Linux-Advocacy Digest #640, Volume #31 Sun, 21 Jan 01 16:13:06 EST
Contents:
Re: Multiple standards don't constitute choice (Edward Rosten)
Re: Windows Has Lost (Edward Rosten)
Re: New Microsoft Ad :-) ("Chris Ahlstrom")
Re: Why "uptime" is important. (Edward Rosten)
Re: Red hat becoming illegal? ("Chris Ahlstrom")
Re: New Microsoft Ad :-) ("Chris Ahlstrom")
Re: The Server Saga (Tim)
Re: New Microsoft Ad :-) ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: More to think about... (Marten Kemp)
Re: Why "uptime" is important. (Edward Rosten)
Newbie Journal ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: "The Linux Desktop", by T. Max Devlin (Ed Allen)
Re: New Microsoft Ad :-) (J Sloan)
Re: NT is Most Vulnerable Server Software (Peter =?ISO-8859-1?Q?K=F6hlmann?=)
Re: New Microsoft Ad :-) (J Sloan)
Re: Loki has trouble playiong their own games under Linux!!!!! (Jim Broughton)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Edward Rosten <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Multiple standards don't constitute choice
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:12:17 +0000
> If it were only a difference between style of buttons...
>
> But it's not.
>
> Take a good look at the different styles of file open/save dialog between
> MOTIF, Gtk and Qt. They are very different, they work in different ways.
But you know how to use them all. You figured them all out with no
problem. So it really is quite a trivial matter if they don't actually
affect your work.
-Ed
--
Did you know that the reason that windows steam up in cold|Edward Rosten
weather is because of all the fish in the atmosphere? |u98ejr
- The Hackenthorpe Book of lies |@
|eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: Edward Rosten <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Windows Has Lost
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:13:10 +0000
"." wrote:
>
> Adam Warner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Hi Craig,
>
> > That perspective is fascinating. I have checked up and the XBox does NOT
> > have firewire (http://www.xbox.com/xbox/flash/specs.asp). It only has 100Mb
> > Ethernet. Even so that speed would enable Microsoft to expand the XBox later
> > on: keyboards, extra storage space, printers, etc. It may be in Microsoft's
> > interests to make special XBox-only hardware.
>
> You realize that it is indeed possible to run linux on a dreamcast...
>
> I wonder how long it will be before someone sticks it on an xbox.
Not very. As the Xbox is pretty much a PC, it won't take much work,
seeing as it wou't need a new compiler.
-Ed
--
Did you know that the reason that windows steam up in cold|Edward Rosten
weather is because of all the fish in the atmosphere? |u98ejr
- The Hackenthorpe Book of lies |@
|eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: "Chris Ahlstrom" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: New Microsoft Ad :-)
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:15:23 GMT
> Once again Give me a way or method to crash Win2k, I've yet to find one on
> my own.
> If it is so unstable there must be a real easy way to cause it to
> crash...short of dropping the box down some stairs.
> Lets have ONE way. ONE.
>
Here's one. Start with a system having Win NT 4 and 96 Mb of RAM.
Stick in the Win2K install disk, and select UPGRADE (in lieu of a clean install).
After installation, cruise the web awhile. Then run Word.
Chris
------------------------------
From: Edward Rosten <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why "uptime" is important.
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:17:18 +0000
Lloyd Llewellyn wrote:
>
> > Understanding "quality" as it applies to operating systems is just as
> > important for purchasing decisions on computers as understanding anti-lock
> > brakes, fuel injection, and vehicle warrantees are for cars.
> >
> > An educated customer would choose anything but Windows.
>
> In case this is related to the thread "it's not all about up-time" - let me
> start by saying that I'm pretty much in love with Linux (as a concept at least).
>
>
> I didn't say that up-time isn't important. I just said that I felt it was a
> mistake to focus on up-time as the raison d'etre of Linux. It's quite obvious
> that there are other things that a lot of people feel are more important than
> up-time numbers.
>
> Like application availability. I've spent the last couple of days looking for a
> WYSIWYG web page editor so
These don't really exist. HTML is not a page layout language, so it will
look different on every machine. What you see may be what *you* get, but
not what the person who downloads your page gets.
