Linux-Advocacy Digest #745, Volume #31 Fri, 26 Jan 01 14:13:03 EST
Contents:
Re: Poor Linux ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Microsoft "INNOVATES" again! ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Comparison: Installing W2K and Linux 2.4 (Nick Condon)
Re: Whistler predictions... (.)
Re: Does Code Decay (Matthias Warkus)
MS to Enforce Registration - or Else (Steve Withers)
Re: Does Code Decay
Re: A salutary lesson about open source (Steve Mading)
Re: A salutary lesson about open source (Steve Mading)
Re: Linux 2.4 Major Advance (Steve Mading)
Re: 3100 W2K Adv Servers deployed accross Europe (Steve Mading)
Re: Poor Linux ("Edward Rosten")
Re: MS to Enforce Registration - or Else (Bill Delphenich)
Re: MS to Enforce Registration - or Else (filthy-mcnasty)
Re: Getting first W2K server (Steve Mading)
Re: MS to Enforce Registration - or Else (Steve Mading)
Re: Getting first W2K server (.)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Poor Linux
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 17:06:23 GMT
On Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:40:39 GMT, "kiwiunixman"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>hmmm, 4 days and NO REPLY..yet again, I am proven correct! god this
>win-zombie bashing is fucking easy!
>
>kiwiunixman
I never saw the message, but to answer your question, digital audio.
I do transcriptions/conversions of formats and specialize in
converting shellac and acetate 78RPM records to DAT/CD whatever.
In conjunction with this I do post production work for small bands,
vocalists and musicians.
Flatfish
Why do they call it a flatfish?
Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Microsoft "INNOVATES" again!
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 17:09:46 GMT
On 25 Jan 2001 21:55:49 -0700, Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>He wants to know the reason why rasterman wrote the Elightenment
>window manager in such a way that the user is required to edit a text
>file in order to add an item to to the root menu (why doesn't he ask
>rasterman?). It's a straw-man; he knows that neither GNOME nor KDE
>require this (just like his pseudo-problem with the nameless CD player
>he used). He also has major problems with his Soundblaster Live, even
>though the card has been in the kernel for years.
1. Kind of proves my point about inconsistencies in Linux applications
now doesn't it.
BTW tell me how you re-order the menues in kde or make a shortcut/link
and put it on the desktop, or in another menu.
I can drag them around in Windows. Real easy.
2. SBLive FULLY SUPPORTED under Linux?
Sorry. Maybe in another year or so.
>He asks these questions over and over and over.
I didn't ask the question, someone else did.
>It's best to ignore them.
Whatever floats your boat.
Flatfish
Why do they call it a flatfish?
Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Nick Condon)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Comparison: Installing W2K and Linux 2.4
Date: 26 Jan 2001 17:27:07 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jan Johanson) wrote in
<3a70e11c$0$11956$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>> > Excuse me - are ANY of those products included in the download? Show
>> > me
>any
>> > distribution tha tincludes SimCity 3000, Unreal Tournament and
>> > CorelDraw
>and
>> > Gimp and Star Office....
>>
>> Pardon me but your ignorance is showing.
>>
>> gimp has been in every Linux distro I've ever seen.
>>
>> star office and IIRC most of the others come with SuSE
>> and other distros -
>
>Pardon me but your inability to read the subject or contents is
>showing...
>
>I didn't discuss the distro's I was talking about just the kernel
>
Sure you were.
Maybe Richard Stallman is right to insist on calling it GNU/Linux, we
really do different name for Linux-the-Kernel and a Linux distribution.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (.)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Whistler predictions...
Date: 26 Jan 2001 17:30:55 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy JS/PL <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> You know, its actually pretty hilarious when people take comments on their
>> operating system of choice so personally that they actually get mad.
>>
>> Whats the matter, JS? Someone cheating on you or something?
> And yet others get mad when their lies are extinguished as quickly as they
> see the light of day.
What? Can you demonstrate that youve done this at any time at all?
> The cheating thing sounds like a Freudian slip on your part. Don't worry
> pal, let it pass, theres plenty of fish in the sea.
I'm not surprised that you dont know what a freudian slip actually is.
=====.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Matthias Warkus)
Subject: Re: Does Code Decay
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 13:54:33 +0000
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
It was the Thu, 25 Jan 2001 18:28:05 -0000...
...and [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >Kind of like the nuclear-fission handgrenade, but without the benefits.
>
> ...they actually did make fission artillery shells...
