Linux-Advocacy Digest #653, Volume #29 Sat, 14 Oct 00 13:13:03 EDT
Contents:
Re: Because programmers hate users (Re: Why are Linux UIs so crappy?) (The Ghost In
The Machine)
Re: Linux Out perfoms Windows (The Ghost In The Machine)
Re: Microsoft kicked off the Web! (The Ghost In The Machine)
Re: Why does Linux have to be such a pain to install? - A speech ("MH")
Re: Need expert for info on troubleshooting Linux (The Ghost In The Machine)
Re: Need expert for info on troubleshooting Linux (The Ghost In The Machine)
Re: Because programmers hate users (Re: Why are Linux UIs so crappy?) (T. Max Devlin)
Re: How low can they go...? (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Need expert for info on troubleshooting Linux ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Why is MS copying Sun??? (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Why does Linux have to be such a pain to install? - A speech
([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Microsoft kicked off the Web! (Pan)
Re: Why is MS copying Sun??? (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Why is MS copying Sun??? (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Why is MS copying Sun??? (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Why does Linux have to be such a pain to install? - A speech (Pan)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Subject: Re: Because programmers hate users (Re: Why are Linux UIs so crappy?)
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 15:58:19 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Richard
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Sat, 14 Oct 2000 12:19:09 GMT
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>Roberto Alsina wrote:
>> El vie, 13 oct 2000, Richard escribi�:
>> >"Donal K. Fellows" wrote:
>> >> In Java primitive types are objects, but instances of those types are
>> >> not objects. Lose one point for lack of reading comprehension.
>> >
>> >This, of course, is total bullshit.
>> >
>> >1) primitive types are not objects. What the class are they
>> > supposed to be of anyways?
>>
>> Erm....
>>
>> "I don't believe classes should exist in the system at all.
>> New objects should be created by copying prototypes." Richard.
(I have no idea what Richard means by this.)
>>
>> Consider classes to be objects that don't belong to a class.
>
>You don't know what the hell you're talking about Roberto. For one thing,
>you betray an astonishing ignorance of what "object" means.
Besides, java.lang.Class has a class instance of its own.
Appropriately enough, its name is "java.lang.Class". :-)
Even int has a class...named "int". Can't find it using
Class.forName("int"), though; one has to use Integer.TYPE.
And Integer.TYPE.newInstance() throws an InstantiationException.
(It's a wart on an otherwise fine language.)
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Subject: Re: Linux Out perfoms Windows
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 16:06:05 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Goldhammer
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Sat, 14 Oct 2000 08:42:17 GMT
<sks8s8.ep2.ln@localhost>:
>On Thu, 12 Oct 2000 07:50:52 GMT, Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>wrote:
>>And LinuxTrolls complained about my generalisation "Linux lags behind
>
>
>>same speed. Running POVray on Linux without X compared to Windows
>>revealed Windows was faster. All done on the same hardware.
>>
>
>
>Try running the SETI@home client for windows, and the one for
>Linux. Run them on the same dual-boot machine. Compare the results.
>I've tried this on several machines. The Windows command-line client
>runs consistently 20%-30% slower. Why? Compiler differences?
My understanding is that part of the reason the Windows client is
slower is that the Windows client loves to play "update the display",
which saps CPU resource. The Linux client doesn't bother.
Is there a method for disabling this on the Windows version?
I'm curious.
(An alternative test might be to run www.distributed.net's clients
for cracking RC5-64. Slightly different problem, same techniques though,
and I don't think the Windows client tries to entertain its viewers. :-) )
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Subject: Re: Microsoft kicked off the Web!
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 16:08:28 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, R.E.Ballard ( Rex Ballard )
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Sat, 14 Oct 2000 07:02:58 GMT
<8s90f2$37u$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> Charlie Ebert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Microsoft has such a small grip on the WEB you could functionally
>> declare their bid for the market over.
>>
>> I think they just keep it open to say they have one.
>
>Two things happening here. Microsoft is getting a smaller and smaller
>share of the server market (but still growing slightly), but they are
>targeting strategic servers, such as the front-end web server.
A random question from the peanut gallery -- what the hell is
a "front-end Web server"?
