Just to be clear - libertarians don't support stealing anyone's money at the point of a gun - whether by common thieves or by governments - and using it for any purpose - "good" or "bad".
Go here: http://www.free-market.net/resources/introduction.html ; watch the video; learn a little something about libertarianism; then come back here and engage in a meaningful discussion about how to help the Utes at White Mesa to improve their lives. --- In [email protected], "John Stroebel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > I thought of you all as I was readying this post for a few other groups. > I thought of the reaction I got over the federal gov't paying an agreed > sum (adding up to a pittance) to the Ute people for a contract (treaty) > signed in the 20's. Man. Some folks really got them panties in a twist > over having to be 'indebted' for THAT deal! ;-) > > Well, I saw THIS little charm....so why is it that, I wondered, that > these Libertarians aren't cryin' a river over an estimated 500 BILLION > DOLLARS cost for these lil' occupations the government is carrying out > in our name? > > Ute easier pickins???? > > ahemmm....the post. ;-) > > THREE LIL' LIES WE ALL SWALLOWED > > hmmm...while I am still wondering, what IS this course we are staying??? > > The estimated costs for this useless, needless, obscene war of > aggression in Iraq and Afghanistan by 2007...500 Billion. Wanna see it > in digits? $500,000,000,000. > > But I digress....this is an excellent article about three wonderful > myths we Americans have fallen for....WMD, Zarqawi and Iraqi > sovereignty. enjoy! ;-) > > (did I say myths? Why of course I meant bald faced lies. Bush's pants on > fire.) > Cost of wars in Afghanistan & Iraq 2 top $500 BILLION in 2007 Three > Iraq Myths That Won't Quit > > By Scott Ritter > http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article13764.htm > <http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article13764.htm> 06/26/06 > "AlterNet" -- -- It is hard sometimes to know what is real and what is > fiction when it comes to the news out of Iraq. America is in its "silly > season," the summer months leading up to a national election, and the > media is going full speed ahead in exploiting its primacy in the news > arena by substituting responsible reporting with headline-grabbing > entertainment. So, as America closes in on the end of June and the > celebration of the 230th year of our nation's birth, I thought I would > pen a short primer on three myths on Iraq to keep an eye out for as we > "debate" the various issues pertaining to our third year of war in that > country. The myth of sovereignty Imagine the president of the United > States flying to Russia, China, England, France or just about any other > nation on the planet, landing at an airport on supposedly sovereign > territory, being driven under heavy U.S. military protection to the > U.S. Embassy, and then with some five minutes notification, summoning > the highest elected official of that nation to the U.S. Embassy for a > meeting. It would never happen, unless of course the nation in question > is Iraq, where Iraqi sovereignty continues to be hyped as a reality when > in fact it is as fictitious as any fairy tale ever penned by the > Brothers Grimm. For all of the talk of a free Iraq, the fact is Iraq > remains very much an occupied nation where the United States (and its > ever decreasing "coalition of the willing") gets to call all the shots. > Iraqi military policy is made by the United States. Its borders are > controlled by the United States. Its economy is controlled largely by > the United States. In fact, there simply isn't a single major indicator > of actual sovereignty in Iraq today that can be said to be free of > overwhelming American control. Iraqi ministers continue to be shot at by > coalition forces, and Iraqi police are powerless to investigate criminal > activities carried out by American troops (or their mercenary > counterparts, the so-called "Private Military Contractors"). The reality > of this myth is that the timeline for the departure of American troops > from Iraq is being debated (and decided) in Washington, D.C., not > Baghdad. Of course, as with everything in Iraq, the final vote will be > made by the people of Iraq. But these votes will be cast in bullets, not > ballots, and will bring with them not only the departure of American > troops from Iraq, but also the demise of any Iraqi government foolish > enough to align itself with a nation that violates international law by > planning and waging an illegal war of aggression, and continues to > conduct an increasingly brutal (and equally illegitimate) occupation. > The myth of Zarqawi I have said all along that the poll figures showing > Americans to be overwhelmingly against the war in Iraq were illusory. > Only 28 percent of Americans were against the war when we invaded Iraq. > The ranks have swelled to over 60 percent not because there has been an > awakening of social conscience and responsibility, but rather because > things aren't going well in