-Ed
--
Did you know that the reason that windows steam up in cold|Edward Rosten
weather is because of all the fish in the atmosphere? |u98ejr
- The Hackenthorpe Book of lies |@
|eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: "Chris Ahlstrom" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Red hat becoming illegal?
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:17:26 GMT
"choad_leyers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in
message
news:94f7tn$fno$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> In comp.os.linux.advocacy Bob Hauck <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > On Sun, 21 Jan 2001 04:04:23 GMT, Chris Ahlstrom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > wrote:
>
> >>I find it hilarious that this Myers asshole calls me "Mr. Personal
> >>Attack", when I see people posting messages under the name
> >>"[email protected]".
>
> > If you make fun of him he'll put you in his killfile. That'll show you.
>
> It sure showed me.
He claims he already did that. This was good news for me, as now I feel
absolutely no need to do any research to answer his stupendously
stupid claims. (Some of his claims are true, but those the tries to leverage
into making stupendously stupid "deductions".)
Chris
------------------------------
From: "Chris Ahlstrom" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: New Microsoft Ad :-)
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:19:38 GMT
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> On Sun, 21 Jan 2001 17:23:11 GMT, T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
>
> >I would expect that Linux has had automount for a number of years. Can
> >somebody confirm this?
>
> You'll know for yourself in a week or so.
Very helpful answer, flathead. T, it does. It is pretty easy to set up.
It will automount both data and audio CDs.
Also, Linux burns really sweet CDs, but you have to make sure you
use a number of mkisofs options for the broadest compatibility with
all operating-system driven CD readers.
Chris
------------------------------
From: Tim <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: The Server Saga
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:05:00 +0000
Pete Goodwin wrote:
>
> Tim wrote:
>
> > Once you know your OS, you shouldn't have to rely on a GUI to do
> > everything for you.
>
> Well, I don't want to know my OS. With Linux that option is not easily done.
>
> When I drive my car, I'm not terribly interested in how the internal
> combustion engine works.
On the other hand I bet you have no intention to make a profession out
of
driving, or even be slightly better then average if you have no interest
in how your car works.
Put the "car" picture into perspective. If you were just driving your
car
you would get some one else to design it, construct it, service it, and
repair it whenever anything went wrong, even to the point of not being
able
to fit your own stereo.
If you want to program a computer, or be able to carry out some
maintenance
on a server, then you should be reasonably competent, otherwise get
someone
else to do it who will do a much better job of it than you. Windows is
designed for people who "don't want to see the moving parts", someone
who
is just happy to click OK without even reading what's in the box,
not for a competent programmer.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: New Microsoft Ad :-)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:42:57 GMT
On Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:19:38 GMT, "Chris Ahlstrom"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Very helpful answer, flathead. T, it does. It is pretty easy to set up.
>It will automount both data and audio CDs.
You don't want me to give away all of Linux's secrets now do you?
What would be the fun in that?
No How-To's to read?
No Mini-How-To's (is that for Native American Indians? BTW)
No FAQ's?
No Man pages to search?
No endless trips to Redhat's home page?
What "fun" would Max have with Linux if that were the case?
Flatfish
Why do they call it a flatfish?
Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: Marten Kemp <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: More to think about...
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:55:23 GMT
sfcybear wrote:
>
> I have spent most of my time avoiding working on IBM's bigirons....
>
> http://www.infoworld.com/articles/hn/xml/01/01/22/010122hnlinux.xml
>
> Could it be we are headed back?
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/
In situations where TCO makes sense, I hope so. If you read my post
about Linux and the 390 you'll see why. It really won't make that much
difference to the Linux users - different box, same software. I know
it's hard to accept inconvenient facts but a mainframe makes sense when
the job goes beyond IT to DP. In an IT environment the major task is to
manipulate information in interesting ways. In a DP environment the
major task is to move and manage large amounts of information.
-- Marten Kemp
------------------------------
From: Edward Rosten <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why "uptime" is important.
