Hi Don
On Monday, 9 November 2015 18:42:50 UTC, Don Dwiggins wrote:
>
> Jon,
>
> Yes, one of Ecco's attractions for me has always been the easy and rapid
> "tree surgery", that allows me to dump a bunch of information into a "list"
> and easily reorganize it as I become aware of the emerging structure. My
> hope is that, with some appropriate programming, I can get a similar
> facility going in Leo. (If anyone's interested, I can post a link to a
> fairly detailed description of Ecco's outlining commands and features I
> wrote up a few years back.)
>
> For example, I have a little outline structure that I use for task
> management. It's the work of a few seconds to type:
> Task name/description
> Notes
> Status
> Expectations *(inputs I expect from others)*
> Done *(holds TBDs that have been done)*
> TBD
> ... and then go back and start fleshing it out. It's also simple to turn
> a TBD item into a subtask, by just entering these headings under it.
>
>
Yes, indeed, it's extremely easy to brain dump this way and then add
structure via indenting. I have tried to use Ecco in a very similar way
('GTD') myself, but although it works OK for one project, I found it
difficult to scale up.
(I think I have a copy of that outline you wrote - I know that your name is
familiar to me!)
This has worked well enough for me that I've never missed having a tool
> specifically oriented to task management. (I actually tried Task Coach for
> a while, but found that I was spending too much time on adapting to the
> mechanics of the tool.) I have several years' worth of project "bundles"
> that I can go back and review when something related comes up.
>
>
Heh Heh, i have also tried Task coach and found it didn't adapt to what/how
I wanted to do...
> I too am a fan of Ecco - I still use it under Windows and (via Wine) under
> Linux. I would love to find the 'sweet spot' between Ecco and Leo
>
>
> Yes, that's exactly my desire. (By the way, there's still and active
> group of Ecco users, some of whom might find Leo an attractive
> alternative. They mention fairly often their concerns that Ecco may stop
> working under the "next release" of Windows.)
>
> Yes, I know of eg. the Yahoo group(s), and very occasionally contributed
there (jknetaoins). Perhaps we should do a bit of work together on trying
to hit this sweet spot.
>
> As you know, Ecco's main pane is more of a hierarchical indented list
> [together with, simplified, their respective folders and their values]. In
> comparison, Ecco has hierarchical nodes, each with a headline and content.
>
>
> I think you meant "Leo" in the second sentence. Yes, that is a different
> concept -- Ecco doesn't have that distinction -- in Ecco, a node's content
> *is* its subnodes.
>
> Yes, the second reference should be to Leo. However I would say that in
Ecco, a node's content is its *folders* content? (I didn't want to go down
that path in my simple description). When you take that into consideration,
the indenting in ecco is actually almost an incidental part of the 'data
model' ... albeit one which you and I seem to find highly useful. FWIW I
only occasionally use the folder aspect of Ecco, which probably makes me a
pretty lightweight user! I see the sweet spot as (ahem) 'leveraging' the
programatic/data parts of Leo to replace folders with... or something
I do feel slightly apologetic about keeping mentioning Ecco in this forum -
> Leo is a great bit of work and I have not put the work in to mould it to my
> needs sufficently to make many sensible contributions/suggestions. It is
> interesting how such an old program as Ecco still has adherents, nearly
> twenty years after it was discontinued...
>
>
> My feeling is that it's reasonable to continue here, at least for a
> while. If it becomes objectionable to others, we can take it "offline" in
> various ways. Remember, we're trying to make Leo a reasonable (and
> long-term viable) "destination" for a new group of people.
>
How about if, for starters, we try to get an alternative set of Leo key
bindings that [better] match with Ecco? That might be a useful thing to
share. I did post a summary list of some of the Ecco key bindings in this
forum a few years ago. I only half-pursued adding them, partly because I
was concerned about then having to mentally translate explanations here
into my own 'language'. I'm less concerned about that now.
Cheers
jon N
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