On Mon, May 14, 2012 at 12:42 PM, Michał 'rysiek' Woźniak <[email protected]>wrote:
> Dnia poniedziałek, 14 maja 2012 o 13:05:05 Ramana Kumar napisał(a): > > On Mon, May 14, 2012 at 11:16 AM, Michał 'rysiek' Woźniak > > (...) > > > > > We need something like this for Free Somftware based services, as > > > currently we are all taking a beating due to network effect (look > > > at Twitter, Facebook, Skype, Dropbox - it's all network effect > > > at work). And we cannot tackle network effect if we do not build > > > a vast network of users. > > > > Can you describe ways in which we might do this in more detail? > > Perhaps we can figure out a good solution here and then do it! > > Be concrete, perhaps using my "skype replacement" problem as a > > motivating example. > > Sure thing. I did it already (partially) in the "New GNU" thread (by > the way, where are the list archives?..), I'll try to do a better job > here, though. > > We could create a *simple* directory protocol (no, LDAP won't do) for > finding out people's e-mails, JIDs, etc (if, of course, those people > would provide such data); integrate it into available solutions > (client-side: Pidgin, mail clients, Diaspora, etc.; server-side: > ejabberd, mail servers, Diaspora, etc.) - when providing profile data > (like e-mail addr) users could select to make that info available for > federated access by other servers and clients. > Are there any existing directory protocols that would serve this purpose? What's wrong with LDAP? (It has the advantage of being already standard.) Are we reinventing FNS (XFN)? If a new simple protocol is required, let's make a short spec of it here and now! Michał, I hope you will oblige to start on that, or otherwise explain a bit more what you mean. > We could create a website for "leave your proprietary network/service > day", hold such a day say once per two months. People could log-in > with their proprietary network logins (Facebook/Twitter/Google+) and > pledge leaving the network for a libre one (like Diaspora) or at least > setting up an account on a libre network on a given day, or when the > number of their friends pledging the same reaches a given number. > LibrePlanet, is there anyone here, or do you know of anyone, who would be able and willing to design this website? Also, to host it? I am willing to pay for domain registration and hosting if nobody else volunteers, or no organisation can donate it, if there is a good design. (Of course, donations would be welcome to help spread the cost!) > This would obviously be sent to their walls, timelines or whatever > it's called in their proprietary social network of choice. their > friends would get the message and see that maybe they are not alone in > their idea of leaving Facebook. > > This is obviously just a preliminary idea, it would need to be > properly thought through and blueprinted. > I thank you for taking the time to sketch the preliminary idea! It sounds great. I suggest we keep working out the details on list. > Second idea that I might start realising soon myself is firing up > cloud service providers that integrate many libre software services > (like XMPP, e-mail, Diaspora, StatusNet, OpenID, Mozilla Sync, > ownCloud, etc.) so that people would have a chance of using a *single* > service for all their communication needs, while retaining control > over their data (using standard, free software projects would mean > switching the provider would be much easier than leaving Facebook). > > These two ideas should for obvious reasons be put into practice about > the same time. > Yes. Michał, would you be interested in making a prototype of such a service with me? > > Describe the world where I find out Skype is nonfree and then [go > > where] ([why there?]) and [do what] to get a free replacement, > > that anyone can easily do. > > http://podupti.me is just such a place to go for "Facebook > replacement". It needs better exposure, and much better information > on-site, but it's the right idea. > Presumably it can be advertised on that website for "leave proprietary network day". What about for Skype replacement? > Problem is, in my opinion, that we need to refocus. > > We - the FLOSS Community - are by and large great technicians, > programmers, we have the manpower and will to tackle *technical* > issues. > > However, our problems currently are not purely technical; Free > Software is often technically superior to proprietary/centralised > solutions, yet users still use the proprietary platforms (ICQ/AIM > being one of the examples). > > Why? Reasons are many. Sometimes it's the usability (like with Skype); > sometimes it's the network effect - already vast amounts of users use > the proprietary solution, so the incentive to use it is much stronger, > as the aim is to keep in touch (Skype, Facebook, ICQ/AIM, etc.). > Excellent point. > These two problems are not easy to solve for us, as we are not that > competent in those areas. Especially usability would need new sort of > people joining in and helping out - UX designers and the like. This is > one of the reasons why I feel that while many things Canonical does > are really bad (please, let's not get into a "Ubuntu is Evuhl" flame > now, m'kay? ;) ), we are still - as a community - getting a lot of > good stuff from the fact they are employing UX designers, for example. > One method might be to spread the ideal of freedom in the Ubuntu community, to leverage the existing talent there. This might essentially be: promote gNewSense over Ubuntu. But it might be more than that. > Now, the network effect thing is more "tackleable" by us. It's really > a question of focusing on creating ways for people to feel that they > are in a group. they are connected, easy ways to find other people, > etc. Diaspora, as I wrote already, does it well. We should simply move > this up on our priority list, so that our techie community would find > that important to work on. > > Specifically, I strongly believe that tackling the network effect > problem is more important than Gnash, Google Earth, FLOSS network > router drivers. I think it should (after finding a suitable way of > describing it) make it to the priority projects list. > FSF, your response? > P.S. > I strongly believe that centralisation (of data, of communication > means, etc.) is as big of a problem as something being proprietary - > because both are related to control. When fighting for Free Software > we need to fight for decentralisation, too. > Yes, I agree. Just highlighting this in case it got missed by other people reading.
