Arnold Trembley wrote: >--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], "Eric S. Harris" ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > >>[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >> >> >> >>>From: James Stevenson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> (snip, hoping the level of quotation is correct...) >>> >>> >>>>http://www.reformthelp.org/party/pledge/positive.php >>>> >>>>Snippet: >>>>A Better Pledge >>>> >>>>"I believe force should only be used to protect life, liberty and >>>>property from attack." >>>>(more snippage) >>>>It should be acceptable to all "flavors" of Libertarians. It >>>> >>>> >doesn't forbid tax-supported limited government. It's much easier to >remember. > > >>>>(more snippage) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>I like it too. Although ANY tax is an infringement of the rights >>> >>> >of liberty and property. > > >>> >>> >>> >>> > >And this last quote from Mr. Harris: > > > >>Which means that this new oath would prohibit all taxation. >> >> > >I do not see that interpretation at all, unless you define any >taxation as an "attack on life, liberty, or property". > > I suspect you and I are not the only ones who would find ourselves in disagreement over what it means, regarding taxation.
I'd explain in detail why, but that would be a waste of time. Instead, I'll just say that collecting taxes requires attacking people's lives, liberty or property, or making credible threats of attack. If that doesn't explain why I think so, further discussion probably wouldn't, either. (Understanding why I think so is not the same as getting you to agree with me. I can have a position you think is wrong, but you can understand why I believe it.) >As it is worded above, the "new" oath appears to me as a statement of >religious faith rather than political or philosophical principles. > >I suppose it might be less bad than the current oath/pledge, but why >bother? > > Exactly. In a way, it's like a libertarian trying to reform the government's schools: if it shouldn't exist, what's the point in working to make it more efficient or less abusive? Abolitionists and their less extreme anti-slavery brethren didn't work to make slavery nicer, they worked to end it, or at least end its spread into the territories (which would ultimately have ended it). And were considerably more successful than the LP has been at shrinking government to the minimum (by anyone's definition of "minimum"). >In case it's not clear, I am opposed to any oath as a requirement for >membership in the Libertarian Party (even though I signed it many >years ago without considering it thoroughly). Attempting to fix the >oath does not help make the LP competitive with the two major >political parties. > >I would vote to abolish the oath requirement, but who will let me? > > If you're a delegate, you could bring up a motion at the national convention. Or you could ask your rep on the LNC for an interim measure, like formally announcing which (if any) of the conflicting interpretations is the correct one. That at least makes "the elephant in the living room" visible. It also has the effect of telling some people in the LP (either minarchists or dogmatic anarchists, depending on what interpretation is announced) the LP isn't the political party for them after all, which is perhaps why the LNC and the national conventions have not done so. Both somewhat difficult to do, successfully. Here's something that's easy and will work right away, based on the advice: "When you find yourself in a hole, the first thing to do is stop digging." Don't renew your national LP membership. Maybe tell them why. With the end of membership dues, that doesn't have the impact it used to, but you can indicate your plans to withhold donations for ballot access and such. -Eric -- Eric S. Harris If this address ever fails, try visiting http://www.returnpath.net ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Yahoo! Groups gets a make over. See the new email design. http://us.click.yahoo.com/2HUd1C/lOaOAA/cUmLAA/KlSolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> ForumWebSiteAt http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Libertarian Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Libertarian/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