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:56:32 +0000
> >HTML is an interesting thing to use for an example. I have never seen
> >any WYSIWYG that produced HTML that was very usable for anything other
> >than a static page. Certainly difficult to integrate with PHP, ASP,
> >java, etc. I often end up "post editing" my web pages in vi, because the
> >graphical programs always mess up the HTML.
>
> All my pages are static and I've written every one of them in Emacs. It
> is really very easy, especially when your only objective is to inform.
>
> I might try some of that "dynamic" stuff but I don't have the slightest
> understanding of it...
I always write web pages in vi. I do some dynamic page creation, usually
with C or AWK or shell scripts (depending on how quickly I want it to
run or write it). They just chuck HTML to the standard output which is
redirected by Apache to some port. Obviously, you need to be up to speed
with HTML to do it, but its not very hard.
> >Oh, and to address "WYSIWYG" criteria. There is no such capability in
> >HTML, and people that assume there is always make web pages with serious
> >formatting errors. The rule is write the page and try it on many
> >browsers with different fonts and screen resolutions.
>
> Same as with any typesetting system whose output you expect to look
> professional.
Which is why so many pages look bad. The designer assumes everyone has
the same browser and display settings as them. I usually test my pages
in StarOffice, Netscape and Lynx (I don't bother with IE because I don't
run windows).
-Ed
--
Did you know that the reason that windows steam up in cold|Edward Rosten
weather is because of all the fish in the atmosphere? |u98ejr
- The Hackenthorpe Book of lies |@
|eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Newbie Journal
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:51:03 GMT
Dear Fierce and Friendly Folks,
After months of tinkering around with Linux I am putting it work in the
ordinary world. I believe very strongly in in some of the values of the
open-source community such as freely sharing knowledge, helping others,
and feeling passionate about excellent software.
I am not a programmer, system administrator or any other technical
type. I work as a registered nurse and have started back to school at
University of New Mexico to get my BSN.
The purpose of this journal is to give back to the open source
community the only thing that I have that might be of value. That is my
experience using Linux and other related software in the ordinary,
K-mart world. Hopefully, these stories may help someone else make the
decision to try Linux.
My computing needs are as follows:
Compose and print a simple weekly neighborhood newsletter
Keep accounts of my savings, checking and other assets
Simple bookeeping for a small home-based business
Web access to my online nursing research course
Compose and read documents for above course (MS Office)
General web-surfing
My computing wants include:
Playing a few games
Getting my scanner working and learning GIMP (image processing)
Setting up a simple home network
My assets include:
AT clone with FIC 503 board, 500 MHz AMD-K6, 128 megs ram
Redhat 6.2 with included KDE GUI
Word Perfect 8.0, StarOffice 5.2
"Running Linux" by Welsh from www.oreilly.com
And my most important asset of all is "Fred". Fred is my friend of over
14 years and he is my Linux guru. His day job is as the technical end of
a two-person Linux division of a networking compamy here in Albuqerque.
They put together sophisticated Linux systems, RAID arrays and other
toys for Sandia and Los Alamos labs. My first recomendation is to go and
find a "Fred". Your "Fred" will be invaluable beyond belief if you are
coming from a Windows environment. You can find a "Fred" at a local
Linux Users Group (LUG) in your area.
Hopefully this journal will be published 2 or 3 times per month as time
permits.
Gene Kimzey
Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Ed Allen)
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: "The Linux Desktop", by T. Max Devlin
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 21:00:44 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Said Chris Ahlstrom in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Sun, 21 Jan 2001
> [...]
>>So, flatfish is right. [I, a Penguinista, so state.]
>
>Sometimes that Bozo bit is a problem for the rest of us. The last thing
>we need is any encouragement for flathead/claire to keep using this
>stupid 'penguinista' word that it made up.
>
flathead/claire/etc did not make it up it appears.
I heard Maddog use it in a presentation two years ago.
He likes it because the Linux mascot is a penguin, Tux, and
the 'ista' invokes images of Central American revolutionaries
and Maddog likes to remind people that "Linux World Domination"
is definitely a revolution.
It seems to be accepted by Linus. Maybe he agrees with Maddog,
it is here to stay in any case.
It surprises me that it took flathead so long to "discover" it.
--
"Given enough time and money, Microsoft will eventually 'invent' Unix."