>
> "The nuclear artillery: We're so sure we'll get our man because
> we'll get ourselves at the same time..." '-)
Ever seen a picture of a test shot with an Atom Annie? Those were 28
cm guns and they carried that little tactical nuke quite far away.
There's a quite famous photo showing a US soldier next to a howitzer
and, at the horizon, the mushroom already blossoming.
No danger of killing the Good Guys(TM) together with Mother Russia's
sons unless someone extremely stupid operated that gun.
mawa
--
ICH WILL HIER RAUS
------------------------------
From: Steve Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: MS to Enforce Registration - or Else
Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 06:46:13 +1300
G'day
I've been following developments closely on this.
It appears that sometime this year all new Microsot software will need
to be registered....or it will cease to function.
This may offer OS alternatives like Linux a huge toe in the desktop
door. With more and more homes being networked and having multiple PCs,
how many home and small business users are going to be forced to pay up
and stop using the "One CD fits all" approach they use today?
In my own case.....I would have to upgrade 7 home PCs every year for
both Windows and MS Office.....to the tune of lots of dosh per annum. As
it is, I now have 3 of those systems on Linux...and quite happily.
But some of my family members are reluctant to give up Windows. I may
have to suggest to them that they pay for it in future....as I will only
be paying for Linux software from 2001 onward.
It is intersting that the US produced Windows......the country with
one-party (two faction) politics has also given us no choice on the
desktop. While politically diverse Europe with multi-party, proportional
systems as the politcal norm, has given us Open Software and Linux....
Sort of the illusion of freedom (US politics) vs the reality of freedom
(European politics - outside Britain).
There is an underlying cultural thing operating here somewhere...... :-)
Steve
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ()
Subject: Re: Does Code Decay
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 18:16:24 -0000
On Fri, 26 Jan 2001 13:54:33 +0000, Matthias Warkus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>It was the Thu, 25 Jan 2001 18:28:05 -0000...
>...and [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >Kind of like the nuclear-fission handgrenade, but without the benefits.
>>
>> ...they actually did make fission artillery shells...
>>
>> "The nuclear artillery: We're so sure we'll get our man because
>> we'll get ourselves at the same time..." '-)
>
>Ever seen a picture of a test shot with an Atom Annie? Those were 28
>cm guns and they carried that little tactical nuke quite far away.
>There's a quite famous photo showing a US soldier next to a howitzer
>and, at the horizon, the mushroom already blossoming.
>
>No danger of killing the Good Guys(TM) together with Mother Russia's
>sons unless someone extremely stupid operated that gun.
...certainly no chance of that in the Army. <chuckle>
--
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: A salutary lesson about open source
Date: 26 Jan 2001 18:18:27 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: "The Ghost In The Machine" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
:>
:> Personally, I think VBScript would be incredibly easy to use and
:> learn for projects of, oh, say, about 5 lines or less.
:> But it gets weird quickly, IMO. :-) For example: how does one
:> declare a class with public, protected, and private data
:> members, inheriting from another class? Java and C++ can
:> handle this without difficulty; I think Perl 5 can, too.
: VBScript is... well, a scripting language.
So is Perl, and *it* can do it.
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: A salutary lesson about open source
Date: 26 Jan 2001 18:17:26 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: So you would deny that Dell obtains a significant, if not
: majority of their revenue from the web? (If you would,
: you'd be wrong).
You weren't talking about just Dell. You were talking about
the entire Fortune 500. Dell is not a typical representative
of the Fortine 500. You are so fscking dishonest.
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux 2.4 Major Advance
Date: 26 Jan 2001 18:10:56 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: "J Sloan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
:> Chad Myers wrote:
:>
:> > P.S.- sponsoring an independant benchmark does not necessarily
:> > taint the findings.
:>
:> Hint: "sponsored" and "independent" clash.
: Then you have no idea how the scientific world works. All studies
: are sponsored by someone, but it doesn't affect the outcome of
: the study.
: Just more Penguinista fud.
What a load of bull - most studies are sponsored, yes, but not
necessarily by one of the parties being judged in the study.
A study sponsored by a third party can be impartial, but a study
sponsored by one of the parties being judged by the study cannot.
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: 3100 W2K Adv Servers deployed accross Europe
Date: 26 Jan 2001 18:24:26 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: "Steve Mading" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
: news:94qdeg$13mm$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
:> In comp.os.linux.advocacy Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
:>
:> : "Steve Mading" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
:> : news:94nnig$8o8$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
:> :>
:> :> I don't need to see it. It isn't possible to get better than 100%.
:> :> EVERYTHING in Unix is remotable. The best anyone can do is to match
:> :> that, but it isn't physically possible to actually beat it.
:>
:> : Windows Terminal Services + Microsoft Management Console provides
:> : better than telnet remotability.
:>
:> That's nice. Now wake up and look at the calender. UNIX *also*
:> provides better than telnet remotability.
: Not really. They're all variations of telnet (SSH, etc). Some
: of their applications have web-based administration components
: which are usually horribly slow and semi-broken.
: Nothing like MMC or the speed of WTS.
Well, you can live in your own little world if you like. Meanwhile
let me get back to installing a compiler on one of our headless
servers, using the gui installation tool that is running on the
headless server, but displaying on my desktop.
------------------------------
From: "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.linux.sux
Subject: Re: Poor Linux
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 18:30:22 +0000
> Then explain why the following program gets 99% CPU usage, and then
> brings the system to a crawl (so that when I type the kill command to
> get rid of it it takes a few minutes to respond, and pay attention to my
> keystrokes.)
> I'd really like to know if this is something settable in the scheduler
> that I can fix. (Now, keep in mind that the program has to be left
> running for several hours before it will start affecting the performance
> that badly. The longer it is running, the more CPU time gets assigned
> to it.)
>
> /* Program to suck 99% of the CPU time: */
> int main( int c, argv **v)
> {
> int x = 0x0000ffff;
>
> while(x) /* X is always nonzero, but making it a variable
> * like this prevents the compiler from noticing
> * that I'm deliberately building an infinite loop,
> * so it doesn't complain to me.
> */
> {
> x = ~x; /* Silly statement so the loop actually
> * does something and the compiler doesn't
> * try to optimize the loop out of existance.
> */
> }
> return 0;
> }
>
> Compile and run the above program, then wait a few hours. Disclaimer:
> Don't do it on a production system, and no fair setting ulimit
> beforehand of time to manually cap the CPU usage - let the scheduler try
> to figure out what to do with it on its own.
>
> This has been a problem I've seen on HP/UX, Irix, and Linux. I haven't
> tested it on anything else lately so I can't speak for Solaris or
> FreeBSD or AIX off the top of my head.
Um, the processor is showing 100% usage, but my system has by no means
slowed to a crawl. In fact, since I'm not doing any cpu intensive tasks,
I can't notice it at all.
-Ed
--
Did you know that the reason that windows steam up in cold|Edward Rosten
weather is because of all the fish in the atmosphere? |u98ejr
- The Hackenthorpe Book of lies |@
|eng.ox.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: Bill Delphenich <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: MS to Enforce Registration - or Else
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 13:35:15 -0500
Steve Withers wrote:
> It is intersting that the US produced Windows......the country with
> one-party (two faction) politics has also given us no choice on the
> desktop. While politically diverse Europe with multi-party, proportional
> systems as the politcal norm, has given us Open Software and Linux....
>
> Sort of the illusion of freedom (US politics) vs the reality of freedom
> (European politics - outside Britain).
Sadly ironic, huh?
------------------------------
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: MS to Enforce Registration - or Else
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (filthy-mcnasty)
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 18:36:26 0000
Wonderful. I think Billion Dollar Bill may finally have shot himself in
both feet
Steve Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>G'day
>
>I've been following developments closely on this.
>
>It appears that sometime this year all new Microsot software will need
>to be registered....or it will cease to function.
>
>This may offer OS alternatives like Linux a huge toe in the desktop
>door.
--
Will Cornish of Cardigan, UK
No nastier than you and no filthier than usual
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Getting first W2K server
Date: 26 Jan 2001 18:30:21 GMT
Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Perry Pip) writes:
:> On Wed, 24 Jan 2001 23:52:04 -0600,
:> Bobby D. Bryant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
:>
:> >I should have also said in my other post ("not just Microsoft"), that if your
:> >company buys the wrong thing and it doesn't work as advertised, standard
:> >practice is to blame the technical staff for sabotaging it.
:> >
:>
:> Now that's funny....look who Microsoft is blaming for their own web site woes:
:>
:> http://www.cnn.com/2001/TECH/computing/01/25/microsoft.web.sites.reut/index.html
:>
:> "It was an operational error and not the result of any issue with
:> Microsoft or third-party products nor the security of our networks,"
:> Microsoft said in a statement released late on Wednesday.