(Is this Microsoft Marketing speak again? :-) )
[snipped rest of the good news for Linux :-) ]
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
------------------------------
From: "MH" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why does Linux have to be such a pain to install? - A speech
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 12:14:08 -0400
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:8s8kh3$rc7$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> I've been reading all these messages around the internet about how
> easily people have been setting up their Linux distributions. I'm here
> to tell you that it is in fact, not easy at all to setup a Linux
> distribution onto an older machine.....
I have just the opposite experience. I've setup Linux on a number of
occasions and have had minimal problems with the install. My gripes come
after the install. I really think it boils down to one glaring problem.
Linux has no decent web browser. When I'm logged onto Linux, I'm running a
KDE desktop with two or three xterms open compiling with gcc and trying my
hand with bash scripting.
I make use of the KDE editors for various writings, and use Kmail for email.
But when I venture out onto the internet I'm stuck with a third rate browser
which I can't stand.
Linux will never win the hearts of desktop computer users until this issue
is resolved. I hope Mozilla can accomplish this task, but quite frankly I'm
a little tired of waiting for it. If I had the juice on my PC -- and the $$
I would consider VMware to run windows on another desktop for just that
purpose. But then think about it. I can run my old copy of Borland Turbo C++
for DOS, surf the net with I.E., play around with VB and Delphi, play any
game on the market, run office for my writing and financial needs, so on and
so on. Why drop the $$ on a program like VMware just to have this on another
desktop in Linux? It makes no sense to me at all.
Give me a decent browser and Kylix. Then throw on Corel's suite for Linux
and were talking. Until the browser is on par with MS's offering Linux will
always be relegated to the back burner on most people's desktop. Just MHO.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Subject: Re: Need expert for info on troubleshooting Linux
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 16:14:27 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Fri, 13 Oct 2000 23:23:16 GMT
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>Linux in and of itself is an experiment in progress fostered on the
>public. It is a semi-ready for prime time pile of junk masquerading as
>an alternative to Windows and nothing could be farther from the truth.
[1] I will admit Linux is an experiment (Linus presumably didn't know
what he was getting into when he initially released it! :-) )
but who is fostering it?
[2] It is an alternative. So is DOS. So is Solaris. In fact,
Windows itself is an alternative to Unix, as well; Microsoft has
been attempting to position NT as the Unix Killer for some time.
(It hasn't been entirely successful.)
[3] I will gently suggest that the "prime time pile of junk masquerading"
is Windows itself.
>
>If you're a geek running a server farm go and try it. If you are
>looking for a desktop alternative to Windows, look elsewhere (Mac
>would be a good choice).
A Mac would make a fine desktop, in some locales. With a backend
web server doing the heavy lifting, all it might have to do is
browse.
Of course, Windows could do that too. So can Linux.
Whatever works.
[rest snipped]
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Subject: Re: Need expert for info on troubleshooting Linux
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 16:17:42 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Nigel Feltham
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Sat, 14 Oct 2000 13:08:55 +0100
<8s9ine$jkhe8$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>>Of course, many people treat x.0 versions of all software with a little
>>waryness.
>
>
>I agree with this, especially windows 95.0 , 98.0 , ME.0, NT4.0 and 2000.
>Windows 3.1 wasn't so bad though.
It did come after Windows 3.0, though. :-)
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Because programmers hate users (Re: Why are Linux UIs so crappy?)
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 12:22:28 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Richard in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>"Donal K. Fellows" wrote:
>[...]C++ doesn't deliver the advances that Smalltalk showcased
>and it doesn't deliver any of the productivity/reusability/comprehension
>increases that Smalltalk demonstated either, the very advances promised
>by "Object Orientation". Just why the fuck should anyone call it OO? Why
>is that a meaningful use of the language instead of an abuse of it ???
Because it is accurate, since people mean to indicate it is possible to
implement objects in C++, it is consistent, since being object
*oriented* is not a hard-and-fast indication of any particular level of
completeness in its use of objects, and it is practical because, despite
your presumptions on the matter, paradigms are not the same as
frameworks, and whether something is *object oriented* is a judgement
call and a convenience of approach, not an acid test based on any one
particular mechanism.
Object oriented means 'oriented towards objects', not 'entirely
consisting exclusively of objects'. Your presumptions are not a
meaningful use of the language, but merely an abuse of it, inspired to
promote your condescending and apparently somewhat disfunctionally
elitist attitude.
>You can have any conception of OO you like. But in the end, does it
>deliver on its (implicit and explicit) promises and people's expectations
>of it ? Does it make any sense to call Yak meat "beef" if people spit
>it out after tasting it ??
I would say it is your 'product' analogies that don't make sense. What
makes meat 'beef' is not whether people spit it out, but whether it
comes from a steer or cow. What makes something object oriented is
whether it allows an object oriented programming style, and nothing
more. Some languages (Smalltalk) do so more completely than others, but
its merely pedantic posturing to try to make an argument out of it. I
don't think anyone would bother even trying to refute a claim that
Smalltalk is more object oriented than C++ is. But to say that the
*results* of Smalltalk programming are 'OO', and the results of C++
programming cannot be, is just silly and pointless.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
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------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: How low can they go...?
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 12:23:23 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said JS/PL in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> Said JS/PL in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>> >"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> >> >> No.
>> >> >
>> >> >Then shut up until you can provide proof.
>> >>
>> >> No.
>> >
>> >Then you maintain no credibility as usual.
>>
>> Maybe in your opinion.
>
>No, no opinion is necessary, it is the result of the equation.
>
>Absurd statement + Refusal to provide a shred of proof = no credibility.
>
>I feel sorry for you.
Your opinion is noted, and duly ignored as lacking any value, without
even the necessity to examine its credibility, which would scarcely be
any higher. I am amused by you.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
======USENET VIRUS=======COPY THE URL BELOW TO YOUR SIG==============
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------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Need expert for info on troubleshooting Linux
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 16:22:22 GMT
I was pissed off when I posted that message. UPS lost a package for
the 3rd time this month and a client is not very happy about it and
neither am I.
Thank you for a civil and corrective reply to my somewhat uncivil
post.
For the record I retract what I said about Linux being junk and being
fostered on the public I don't really believe that at all.
Like you said, Linux is an alternative along with the other OS's.
Sorry for the stupid post :(
claire
On Sat, 14 Oct 2000 16:14:27 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The
Ghost In The Machine) wrote:
>In comp.os.linux.advocacy, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote
>on Fri, 13 Oct 2000 23:23:16 GMT
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>>Linux in and of itself is an experiment in progress fostered on the
>>public. It is a semi-ready for prime time pile of junk masquerading as
>>an alternative to Windows and nothing could be farther from the truth.
>
>[1] I will admit Linux is an experiment (Linus presumably didn't know
> what he was getting into when he initially released it! :-) )
> but who is fostering it?
>
>[2] It is an alternative. So is DOS. So is Solaris. In fact,
> Windows itself is an alternative to Unix, as well; Microsoft has
> been attempting to position NT as the Unix Killer for some time.
> (It hasn't been entirely successful.)
>
>[3] I will gently suggest that the "prime time pile of junk masquerading"
> is Windows itself.
>
>>
>>If you're a geek running a server farm go and try it. If you are
>>looking for a desktop alternative to Windows, look elsewhere (Mac
>>would be a good choice).
>
>A Mac would make a fine desktop, in some locales. With a backend
>web server doing the heavy lifting, all it might have to do is
>browse.
>
>Of course, Windows could do that too. So can Linux.
>
>Whatever works.
>
>[rest snipped]
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.lang.java.advocacy
Subject: Re: Why is MS copying Sun???
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 12:25:59 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Simon Cooke in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> Said Simon Cooke in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>> >
>> >"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> >Which apps are those, Max? You declined to mention any.
>>
>> No, I didn't 'decline' to mention any until someone asked. I didn't
>> mention any, because I'm not interested in wasting time arguing with
>> people who are stupid enough to pretend that there are no such things.
>>
>> Thanks for your time. Hope it helps.
>
>Max Devlin is a crossdresser with a penchant for Chanel No'5!!! I had proof,
>but I left in in my other pants because I'm not interested in wasting time
>arguing with people who are stupid enough to pretend that he's not. Besides,
>if I don't give you anything to work with, you can't disprove my claim.
>
>So, from now on, let's call Max his stage name -- "Michelle", and we'll all
>live happily ever after.
Wow, Simon. You sure are trying real hard to prove how entirely lacking
in credibility your statements are. It would appear that you're trying
to prove some point; perhaps you're trying to bait me into insisting
that you are engaging in slander or libel. Or perhaps you're pretending
to make a point that claims need support in order to be believed.
You're doing quite well at illustrating the difference between a
ludicrous claim, and a reasonable one, though, so feel free to continue.
Its quite entertaining.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
======USENET VIRUS=======COPY THE URL BELOW TO YOUR SIG==============
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------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Why does Linux have to be such a pain to install? - A speech
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 16:25:04 GMT
I agree and have said in the past, Linux install is very easy with a
modern distro (except Corel, unless your hardware is fully supported
by it) and a decent set of hardware.
It's far superior to Windows in that regard.
The fun begins after the install, and you have made those points
rather well.
claire
On Sat, 14 Oct 2000 12:14:08 -0400, "MH" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:8s8kh3$rc7$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> I've been reading all these messages around the internet about how
>> easily people have been setting up their Linux distributions. I'm here
>> to tell you that it is in fact, not easy at all to setup a Linux
>> distribution onto an older machine.....
>
>I have just the opposite experience. I've setup Linux on a number of
>occasions and have had minimal problems with the install. My gripes come
>after the install. I really think it boils down to one glaring problem.
>Linux has no decent web browser. When I'm logged onto Linux, I'm running a
>KDE desktop with two or three xterms open compiling with gcc and trying my
>hand with bash scripting.
>I make use of the KDE editors for various writings, and use Kmail for email.
>But when I venture out onto the internet I'm stuck with a third rate browser
>which I can't stand.
>
>Linux will never win the hearts of desktop computer users until this issue
>is resolved. I hope Mozilla can accomplish this task, but quite frankly I'm
>a little tired of waiting for it. If I had the juice on my PC -- and the $$
>I would consider VMware to run windows on another desktop for just that
>purpose. But then think about it. I can run my old copy of Borland Turbo C++
>for DOS, surf the net with I.E., play around with VB and Delphi, play any
>game on the market, run office for my writing and financial needs, so on and
>so on. Why drop the $$ on a program like VMware just to have this on another
>desktop in Linux? It makes no sense to me at all.
>
>Give me a decent browser and Kylix. Then throw on Corel's suite for Linux
>and were talking. Until the browser is on par with MS's offering Linux will
>always be relegated to the back burner on most people's desktop. Just MHO.
>
------------------------------
From: Pan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Microsoft kicked off the Web!
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 09:31:30 -0700
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
"R.E.Ballard ( Rex Ballard )" wrote:
> Actually, between Linux and BSD (FreeBSD, NetBSD, and OpenBSD), these
> two pretty much dominated the market. Sun's Solaris got the bulk of
> the Big Ticket Revenue, and IBM and HP were behind Microsoft. Of
> course, this year, both HP and IBM are offering Linux on everything
> from their micro-laptops to their top-line mainframes.
> Linux on S/390, seems to already have a market.
>From my experience on IBM midrange systems, a fairly significant chunk
of the market for Linux is for installations on old hardware. The idea
being that the IT manager for a company that spent $200,000 on a
mainframe 3 years ago that today has less processing power than a
desktop PC and can't support IBM's latest OS release installs linux on
the antiquated box and adds another 3 years to the system's life, thus
increasing ROI.
That's a pretty good use, IMHO, even holding aside the fact that Linux
is simply a better os with a better suite of tools and requiring less
overhead than IBM's proprietary counterparts.
--
Pan
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.la-online.com
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.lang.java.advocacy
Subject: Re: Why is MS copying Sun???
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 12:31:22 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Matt Kennel in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>On Fri, 13 Oct 2000 21:44:45 -0400, T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
[...]
>:>Still quoting from MS:
>:>> Microsoft does not test Windows on anything other than Microsoft's MS-DOS.
>:>> We don't have the development or testing resources, nor do we consider it
>:>> our job to test Windows on other systems.
>:
>:So just *what* the fuck is up with that? How could *anybody* be so
>:moronic as to not recognize this as a monopoly acting
>:anti-competitively?
>
>It's the ideological difference between laissez-faire and free markets.
>
>Basically, one particular social-political-economic class uses the
>arguments and success of the latter in order to justify policy
>which is actually more consistent with the former, peculiarly benefitting
>this class.
A very compelling argument, I must say.
>The problem is that very few people are sufficiently educated enough
>to know the difference and see it in practice, and the power of the
>arguments that confound them into the same thing---rather like
>Internet Explorer The Application and Internet Explorer The
>Programming Libraries---is impressive.
Indeed.
>Ironically, those indoctrinated/educated under a Communist system are
>more likely to understand this. One of Marx's famous "contradictions
>of capitalism" is the observation that the success of free markets
>depend on the vigorous pursuit of profit but that the pursuit of
>profit is inherently linked to the pursuit of the destruction of free
>competition in the market. He was hardly original {Adam Smith wrote
>about it extensively} but he got better PR.
I would have to argue this point. I don't believe that there is any
such paradox; the pursuit of profits is not inherently linked to the
pursuit of the destruction of free competition. It is an obvious
temptation, of course, but then, just about any benefit can be a
temptation to act unethically, if unethical pursuit of the benefit is
tolerated.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
======USENET VIRUS=======COPY THE URL BELOW TO YOUR SIG==============
Sign the petition and keep Deja's archive alive!
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------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.lang.java.advocacy
Subject: Re: Why is MS copying Sun???
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 12:34:42 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Simon Cooke in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> The bizarre part is that I can't for the life of me figure out where
>> anyone got the idea that a vendor *isn't* actually *supposed* to try to
>> make their product compatible with everybody else's, regardless of their
>> market share.
>
>Up to a point, it's counter productive to do so. Why would anyone do so if
>it costs more?
Because it increases the value of their product and broadens their
potential customer base to include the customers of their competitor's
products, obviously.
>If people will pay for that compatibility, then software will
>get written that's compatible.
Which is to say that if software is written that's compatible, people
will pay for it. Thus, writing compatible software has a economic
advantage over writing incompatible software. It is only in the
monopolistic strategy that this does not hold true.
> If it's not an issue -- that is, it's not
>something that will sell more of the product, then it won't get put in.
>Simple economics.
You mean simple retroactive justification of anti-competitive
strategies, I think. Why wouldn't compatibility be something that will
sell more of the product, as it always has been in the past and
continues to be very valuable, even despite the criminal prevention of
free markets which the monopoly entails.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
======USENET VIRUS=======COPY THE URL BELOW TO YOUR SIG==============
Sign the petition and keep Deja's archive alive!
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------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.lang.java.advocacy
Subject: Re: Why is MS copying Sun???
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 12:37:56 -0400
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Simon Cooke in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>
>"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> Said Simon Cooke in comp.os.linux.advocacy;
>> >"Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> >> "T. Max Devlin" wrote:
>> >> > Weevil. He is either dishonest, or just not very bright.
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> Simon is Dishonest.
>>
>> I figured, but thought I'd give him the benefit of the doubt.
>>
>> >And the two of you are raving homophobic criminals, with a history of
>> >wife-beating, and a sideorder of shit for brains.
>>
>> Wow. I guess Aaron struck a nerve. So much for the benefit of the
>> doubt.
>
>So let's see... you call me dishonest, and because that "strikes a nerve",
>you're *RIGHT*?
If merely calling you dishonest leads to an excessively emotional and
vehement response, then it decreases the objective value of giving you
the benefit of the doubt. I did not say that he was right.
>That's the biggest load of bullshit I've ever heard in my life.
Again, I would expect that you are merely indicating a lack of rigor in
your statements, that is, being mistaken, rather than being dishonest.
I'm sure there are far less meaningful statements you've heard in your
life.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
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------------------------------
From: Pan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why does Linux have to be such a pain to install? - A speech
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2000 09:39:09 -0700
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Arthur Frain wrote:
>
> kosh wrote:
>
> > > don't know why I've been doing this now, because I
> > > have tried over the last two months to get my RedHat 6.2 distribution
> > > setup on my older Compaq 133mHz machine.
>
> First off, RH 6.2 is several versions back.
I've got Mandrake 7.1 on a 60Mhz PB Pentium with 90mb RAM. It works
great. But I have had problems with the gui installer on an old low mem
laptop. Mandrake 6.1 or RedHat 5.x with the tui installer seem to be
the best bets for an old system with low memory ( 16mb or less )
In any case, Jay is full of sh@t. AFAICT, he's Yet another troll
claiming to be a linvocate while bashing an os that he has probably
never used.
--
Pan
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.la-online.com
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