXaanMyY7XQGwL5M%3D&reserved=0> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Langcom mailing list >> [email protected] >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom >> <https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.wikimedia.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Flangcom&data=02%7C01%7C%7C04fa68c31aad471c149e08d7678c82d2%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637091725497645659&sdata=bKy5ktXT5UTXAkGbw2hREHpNh4FNXaanMyY7XQGwL5M%3D&reserved=0> >> >> >> >> -- >> mvh >> Jon Harald Søby >> _______________________________________________ >> Langcom mailing list >> [email protected] >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom >> <https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.wikimedia.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Flangcom&data=02%7C01%7C%7C04fa68c31aad471c149e08d7678c82d2%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637091725497655659&sdata=9NPPio%2B2rk%2Fv%2BhTJjY5Fn%2FQ9eZU8%2Bu4PoF%2Fon3DdonI%3D&reserved=0> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Langcom mailing list >> [email protected] >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom >> > _______________________________________________ > Langcom mailing list > [email protected] > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom > -- mvh Jon Harald Søby
_______________________________________________ Langcom mailing list [email protected] https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom
