Linux-Advocacy Digest #548, Volume #32 Wed, 28 Feb 01 02:13:05 EST
Contents:
Re: Why Open Source better be careful - The Microsoft Un-American (Marten Kemp)
Re: Why Open Source better be careful - The Microsoft Un-American (Marten Kemp)
Re: Something Seemingly Simple. (Michael Rubenstein)
Re: The Windows guy. (Marten Kemp)
Re: Ethernet card for UNIX/Linux (WarpKat)
Re: NT vs *nix performance (Amphetamine Bob)
Re: My long signature (Michael Vester)
Re: Breaking up is so very hard to do... (Donovan Rebbechi)
Re: Time for a Windows reinstall! (Michael Vester)
Re: why open source software is better (Donovan Rebbechi)
Re: NT vs *nix performance (Donovan Rebbechi)
Re: Mircosoft Tax (Donovan Rebbechi)
Re: Breaking up is so very hard to do... ("Flacco")
Re: NT vs *nix performance (J Sloan)
Re: [OT] .sig ("Z")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Marten Kemp <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why Open Source better be careful - The Microsoft Un-American
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 05:36:40 GMT
moooo wrote:
>
<large amount of steam engine stuff snipped>
> >
> > How did we get on this topic, anyway?
> > -- Marten Kemp
> >
> Why you in a sad 80s new romantic band by any chance Marten?
Huh? If this was a question about me being in a band, no. Otherwise,
pleas rephrase the question a bit more coherently.
-- Marten Kemp
------------------------------
From: Marten Kemp <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why Open Source better be careful - The Microsoft Un-American
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 05:41:17 GMT
Aaron Kulkis wrote:
>
> Marten Kemp wrote:
> >
> > Aaron Kulkis wrote:
> > <<snip>>
> > >
> > > Diesel-electrics were NOT introduced to solve a fuel-consumption problem:
> > > they were introduced because they provide better torque from a dead stop
> > > than steam...allowing an increase in the gross tons per locomotive ratio.
> > >
> > > Also, they can be remote-controlled from one cab by electrical hookups,
> > > allowing ONE crew to harness the power of three or four engines. With
> > > steam, you would still need 1 or 2 people in each engine, and the
> > > linkage would probably (in those day) have to have been mechanical,
> > > not electrical.
> > >
> > <<snip>>
> >
> > Steam engines are rather more maintenance-intensive than diesels, IIRC.
> > There is a lot of plumbing inside a steam engine's boiler, all of which
> > has to be kept leak free.
>
> These days, that's fairly simple. Just use stainless steel, or
> [steel electro-plated with copper] electro-plated with chrome.
The larger the number of pieces, the higher the construction and
maintenance costs. Moot point, since steam is gone except for nostalgia.
>
> >
> > How did we get on this topic, anyway?
>
> Who knows
> Who cares
> Discussions are like that.
True. They go in odd and interesting directions, don't they?
>
> > -- Marten Kemp
>
> --
> Aaron R. Kulkis
> Unix Systems Engineer
> DNRC Minister of all I survey
> ICQ # 3056642
>
> L: "meow" is yet another anonymous coward who does nothing
> but write stupid nonsense about his intellectual superiors.
>
> K: Truth in advertising:
> Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shelala,
> Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakan,
> Special Interest Sierra Club,
> Anarchist Members of the ACLU
> Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
> The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
> Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
>
> J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
> The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
> also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
>
> I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
> challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
> between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
> Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
>
> H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
> premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
> you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
> you are lazy, stupid people"
>
> G: Knackos...you're a retard.
>
> F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
> adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
>
> E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
> her behavior improves.
>
> D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
> ...despite (C) above.
>
> C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
>
> B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
> method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
> direction that she doesn't like.
>
> A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: Michael Rubenstein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.lang.c
Subject: Re: Something Seemingly Simple.
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 00:54:45 -0500
On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 15:53:01 +0000, Richard Heathfield
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>In the C programming language, if you use the printf function, you are
>/required/ to include <stdio.h>. If you use printf, and do not include
>this header, you are no longer writing in C.
Actually, you are not required to include <stdio.h> to use
printf; you may also just code a prototype for the function
yourself.
Including <stdio.h> is, of course, preferred.
--
Michael M Rubenstein
------------------------------
From: Marten Kemp <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: The Windows guy.
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 05:55:59 GMT
Donovan Rebbechi wrote:
>
> On 27 Feb 2001 09:09:33 GMT, Steve Mading wrote:
> >Donovan Rebbechi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >But the argument I've just offered is pretty much the same as the one
> >you objected to. I'm officially confused now.
>
> No, it's completely different. Read the other argument. The other argument
> said (essentially) that "DOS pipes can't do everything that UNIX pipes
> can do, therefore they are not pipes". This argument is obviously
> inadequate (unless you use "UNIX pipe" as a definition of pipe, which
> sort of defines the argument into triviality)
>
> --
> Donovan Rebbechi * http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/ *
> elflord at panix dot com
Actually, neither are *real* pipes. CMS PIPELINES is one of the three
most powerful environments in the known universe, along with REXX and
XEDIT. Oh, we're talking about PCs here? Then go on arguing.
Sorry, couldn't help it. At least you'll have the opportunity to
disparage mainframes instead of each other.
[grins and dons Nomex underwear]
*Real* operating systems can run other operating systems, including
copies of themselves. *Real* machines can have a dozen processors, a
dozen or so gigs of memory and several terabytes of data on a single
box.
-- Marten Kemp
VM/ESA systems admin
------------------------------
From: WarpKat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.linux.sux
Subject: Re: Ethernet card for UNIX/Linux
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 05:55:58 GMT
You can pick up some D-Links or 3Coms that will work nicely with Linux.
Martin Eden wrote:
> Hi everybody.
>
> I need an ethernet card for my new system. I'll dual boot Linux and FreeBSD.
> Any advice on which one to get?
>
> Thanks in advance.
------------------------------
From: Amphetamine Bob <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: NT vs *nix performance
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 21:59:23 -0800
Gary Hallock wrote:
>
> In article <mpVm6.70808$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Chad Myers"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > This is contrary to the press release that came out earlier in 2000 from
> > IBM+Microsoft that said that IBM was going to be deploying Win2K Pro to
> > thousands of their desktops.
Yes that memo exists. Those indeed were IBM's plans. But after a lot
of testing, IBM issued an order forbidding the use of Win2K anywhere
in IBM, except for software testing. The reason given was it was
insecure.
However, NT is used at IBM. I believe, as part of a contract with MS,
that IBM was forced to use Windows internally. However, the
transition has been very slow. In fact, a year ago, a friend of
mine's building was switched over from OS/2 to NT. The entire
building was furious and in open revolt. "We hate it (NT)!!!! OS/2
is so much better," is an exact quote from the fellow.
> >
> > I can find the URL, I suppose, if you don't believe me.
It doesn't matter as that plan has now been superseded by the new
order.
> >
> > I never heard anything about the server side, but IBM has a "dog food"
> > policy, so it wouldn't suprise me if they didn't allow anything other
> > than their own software on the servers.
What is that supposed to mean? Dog food?
>
> It is true that new Thinkpads have W2K installed by default.
This is no matter. The PC division has to preload Windows or they
will go out of business. This division is one of the most pro-MS in
all IBM. It also loses $1 billion a year for several years running.
Something wrong with this picture?
--
Bob - shooting the bozo bit at 550 MHZ :). Wheeeeee! ;)
Microsoft "Tech Support".
1) Re-boot
2) Re-boot
3) Re-install all your software
4) Buy the new release (again)
5) Go to 1
------------------------------
From: Michael Vester <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: My long signature
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 22:46:26 -0700
Aaron Kulkis wrote:
>
> Fuck you all
> The signature will continue to grow at a rate of 1 user per day from now
> on until you all get over it
> This is your punishment for dissing me
>
Obvious forgery. Wrong news server. Out of character, Aaron is
very consistant. Why would he post something like this?
My sig. must be offensive too. It is 7 lines long.
> Aaron R. Kulkis
> Unix Systems Engineer
> DNRC Minister of all I survey
> ICQ # 3056642
<snip>
--
Michael Vester
A credible Linux advocate
"The avalanche has started, it is
too late for the pebbles to vote"
Kosh, Vorlon Ambassador to Babylon 5
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi)
Subject: Re: Breaking up is so very hard to do...