Iraq, and there is increasing angst in the > American heartland because we seem to be losing the war in Iraq, and no > one likes a loser. So when the word came that the notorious terrorist, > Abu Musab Al-Zarqawi, was killed by American military action, the > president suddenly had a "good week," and poll numbers adjusted slightly > in his favor. However, the facts cannot be re-written, even by a > slavish American mainstream media. Zarqawi was never anything more than > a minor player in Iraq, a third-rate Jordanian criminal whose exploits > were hyped up by a Bush administration anxious to prove that the > insurgency that was getting the best of America in Iraq was > foreign-grown and linked to the perpetrators of the 9/11 terror attacks > nonetheless. The reality of just how wrong such an assessment is (and > was) has been pounded home in blood. Since Zarqawi's death, the violence > has continued to spiral out of control in Iraq, with Americans > continuing to die, Iraqis still being slaughtered, and Zarqawi and his > organization, successor and all, still as irrelevant to reality as ever. > The war against the American occupation in Iraq is being fought > overwhelmingly by Iraqis. The insurgency is growing and becoming > stronger and more organized by the day. This, of course, is a reality > that the Bush administration cannot afford to have the American people > know about in an election year, as a compliant media, having sold its > soul to the devil in hyping of the virtues of an invasion of Iraq back > in 2002-2003, continues to dance with the party that brought them by > supporting the Republican position, by and large, that the conflict in > Iraq is a winnable one for America. Good ratings, more dead Americans > (and Iraqis, but who is counting?) and a war that will never end until > the United States finally slinks out, defeated, its tail tucked firmly > between its legs. The myth of WMD Regardless of what Sen. Rick > Santorum and the lunatic neoconservative fringe want to think, no > weapons of mass destruction have been found in Iraq. Citing a classified > Department of Defense report that claims some 500 artillery shells have > been found in Iraq by U.S. forces since the invasion and subsequent > occupation of Iraq in March 2003, Santorum and his cronies in the > right-wing media have been spouting nonsense about how Bush got it right > all along, that there were WMD in Iraq after all. He conveniently fails > to report that there is nothing "secret" about this data, it has all > been reported before (by the Bush administration, nonetheless), and that > the shells in question constitute old artillery munitions manufactured > well prior to 1991 (the year of the first Gulf War, and a time after > which the government of Saddam Hussein stated -- correctly, it turned > out that no WMD were produced in Iraq). The degraded sarin nerve agent > and mustard blister agent contained in the discovered munitions had long > since lost their viability, and as such represented no threat > whatsoever. Furthermore, the haphazard way in which they were > "discovered" (lying about the ground, as opposed to carefully stored > away) only reinforces the Iraqi government's past claims that many > chemical munitions were scattered about the desert countryside in remote > areas following U.S. bombing attacks on the ammunition storage depots > during the first Gulf War. Having personally inspected scores of these > bombed-out depots, I can vouch for the veracity of the past Iraqi > claims, as well as the absurdity of the claims made today by Santorum > and others, who continue to hold personal political gain as being worth > more than the blood of over 2,500 dead Americans. These three myths -- > WMD, Zarqawi and Iraqi sovereignty -- are what members of Congress > should be debating in their halls of power, the American media should be > discussing either in print or across the airwaves, and that discussion > should constitute the foundation of a movement towards accountability, > where the citizens of the United States finally point an accusatory > finger at those whom they elected to represent them in higher office, > and who have failed in almost every regard when it comes to Iraq. But > then again, silly me for thinking this way, believing that there was an > engaged constituency within America that knows and understands the > Constitution of the United States and seeks to live each day as a true > citizen empowered by the ideal and values set forth by that document. I > had overlooked the Fourth Myth -- that American citizens are engaged in > our national debate. Scott Ritter served as chief U.N. weapons > inspector in Iraq from 1991 until his resignation in 1998. He is the > author of, most recently, " Iraq Confidential: The Untold Story of the > Intelligence Conspiracy to Undermine the U.N. and Overthrow Saddam > Hussein <http://alternet.bookswelike.net/isbn/1560258527> " (Nation > Books, 2005 > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> See what's inside the new Yahoo! 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