Linux-Advocacy Digest #653, Volume #34 Sun, 20 May 01 18:13:07 EDT
Contents:
Re: Linux takes Hollywood by storm! (Peter Hayes)
Re: Linux beats Win2K (again) ("Gary Hallock")
Re: Things that annoy me in Mandrake Linux (kosh)
Re: Linux Advocacy - Wintroll Mission (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Rather humorous posting on news.com commentry forum: (Pete Goodwin)
The nature of competition (mlw)
Re: Mandrake 8 sets the standard - for Desktop users anyway. (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Mandrake 8 sets the standard - for Desktop users anyway. (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Dell Meets Estimates ("Matthew Gardiner")
Re: Linux beats Win2K (again) (Pete Goodwin)
Re: The nature of competition ("Erik Funkenbusch")
Re: Linux beats Win2K (again) (Pete Goodwin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Peter Hayes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux takes Hollywood by storm!
Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 22:42:33 +0100
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Fri, 18 May 2001 16:37:33 -0400, Glitch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> "." wrote:
> >
> > Mart van de Wege <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > In article <vY4N6.1434$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Erik Funkenbusch"
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > >> Well, it would be nice if you included the link.
> > >>
> > >> In any event, I can imagine that they might use linux for their custom
> > >> stuff, since they used to use SGI's (and probably still do), but I can't
> > >> imagine them converting their modeling stations and such that are using
> > >> common rendering software.
> > >>
>
> The article I posted says that Maya has been converted to Linux which
> means that even the modelling workstations the animators use are running
> Linux, along with the render farm in the back office. Houdini was also
> ported to Linux as well a while back.
>
>
> > >> "GreyCloud" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > >> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > >>>
> > >>> From ZDNET... looks like Linux has pre-empted Windows NT recently in
> > >>> Hollywood.
> > >>> Read the article and see for yourselves... LucasFilm ltd. has converted
> > >>> mostly to Linux!
> > >>> And a few other film producers as well. After all, they do want to cut
> > >>> costs.
> > >>>
> > >>> --
> > >>> V
> > >>
> > >>
> > > Well I haven't read the article yet, but there were a few Linux uses
> > > before in computer rendering and animation. Mostly Linux was used until
> > > now as the backend: ie a large cluster of Linux machines rendered the
> > > final result.
Titanic is the classic example.
> > > I believe the modelling is done on workstations running
> > > other software (perhaps, gasp! even NT).
> >
>
> true but a lot of companies are now using Maya on Linux (instead of Maya
> on NT) to model the movies and then use Linux again in the render farm.
>
> > Which is actually very common. Lots of companies (including ILM) use
> > NT workstations to run things like Lightwave and SoftImage. But they also
> > use macs, Linux, and IRIX, depending directly on circumstance and media.
And I believe Softimage has been ported to Linux. It was demoed at New
York's Linux World Expo running on a dual 1.2GHz AMD Athlon.
And Microsoft once owned Softimage.
There's also Houdini for Linux, plus Blender which is awesome considering
it's free and runs on many platforms.
> >
> > -----.
> >
> > --
> > "George Dubya Bush---the best presidency money can buy"
>
> maybe, but then again, George wasn't the one crying b/c he lost every
> single recount. Even now after 2 additional recounts Bush still pulls
> ahead......are u saying he is still paying liberal newspapers to put the
> results in his favor? even after he already won? Bush won what counts,
> the electoral votes. It has happened before that the President-elect
> lost the popular vote but no one ever said *that* was illegitimate.
Wasn't Kennedy elected under those circumstances?
Anyway, if your brother was State Govenor, your campaign manager ran the
count and your political allies had a majority on the Supreme Court
wouldn't you expect to win?
And let's not forget the fiddling of the voters roll in Democrat Counties.
>From this side of the Atlantic it looked pretty crooked, together with a
daft voting system relying on people pushing buttons hard enough to punch
holes in "chads". It also seemed that the candidate the majority wanted
was Bill Clinton, but constitutionally impossible.
Peter
------------------------------
From: "Gary Hallock" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux beats Win2K (again)
Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 17:46:53 +0000
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Pete
Goodwin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Yet the SETI and Intel websites claim this is the biggest supercomputer
> and quote figures of 10 TeraFlops.
>
I would hardly call the very loose coupling that SETI uses a
supercomputer. There are many problems that can not be solved without
much faster communcation between processors.
> As for where are the machines, why, nobody has written a distributed
> prediction package and aren't likely to write one for simulating nuclear
> weapons!
>
I mentioned simulation of nuclear weapons because that is what the
original goverment contract for ASCI white called for. Of course it can
be used to solve many problems. I wrote a logic simulator that runs on
an SP2 using POE and MPI. It requires high speed communication to obtain
decent performance and was used to test parts of ASCI white. I was
very tempted to see if I could get some time on ASCI white while it was
still on the test floor - it was physically closer to my office by a few
hundred feet than the SP2. Now that would have made an amazing logic
simulator! If I had tried to do the same thing with loosely coupled PCs,
any performance gain from the parallelism would have been eaten up by
the communication time.
Gary
------------------------------
From: kosh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Things that annoy me in Mandrake Linux
Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 15:40:15 -0600
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
David Steinberg wrote:
> Mig ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> : 1) If you change the security settings to "high security" only root can
> : play sound.
> : Fix: chmod a+w /dev/dsp
>
> : Now thats a stupid thing (or is it really??).
>
> It seems like high security to me. A good way would be to give it 0664
> permissions, make it owned by a group called something like "audio", and
> then just add the users whom you want to be able to play audio to that
> group.
>
> That's the way Debian does it.
>
> : Why is one not warned and has to waste long time on resolving this?
>
> If you ask me, it should tell you exactly what constitutes the various
> security levels. I hate it when vague terms like "high," "medium," and
> "low" are used without explanation.
>
> --
> David Steinberg -o)
> Computer Engineering Undergrad, UBC / \
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] _\_v
>
In both the online help and in the book it tells exactly what each level
means and does. The problem is many click on the item without reading any
documentation.
------------------------------
From: Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux Advocacy - Wintroll Mission
Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 21:51:42 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> Does Pete Goodwin, really think people who do the things, that
> he is unable to do, and on a daily basis, believe these claims?
> --------------------------------------------------------------
>
> It's a statement made frequently by Linux advocates.
It's a statement made _once_ by Linux advocates. Get your facts right
Charlie.
> Of course not. The WINTROLL'S mission is to muddy
> the water.
I'm not a WinTroll. I'm not here to muddy the water.
> The whole reason this person has made the statement
> is he can't believe Pete Goodwin continually posts
> messages about his troubles installing Linux.
I can't help it if others are in denial.
> Yet Pete Goodwin has also said repeatedly that
> Linux is a threat to his job as he writes
> drivers for Windows. He feels threatened.
I've never said that. I do not see Linux as a threat. I do not feel
threatened by Linux. You may desperately want delude yourself into
believing that, but you are dead wrong.
> Well some do it because they are like Pete Goodwin.
> They are fearfull of loosing their jobs working with
> Windows so they spend 100% of their spare time
> trashing Linux to help sway public opinion.
ROFL! You are incredible Charlie! My job is pretty secure (as any job
is nowadays) as people want the services I offer.
> And as an intelligent business person, what are
> you to say about all this activity? Why would
> these people spend all their time glued to
> COLA and MS newsgroups posting every 5 minutes
> on average to every message put there?????
Oh yeah, like I post every five minutes. I may post a batch of replies in
a short period of time, but then hours or days may post before I start
again. Keep on dreamin' baby!
> You have to be a total jackass to put your companies
> future in the hands of Microsoft.
Like yours is Charlie?
> And I'm still 100% in favor of firing any CEO who
> continues to invest their firms future in Microsoft.
Like yours does Charlie?
> And despite my comments and the comments of the WINTROLLS,
> Linux is still the #1 fastest growing Market sucess in
> the world. It's double that of Microsofts in 2000!
And yet Linux barely registers a blip on the biggest market for PC's. The
desktop market.
> For 4 years now, the #1 growth slot has been earned by
> Linux.
It is so slow to grab such a teeny-weeny slice of the market.
--
Pete
------------------------------
From: Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Rather humorous posting on news.com commentry forum:
Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 21:58:15 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> Most communists now a day's are too busy writing drivers for Windows.
Then you have very little to worry about - writing device drivers for 3D
audio on Windows is a very specialist and unique skill.
Not that I'm a communist, of course.
--
Pete
------------------------------
From: mlw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: The nature of competition
Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 17:58:36 -0400
I was talking with some guys at work. We were joking that we saved $100,000
on Microsoft licenses on our website. We used Linux, Apache, Postgres, php,
and perl across multiple boxes behind a load balancer.
I see a lot of talk on this forum about how Linux is marginally better or
W2K is marginally better, etc. From a price/performance perspective W2K has
to be A LOT better than linux to even tie, and we don't see this happening.
Linux is at least as fast, if not faster.
Linux has been proven to be more stable.
Linux has proven to be more secure.
Linux is free.
So, why would anyone choose a Microsoft solution?
------------------------------
From: Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Mandrake 8 sets the standard - for Desktop users anyway.
Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 22:04:37 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> > You mean fanatical user groups.
>
> OS's are fanatical things Pete, you know that. Its the reason you troll
> on COLA.
I try not to be a fanatic. After being a Born Again Christian, I don't
want to be that fanatical or closed minded again.
Why do you think I use both Windows and Linux? Why do you think my 3D
scene editor MSE is available on both Windows and Linux?
--
Pete
------------------------------
From: Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Mandrake 8 sets the standard - for Desktop users anyway.
Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 22:06:06 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> > I changed my motherboard recently, and swapped sound card. Windows had to
> > reboot about four or six times (your '22' seems laughable). Linux had no
> > propblems - except it left the old setup for the old sound card and I had
> > to manually intervene to fix it. The installation/detection stuff still has
> > a way to go.
>
> So you reinstalled windows from scratch hence the smaller number of reboot.
I did no such thing. I let Windows boot and watched as it rediscovered
the keyboard, mouse etc. all over again. Linux did none of this, but
screwed up on the new sound card installation.
--
Pete
------------------------------
From: "Matthew Gardiner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,misc.invest.stocks
Subject: Re: Dell Meets Estimates
Date: Mon, 21 May 2001 10:08:23 +1200
> >
> >Just tried the Sun Blade 1000 w/ the same processors as the sucessor to
> >E10000 will have, that is, the Ultra Sparc III. It is responsive, fast,
> >great graphics, very, very, very, very, very stable. In terms of server
> >performance, it will take the wintel empire to the cleaners.
>
>
> Here is Sun, despite being the leading Unix vendor largely on the basis of
> the Java hype,
> losing overall share to Linux and Windows 2000, both in the server and
> workstation markets.
>
> Not only losing share, but trying to compete against hugely successful
> companies SIMULTANEOUSLY as follows:
>
> 1. IBM in the high end market where services prevail and where IBM offers
a
> full range of products.
SUN is a dedicated UNIX vendor. It doesnot want to ruin its name by
producing substandard, Intel cloned products.
> 2. Microsoft in the software platform market where its new .NET platform
> actually performs, unlike the Java- only solution, and offers every
> language and gets their research talents.
What possible benefit does .net give the consumers? none. All it is, is
another marketing ploy to suck in the Microsoft ass lickers and prove that
some how there idea is remotely possible.
> 3. Intel in chips where vast resources have been thrown at the new
> generation of chips for ALL of the non-Sun server market.
Ultra Sparc IIe, Ultra Sparc III, Majc and numerous telecomuniations CPU's.
Latest rack servers at the same prices as the Windows counterparts.
Workstations at $US995. Maybe you should carry out some research befor
making pre-emptive strikes.
> 4. Dell in the OEM market where Dell has a far better factory and
internet
> system
Ever been to where the SUN machines are produced?
> What characterizes the difference?
>
> These competitors are all SPECIALIZED.
>
> Is Sun a software company? They have absolutely butchered the execution of
> the Java platform, during the web bubble, where they should have tuned
their
> "engine," like Dell did with JIT manufacturing, like IBM did with a new
> dedication to service, like Microsoft did with an unprecedented investment
> in Win 2000 and .NET, and like Intel did with tremendous resources
invested
> in EPIC chips.
You should really look into the original purpose of Java. Hint, has nothing
to do with cross platform, "write once, run anywhere".
> Is Sun a high end company? They have a poor reputation for service.
One fuck up, in what? 16-17 years, thats pretty good. I purchased a SUN
Blade 100, and received excellent support and service.
> Is Sun a chip company? They only make chips for their own servers. After
the
> smoke and mirrors of the web bubble hype, can this base support the R&D
> needed to compete, now that Intel is AT THE DOOR.
Now, National Semiconductors produce the chips, which are standardised by
the Sparc consortium. http://www.sparc.org/members.html are the companies
involved. Maybe you should reassess you pre-emptive conclusions.
> Is Sun an OEM? Sun tries to offer low end servers, yet doesn't have the
> efficiency to do anything but lose money. For the first time, Sun faces
> competition from a lean and mean PC industry.
Sun NZ growing at 40%, that doesn't sound like a company on the decline.
> What happens now when the web bubble collapses and rationality returns?
Will
> Java be enough ambiance to market overpriced products?
You obviously know nothing about Java, and it's capabilities.
> Java of course was the "new paradigm" that would save the day:
>
> "The Gilder piece had its biggest impact on McNealy. 'The moment he could
> map Java to his problem--namely, how to harness the Internet to stop
> Microsoft from swallowing us all--Eric Schmidt said.'" The Plot to Get
Bill
> Gates: An Irreverent Investigation of the World's Richest Man ... and the
> People Who Hate Him, by Gary Rivlin, p. 180.
>
> And harness it he did. Java was the "language of the internet" and Sun was
> the "dot-in-the-dot-com."
>
> But hype doesn't do it in a downturn.
>
> 2 + 2
SUN is first and foremost a hardware vendor, then a distant second, a
software vendor. They are now picking up there boots and putting more
effort into that area, however, the fruits of their invest ment will take
time to bloom.
Matthew Gardiner
------------------------------
From: Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux beats Win2K (again)
Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 22:08:18 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> >Probably because saying Win2K really really sucks is about as meaningless
> >as saying Linux really really sucks.
>
> "Probably"? No, not at all. Win2K is noticeably inferior technology,
> which cannot provide any real competition to Linux.
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
> >Yes. Your point?
>
> That you're full of shit. What further clarification is needed?
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
> >Yet 1 million desktop machines (which includes a large majority of Windows
> >machines) produces one that is bigger than only one supercomputer in the
> >world.
>
> Metaphorically, maybe. In the real world, it's a stupid claim, without
> purpose or meaning.
Like your posts. Stupid and without purpose or meaning.
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
--
Pete
------------------------------
From: "Erik Funkenbusch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: The nature of competition
Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 17:09:10 -0500
"mlw" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:9e9eus$c8b$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> I was talking with some guys at work. We were joking that we saved
$100,000
> on Microsoft licenses on our website. We used Linux, Apache, Postgres,
php,
> and perl across multiple boxes behind a load balancer.
>
> I see a lot of talk on this forum about how Linux is marginally better or
> W2K is marginally better, etc. From a price/performance perspective W2K
has
> to be A LOT better than linux to even tie, and we don't see this
happening.
Well, so far, the only real tests of price/performance that Linux machines
have participated in is the TPC benchmark, and that showed a
price/performance ratio of over twice that of the Win2k box.
> Linux is at least as fast, if not faster.
Depends on the task. Linux is *NOT* as fast or faster for things like Video
editing, for instance.
> Linux has been proven to be more stable.
It has? How? I've seen no verifiable studies that show Linux's uptime to
be greater than anything else.
> Linux has proven to be more secure.
Again, it has? What do you call the 49 security bulletins in the last 6
months for Red Hat?
> Linux is free.
More of that ambiguity.
> So, why would anyone choose a Microsoft solution?
Software.
------------------------------
From: Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux beats Win2K (again)
Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 22:10:09 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> >And a committee deciding standards works, does it?
>
> What do you mean "works"? Many consensus standards work very well, yes,
> as evidenced by our conversation.
I meant committee standards usually take time and lag behind what's out
there.
> >You are, as usual, putting words into my mouth.
>
> Face it, even from this side of Usenet, I do a better job of it than you
> do. By "the market", do you mean "the market", or "the monopoly"?
You do a better job of putting words into my mouth?
HA!
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
--
Pete
------------------------------
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End of Linux-Advocacy Digest
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