Griffin Boyce: > Not only am I going to be presenting three talks at OHM, I will be > presenting talks that are (in many ways) totally dead conversations in the > US. >
Congratulations. I look forward to seeing them, probably on a remote stream but also perhaps in person. > It's interesting how much of the debate centers around the presence of > police at OHM, as if American hacker cons didn't have the head of the NSA > presenting keynotes. Or congratulating a child for doing things an adult > could be prosecuted for. The debate centers around people in the community working with the police, with the police being openly welcome, with those same police being pushed with false arguments about how "undercover cops" will be there anyway and so on. They are "required" by law to arrest people in some unknown set of conditions - you know, except when you download movies or other things where they are able to look the other way. No one has said that the cops shouldn't submit a talk - many have even called for debate panels and for the cops to join up. What is the status on that? Did any of those high tech police or intelligence agencies actually offer to join as a peer? Are they coming to share their new forensics techniques with the community? To arrest someone against their will is to commit an act of violence against them. If one is required by law to perform such arrests, one should avoid such an event - it puts the community in danger. The event should ban anyone who is "required" to commit such acts of violence - people should come as peers, as equal. Exceptions are required under Dutch law, those are unfortunate - though they can stay exceptions if the community makes a commitment to creating a safe space by explicitly banning anyone who is required to commit such acts of violence. OHM hasn't, sadly. Rather, suggestions of such have been looked at as laughable, much to the surprise of many. > I find it really hard to pass judgement on OHM > organizers when our own ecosystem is so unbelievably toxic. > I don't pass judgment on OHM orga independent of the US ecosystem. I pass judgment specifically because of the dialog and those very same people saying that they're not the US ecosystem. Yet we know very well that AiVD now says that they use PRISM data - talk about a distinction without a difference! > I guess it's different when the cops are Dutch. > The Dutch police have FBI agents embedded in their offices. AiVD shares data with the NSA and vice versa. The difference is that many nationalists in the Dutch hacker scene don't see that any scenes with such ties is possibly toxic; differently toxic but certainly subserviently! To compare the Dutch legal system to the US in light of the PRISM scandal makes it all the more ridiculous. All the best, Jacob P.S. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjMLZuuXDRQ -- Too many emails? Unsubscribe, change to digest, or change password by emailing moderator at [email protected] or changing your settings at https://mailman.stanford.edu/mailman/listinfo/liberationtech
