Linux-Advocacy Digest #654, Volume #31 Mon, 22 Jan 01 13:13:05 EST
Contents:
Re: Windows 2000 (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Why "uptime" is important. (Aaron Ginn)
Like TurboTax? Hate Windows? Try this... (Aaron Ginn)
Re: New Microsoft Ad :-) (.)
Re: A salutary lesson about open source ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: So much for Linux being more Difficult than Windows ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Why "uptime" is important. (Bob Hauck)
Re: Operating Systems? Where would you go next? (John Wolf)
Re: A salutary lesson about open source ("JS PL")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Windows 2000
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:39:33 GMT
Said Tom Wilson in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Mon, 22 Jan 2001 09:31:38
>"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>>
>> Once they did, they started supporting Linux. ;-)
>>
>> (The preceding statement is knowingly misrepresentative of history.)
>
>Actually, I think the decision to back Linux is a good way for them to jump
>on an already moving bandwagon. At least they're bringing something to the
>dance (moolah and research). Its' also breathing some new life into the
>older mainframes.
Yes, its quite a band that's on that wagon, these days.
[...]
>> In case you weren't aware, this is called "losing trademark protection".
>> The term "PC" now means any IBM-compatible personal computer. Suddenly,
>> they can no longer prevent some other manufacturer from building
>> anything they want and calling it "a PC". Its now the *markets*
>> decision whether that's true, not IBM's.
>
>Better than simply being known for mainframes and Selectrics.
Yes, we know that *now*. Try convincing IBM of that in 1985! Or 1995,
for that matter.
>> >> manufactured PC *compatibles*. The clones won. So you are right, "it
>> >> made no difference how good [or how bad] their hardware was." But IBM
>> >> lost to "the business plan" as much as anyone did. Their attempt to
>> >> re-propriatize the market with the Microchannel architecture seems to
>> >> conclusively prove that.
>> >
>> >A return to their prior business methodology. THAT was a BIG mistake.
>>
>> Some of us new that even at the time. IBM surely didn't; that seems
>> self-evident.
>
>A lot of us just shook our heads in disbelief.
I certainly did.
>I remember getting in quite a
>bit of hot water from an IBM rep when I refused to sell them at the
>ComputerLand branch I worked with. Marketing idiocy aside, they just weren't
>worth the added costs.
I remember someone at my office getting in a heap of trouble (and I did
nothing to comfort them, quite the opposite) because they ignorantly
('accidentally') bought a Microchannel computer.
[...]
>> Indeed; it might be a great story, some day; IBM's journey from
>> competitor to monopolist to visionary competitor.
>
>Dollars to doughnuts the cycle will repeat...
Not with Microsoft it won't. Though in theory they may manage to
survive and become a competitor, they'll never be truly visionary
(though they like to think they are, of course), and they weren't ever
competing before they had a monopoly.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
------------------------------
From: Aaron Ginn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why "uptime" is important.
Date: 22 Jan 2001 09:14:31 -0700
mlw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> My mom, runs turbo tax, then reboots her computer "to be safe" before
> running word, and vice versa. She says if she doesn't it crashes. I
> don't care how bad Turbo Tax or Word may be, an OS should be able to
> handle this stuff. Oh, and she has to reboot after using the dialup
> networking, or her computer hangs. If I could get her on Linux, i.e. get
> a good tax package for her, I would.
Mark,
This is how I plan on filing my taxes this year:
http://www.turbotax.com/turbotaxweb/turbot_welcome.htm
The requirements indicate that the user needs Windows or a Mac to run
this, but I wonder if that's really true. Their FAQ indicates that
all calculations/data are done/stored on Intuit's servers, and that
the user does not need to install any software on his computer. All
you need is a pdf viewer and a browser that supports cookies, java, an
javascript.
Of course, if you don't have a broadband connection, this could be an
exercise in patience.
--
Aaron J. Ginn Phone: 480-814-4463
Motorola SemiCustom Solutions Pager: 877-586-2318
1300 N. Alma School Rd. Fax : 480-814-4463
Chandler, AZ 85226 M/D CH260 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: Aaron Ginn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Like TurboTax? Hate Windows? Try this...