Date: 28 Feb 2001 06:07:51 GMT
On Wed, 28 Feb 2001 04:22:21 GMT, Flacco wrote:
>What bothers me is the likelihood that MS will find some way to "freeze
>out" free OS's, maybe through exclusionary deals
Maybe. I think it's much harder for them to do this now than it was 5 or so
years back though.
> and "intellectual
>property" legislation.
Thankfully, they don't get to write legislation.
--
Donovan Rebbechi * http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/ *
elflord at panix dot com
------------------------------
From: Michael Vester <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Time for a Windows reinstall!
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 22:54:39 -0700
Aaron Ginn wrote:
>
> Well, I've finally run into a problem with Windows that I can't
> solve. Yesterday, I was copying a CD on Windows using Nero. During
> the copy, I saved the ripped image to disk and then copied to my new
> CD. Nero was supposed to delete the CD image after the write but it
> didn't. Yesterday, my C: drive filled up because the CD image was not
> deleted. Now I'm having all kinds of problems with Windows, the most
> annoying of which is that my scanning software does not see my scanner
> anymore. I used the scanner before the CD write and it worked fine.
> Now I can't get the software to even find it. I tried reinstalling
> the drivers, changing the BIOS settings on the parallel port, and
> changing the cable connection to every possible configuration.
> Nothing worked.
>
> I've had Windows on this computer for almost two years without a
> reinstall, so I'm actually surprised it has lasted this long.
> Performance has reached an absolute low: cursor pauses of about 5-10
> seconds, 3-4 blue screens a day, the inability to run more than one
> program at a time without completely locking up the computer.
>
> If anyone has any suggestions, I'd be happy to hear them. My last
> hope is to run Scandisk and Disk Defragment in hopes that the problem
> will fix itself somehow, but I'm not confident.
>
> I actually don't hate Microsoft. I just think it's ridiculous that a
> software company with so much cash and so many talented programmers
> could churn out such shoddy products. Even though Linux has fewer
> apps available, at least it's built on a solid foundation. Windows is
> the house built on sand.
>
Simple. Install Linux. If you must run losedos, ghost a
workable configuration and burn it to a cd. I can reload my
losedos system in about 15 minutes complete with applications.
I have been burned many times by an OS that gets more unstable
with usage and installing applications. Even the MCSE's are
programmed to reinstall rather than waste time trying to make
it work.
> Aaron
>
> --
> Aaron J. Ginn Phone: 480-814-4463
> Motorola SemiCustom Solutions Pager: 877-586-2318
> 1300 N. Alma School Rd. Fax : 480-814-4463
> Chandler, AZ 85226 M/D CH260 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--
Michael Vester
A credible Linux advocate
"The avalanche has started, it is
too late for the pebbles to vote"
Kosh, Vorlon Ambassador to Babylon 5
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi)
Crossposted-To: gnu.misc.discuss,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,misc.int-property
Subject: Re: why open source software is better
Date: 28 Feb 2001 06:13:47 GMT
On Wed, 28 Feb 2001 00:07:16 -0500, vrml3d.com wrote:
>
>> The subject line for this message should be "why open source software
>> is better for the *customer*".
>
>No, it should be "why open source software is better for the customer in the
>short run". Anything that drives producers out of the market in the long
>run is bad for consumers in the long run, business cycles not withstanding.
I don't think it's clear than open source software drives anyone out of
the market.
>Anecdotal evidence suggests a serious decline in shareware applications,
>with open source an obvious culprit.
Doubtful. One of the obvious problems with this line is that the shareware
apps and the open source software usually don't run on the same platform.
Also, to make this argument, you'd need to show that the decline in
shareware did not meet with a corresponding increase in open source.
A decline in the number of shareware apps is not necessarily a bad
thing if it's met with a corresponding increase in open source
applications.
--
Donovan Rebbechi * http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/ *
elflord at panix dot com
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi)
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,alt.linux.sux,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: NT vs *nix performance
Date: 28 Feb 2001 06:15:53 GMT
On Wed, 28 Feb 2001 18:01:02 +1300, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>> > What makes you think there would be a problem? Let's assume for the
>> > moment that his hardware is up to the test.
>>
>> Dude... he's running a pentium pro 200 - it CANNOT generate that much data.