: So it wasn't DDoS as the Windows people have been saying?
: Hmm, the last time I checked, having your website down for 24 hours is
: a *major* security hole. Especially since windowsupdate was down, as
: were all the service packs, people's e-mail and such.
Having a website down is not a security hole at all, but it might
be the *result* of a security hole (someone breaks in and then
disables your system.) In fact, just the opposite - each
network service you disable increases security, until you get
the degenerate case where nothing works on the network, and then
you are secure (and are ready to try for a C2 certification).
------------------------------
From: Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: MS to Enforce Registration - or Else
Date: 26 Jan 2001 18:56:19 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy Steve Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
: G'day
: I've been following developments closely on this.
: It appears that sometime this year all new Microsot software will need
: to be registered....or it will cease to function.
Well, they *claim* that this will only be an option, not a
requirement - there will be two payment methods for software,
the traditional buy it all up-front style, and the pay-as-you-go
style (with automatic updates). The registration is just for
the pay-as-you-go style. Of course I have about 0 trust in
Microsoft to stick to this claim...
: This may offer OS alternatives like Linux a huge toe in the desktop
: door. With more and more homes being networked and having multiple PCs,
: how many home and small business users are going to be forced to pay up
: and stop using the "One CD fits all" approach they use today?
: In my own case.....I would have to upgrade 7 home PCs every year for
: both Windows and MS Office.....to the tune of lots of dosh per annum. As
: it is, I now have 3 of those systems on Linux...and quite happily.
: But some of my family members are reluctant to give up Windows. I may
: have to suggest to them that they pay for it in future....as I will only
: be paying for Linux software from 2001 onward.
: It is intersting that the US produced Windows......the country with
: one-party (two faction) politics has also given us no choice on the
: desktop. While politically diverse Europe with multi-party, proportional
: systems as the politcal norm, has given us Open Software and Linux....
False. While it is certainly true that open software is much more
internationally developed than Microsoft software is, the GPL was
done in the US, the FSF (GNU) is centered in the US. Without the
existance of GNU, Linux wouldn't have been started. The Linux kernel
was started by a Finn who since then has moved to California,
and today there are still a large number of US people involved,
including "Maddog" Hall (unofficially the second in command after
Linus, I would guess). The infamous RMS is in the US and started
at MIT. The Gnome project was started by a Mexican. Enlightenment was
started by an Australian, KDE was started by (I think) Germans.
The opensource world is diverse and not US-centric, but definately
has a *lot* of US people in it. It just doesn't have the
disproportionate amount of US representation we are used to seeing
in other areas. The US only accounts for 5% of the world's population,
and so it's not surprising at all that it doesn't account for the
majority in a system where anyone in the world can have a hand in
participating. *No* single country has a majority of developers in
the opensource world and that's the way it should be.
: Sort of the illusion of freedom (US politics) vs the reality of freedom
: (European politics - outside Britain).
: There is an underlying cultural thing operating here somewhere...... :-)
: Steve
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (.)
Subject: Re: Getting first W2K server
Date: 26 Jan 2001 19:01:22 GMT
Steve Mading <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> : [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Perry Pip) writes:
> :> On Wed, 24 Jan 2001 23:52:04 -0600,
> :> Bobby D. Bryant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> :>
> :> >I should have also said in my other post ("not just Microsoft"), that if your
> :> >company buys the wrong thing and it doesn't work as advertised, standard
> :> >practice is to blame the technical staff for sabotaging it.
> :> >
> :>
> :> Now that's funny....look who Microsoft is blaming for their own web site woes:
> :>
> :> http://www.cnn.com/2001/TECH/computing/01/25/microsoft.web.sites.reut/index.html
> :>
> :> "It was an operational error and not the result of any issue with
> :> Microsoft or third-party products nor the security of our networks,"
> :> Microsoft said in a statement released late on Wednesday.
> : So it wasn't DDoS as the Windows people have been saying?
> : Hmm, the last time I checked, having your website down for 24 hours is
> : a *major* security hole. Especially since windowsupdate was down, as
> : were all the service packs, people's e-mail and such.
> Having a website down is not a security hole at all, but it might
> be the *result* of a security hole (someone breaks in and then
> disables your system.) In fact, just the opposite - each
> network service you disable increases security, until you get
> the degenerate case where nothing works on the network, and then
> you are secure (and are ready to try for a C2 certification).
Windows 2K clearly qualifies for C2; you cant get to any of its services
at all.
=====.
------------------------------
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