- George Bonser
"No chance. they only have a finite number of monkeys."
- Thomas Lakofski
------------------------------
From: J Sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: New Microsoft Ad :-)
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 21:04:00 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> On Sun, 21 Jan 2001 11:54:29 -0500, "JS PL" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
> >So you just go ahead and advocate an OS you don't use while bashing an OS
> >you've never used and do it all using Windows98 to do the bashing.
>
> He'll be using Linux real soon now.
> I can't wait.
I'd think you'd be rather disappointed, since the nature
of your BS will now be more immediately obvious to him -
jjs
------------------------------
From: Peter =?ISO-8859-1?Q?K=F6hlmann?= <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: NT is Most Vulnerable Server Software
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 18:04:20 +0100
T. Max Devlin wrote:
> Said Peter K�hlmann in alt.destroy.microsoft on Sun, 21 Jan 2001
> >T. Max Devlin wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> So what's 1597 about?
> [...]
> > Address Allocation for Private Internets
>
> Yea, that's what I thought they were talking about. That's a rule of
> *the Internet*, not a rule of *routing*.
>
Don't snip too much, here it goes:
=============================
Routers in networks not using private address space, especially those
of Internet service providers, are expected to be configured to reject
(filter out) routing information about private networks. If such a router
receives such information the rejection shall not be treated as a
routing protocol error
=============================
Jedi write:
>Or routers.
>There are certain addresses that aren't meant to be routed.
>To do so will cause name collisions.
So he was right, to a certain extend. That part with the name collisions
is, well, a little bit off. But he is right with the private addresses not
meant to be routed.
------------------------------
From: J Sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: New Microsoft Ad :-)
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 21:08:29 GMT
"T. Max Devlin" wrote:
> Said JS PL in alt.destroy.microsoft on Sun, 21 Jan 2001 11:58:47 -0500;
> [...]
> >Just trying to explain it would be revolting.
> >"O.K. grandma, to play the cd you'll have to mount the cd drive." NO NO
> >STOP!! Step away from the computer granmdma!!
>
> I would expect that Linux has had automount for a number of years. Can
> somebody confirm this?
Yes, you even have a choice of the bsd automounter daemon,
or the newer autofs, which is more efficient, but can't yet do
all the tricks that amd can.
autofs is great for mounting cds and floppies, or the occasional
legacy windows share, but the string point of amd is having that
/net directory where you can access any remote nfs filesystems
available to you just by entering a directory with the appropriate
hostname.
jjs
------------------------------
From: Jim Broughton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Loki has trouble playiong their own games under Linux!!!!!
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 21:09:35 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> http://www.zdnet.co.uk/news/2000/4/ns-13122.html
>
> Here's a snippet:
>
> "Even our developers have trouble getting (games) going," said Scott
> Draeker, president of Loki, during a conference session at the
> LinuxWorld show here, emphasising the difficulty of setting up Linux
> platforms for gaming. "(The Linux situation) is reminiscent of the bad
> ol' days of DOS."
>
> But this one is my favorite!
>
> "How bad, exactly? Ray Schwamberger, a Linux technician for Atipa
> Linux Solutions, spent two hours tweaking and configuring a dozen
> computers at his company's LinuxWorld booth so they could adequately
> run Quake 3 and demo Atipa's Linux PC. "
>
> This stuff is HYSTERICAL!!!!!!!
>
> Flatfish
> Why do they call it a flatfish?
> Remove the ++++ to reply.
Why are you here? What real reason DO you have for being here?
Your obviously NOT a programmer. Sys admin? probably not.
Microsoft lackey? (wintroll) maybe. Every post you make says nothing
intelligent and in general helps no one. (not even a windows user
wondering about linux) All an intelligent person see's when viewing
a reply from you or a post from you is a jerk who seems to deem it
nessesary to post negetivity into a newsgroup with the idea of
agrivating those who make intelligent use of the newsgroup.
You are a sad sorry case. PLEASE GET HELP BEFORE ITS TOO LATE.
--
Jim Broughton
(The AmigaOS now there was an OS!)
If Sense were common everyone would have it!
------------------------------
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