Date: 22 Jan 2001 09:39:26 -0700
There appears to be one less reason to use Windows now. Intuit now
supports electronic filing using a web browser.
http://www.turbotax.com/turbotaxweb/turbot_welcome.htm
Now, their requirements indicate that either Windows or a Mac is
required, but I can't see why. The only things it appears that you
need are a browser that supports cookies, java, and javascript and a
PDF viewer to print out the completed forms. I can't see any reason
why this would keep you from using Linux. In fact, I was just able to
log into my account from my Solaris workstation here at work. The
only reason I am using Windows is to import last year's data from
Windows. Next year, I should be able to import this year's data
that will reside on their server using any OS.
So that's one more application you can cross off from the list of
things people need Windows for, although I suppose this is only a
feasible solution for people who have a broadband connection.
--
Aaron J. Ginn Phone: 480-814-4463
Motorola SemiCustom Solutions Pager: 877-586-2318
1300 N. Alma School Rd. Fax : 480-814-4463
Chandler, AZ 85226 M/D CH260 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (.)
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,alt.linux.sux
Subject: Re: New Microsoft Ad :-)
Date: 22 Jan 2001 17:00:37 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> On Mon, 22 Jan 2001 03:57:45 GMT, T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>>Said . in alt.destroy.microsoft on 22 Jan 2001 02:36:08 GMT;
>>>In comp.os.linux.advocacy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>>>> On 22 Jan 2001 01:41:12 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (.) wrote:
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Tell me claire, exactly why it is that while linux recognized my secondary
>>>>>PCI IDE controller (ATA/100) instantly and with no configuration nessesary,
>>>>>windows decides that its a 'new device' every time I reboot and incorrectly
>>>>>names it a "PCI RAID CONTROLLER"?
>>>
>>>> Because you say it does.
>>>
>>>It does, actually. One of the very many reasons that I only very rarely
>>>run windowsME, and then only to play unreal tournament.
>>>
>>>Curiously, one of the MCSEs that I work with has the exact same problem
>>>with an entirely different IDE controller, to which he consistently responds:
>>>
>>>"fucking windows".
>>
>>Bwah-ha-ha-ha.
> I really wish you would learn to use your news reader correctly Max
> and quote me correctly.
I wish you would learn to understand USENET, claire, and realize that he
wasnt responding to YOU.
He simply snipped your meaningless drivel at the beginning, as is most wise
in any case.
> Jeezzz you can't even use Agent properly, I can't wait to see you use
> Emacs or slrn to read news.
> Now THAT'S gonna be funny!
Awwww look. The mediocre audio hobbyist thinks she can read headers.
Thats so sweet.
=====.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,alt.linux.sux
Subject: Re: A salutary lesson about open source
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 17:08:03 GMT
On Mon, 22 Jan 2001 14:20:50 GMT, "Chad Myers"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>We were talking about the web server. If you want to change the subject, please
>do so, but don't argue about A, and when I provide facts, change the subject
>to B and attack me on it.
>
>-Chad
Classic Penguinista "twist and shout" technique.
Flatfish
Why do they call it a flatfish?
Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: So much for Linux being more Difficult than Windows
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 17:14:11 GMT
On Mon, 22 Jan 2001 05:22:04 GMT, Russ Lyttle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>I recently opened an new account with earthlink. After placing the
>order, I waited for an hour, edited a kppp script, logged in and was up
>and running within 1 minute. Today I got the package earthlink sends out
>to all new users. It includes a CD and "Quick Start" guide. The last
>line of the instructions for 95/98/Me is to reboot the computer.
>
>So much for MS operating systems being easier to use than Linux.
If you were a Windows user you could drop the CD in the drive and it
would do everything for you and allow you to use features that their
software provides that you can't use.
I hope you at least got your free Digital Camera :)
Flatfish
Why do they call it a flatfish?
Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Hauck)
Subject: Re: Why "uptime" is important.
Reply-To: hauck[at]codem{dot}com
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 17:17:33 GMT
On Sun, 21 Jan 2001 12:56:04 -0500, mlw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Bob Hauck wrote:
>> It is difficult to be productive while waving vodoo dolls about in the
>> hope that your hard work won't get flushed down the toilet on the whim
>> of your computer.
>
>While this is hysterical, it is also very true. I've never seen it
>described before, but I have seen this sort of thing often.
I did go a bit overboard in the interests of exposition, but I think it
is a valid point. Windows users don't trust their computers. They
expect them to fail at random. This is just not acceptable for a
professional tool. No other business tool suffers from this kind of
problem. And it _does_ reduce the productivity gains one would expect
from automation.
If you have a reliable computer, your whole attitude toward the computer
changes. You are more willing to use it for important tasks, and you
are more willing to invest time in learning the ins and outs of it.
>My mom, runs turbo tax, then reboots her computer "to be safe" before
>running word, and vice versa. She says if she doesn't it crashes.
That's just the sort of thing I was referring to. It is far less
prevalent among NT users of course, which by itself is almost
justification for spending the extra money on NT and appropriate
hardware if you really need Windows apps.
--
-| Bob Hauck
-| Codem Systems, Inc.
-| http://www.codem.com/
------------------------------
From: John Wolf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.os.linux,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.os2.apps,comp.os.os2.misc,comp.os.os2.networking.tcp-ip
Subject: Re: Operating Systems? Where would you go next?
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:17:08 -0500
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>
>
>
> "VM" being OS/2 slang for a "Virtual Machine" EXACTLY as you
> point out above. Oh ! Sooo sorry ! I called it a virtual machine
> instead of a virtual image facility ! IBM's never called anything
> a virtual machine (?) so the concept must be totally incompre-
> hensible to y'all.
>
> now this winvocate's bidding his adieux to the thread 'cuz it's
> become stupid beyond belief.
>
> --
> h�rad �ngravv�d
VM and Virtual Machine were arround LONG before OS/2 was EVER thought
of.
John Wolf Sysprog University of Cincinnati
------------------------------
From: "JS PL" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: A salutary lesson about open source
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:39:17 -0500
"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Said JS PL in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Mon, 22 Jan 2001 00:48:21 -0500;
> >
> >"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >
> >> >Driver problems are not the OS's fault unless it was a driver written
by
> >MS,
> >> >and even then it's MS's fault, not the OS.
> >>
> >> Driver problems are the OS's fault.
> >
> >In that case I'd like my $50.00 back on my Caldera Open Linux 2.4 because
it
> >wouldn't run a Viper v550 out of the box.
>
> That isn't a driver problem. That's a lack of drivers for an
> alternative OS. That's Microsoft's fault. A driver problem is one
> where the driver fails, not one where it is not available because of the
> dominance by the OS market by a monopolist.
>
> I knew the trolls would have a field day with this statement to begin
> with, as it require reason to understand why I said it, and thus what I
> said, and they'd much rather assume it was meant as an absolute and
> universal truth, since they are incapable of reason.
>
> But so that too many people don't mistake the context of my words, I'll
> do COLA the favor of saving the trolls the trouble and correcting the
> statement. It won't help much, but at least the responses wouldn't be
> quite as brain-dead and obvious as JS/PL's pedantic whining.
>
> Driver problems on Windows are the OS's fault.
>
> >Wouldn't run my modem or sound
> >card either. Now that you've explained that it's the fault of the OS I'd
> >like my money back.
>
> You might check into getting refund on your brain, too, as that also
> seems to be non-functional.
>
> >> >Additionally, a program that crashes repeatedly may not be the OS's
fault
> >at
> >> >all.
> >>
> >> A program that crashes repeatedly is the OSes fault.
> >
> >You mean the repeated crash reports of Netscape on Linux are the fault of
> >the OS??
>
> Wow, I would have NEVER expected you to respond like that. Gee, you
> must be really smart.
>
> When Netscape crashes, and you restart it, does it crash again and
> again, repeatedly, or is the state restored correctly by the OS so that
> it doesn't? Answer: on Windows, of course, a program crashes
> *repeatedly*. On Linux, it just crashes. And that, obviously, is the
> application's fault.
More of the blame game. Blame evasion perhaps? It's the old "It's their
fault my life is so hard". I'm thankfull all the "it's their fault" people
are gravitating towards Linux. Let the MS users be rid of them. Our loss is
Linux's gain. Hurry up and switch over Max! (as if....)
------------------------------
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