>> Hell, the bus he's on can't generate that much bandwidth.
>
>Give me some numbers, show me the proof. What bus are you talking about?
>The CPU bus? ISA bus for the network card? Were there any PPro
>motherboards supporting PCI?
My pentium I motherboards support PCI, and I believe some 486s did. I'd
be very surprised if the PPro did not.
--
Donovan Rebbechi * http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/ *
elflord at panix dot com
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi)
Crossposted-To: alt.linux.sux,alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: Mircosoft Tax
Date: 28 Feb 2001 06:20:35 GMT
On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 20:11:03 -0800, Keldon Warlord 2000 wrote:
>
>the linsux people, of course.
What's a "linsux person" anyway, is that a word for one of those stupid
Wintrollbots that posts in cola ?
--
Donovan Rebbechi * http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/ *
elflord at panix dot com
------------------------------
From: "Flacco" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Breaking up is so very hard to do...
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 01:17:30 -0500
> Maybe. I think it's much harder for them to do this now than it was 5 or
so
> years back though.
I contend it's easier, because the business interests with which they must
conspire are coming around to the fact that there is a HUGE amount of money
to be milked from the public if they can lock these things up.
------------------------------
From: J Sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,alt.linux.sux,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: NT vs *nix performance
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 06:35:17 GMT
Donovan Rebbechi wrote:
> Some wintroll wrote:
> >> Dude... he's running a pentium pro 200 - it CANNOT generate that much data.
> >> Hell, the bus he's on can't generate that much bandwidth.
Obviously it can, because it did.
> >Give me some numbers, show me the proof. What bus are you talking about?
> >The CPU bus? ISA bus for the network card? Were there any PPro
> >motherboards supporting PCI?
Gee, let's see:
# lspci
00:09.0 SCSI storage controller: Symbios Logic Inc. (formerly NCR) 53c875 (rev
04)
00:0c.0 System peripheral: Compaq Computer Corporation System Management
Controller (rev 01)
00:0d.0 VGA compatible controller: Cirrus Logic GD 5430/40 [Alpine] (rev 22)
00:0f.0 Non-VGA unclassified device: Intel Corporation 82375EB (rev 15)
00:14.0 RAM memory: Intel Corporation 450KX/GX [Orion] - 82453KX/GX Memory
controller (rev 05)
00:19.0 Host bridge: Intel Corporation 450KX/GX [Orion] - 82454KX/GX PCI bridge
(rev 06)
00:1a.0 Host bridge: Intel Corporation 450KX/GX [Orion] - 82454KX/GX PCI bridge
(rev 06)
01:01.0 PCI bridge: IBM IBM27-82351 (rev 07)
01:03.0 PCI bridge: IBM IBM27-82351 (rev 01)
01:0b.0 Class ff00: Compaq Computer Corporation PCI Hotplug Controller (rev 02)
02:00.0 Unknown mass storage controller: Compaq Computer Corporation Smart-2/P
RAID Controller (rev 03)
03:00.0 Network controller: Compaq Computer Corporation Netelligent 10/100 Dual
(rev 10)
OK, now who doesn't think this old Compaq 6500 supports PCI?
jjs
------------------------------
From: "Z" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.lang.c
Subject: Re: [OT] .sig
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 07:49:25 +0100
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Once upon a while "Aaron Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Mathew Hendry wrote:
>>
>> On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 06:44:49 -0500, Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> >Mathew Hendry wrote:
>> >>
>> >> On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 04:35:08 -0500, Aaron Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >Z wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> Actually that is the greatest shit talking shitter I've ever
>> >> >> seen.
>> >> >
>> >> >When was the last time you crawled under machine-gun fire, seeing
>> >> >the tracers flying literally within arm's reach of your head?
>> >>
>> >> I didn't know they were still using agent orange over there.
>> >
>> >Answer the question!
>>
>> I'm sure Zoran can answer it himself, if he hasn't killfiled you already. Since
>> I believe he hails from Yugoslavia, I wouldn't be too surprised if your childish
>> challenge falls flat.
>
> Depends on where he lives.
It really doesn't depend on where one lives! You don't live
outside the US but you still are proude of your engagements
in some foreign countries. What the hell gives you the right
to play war all over the f...ing world?
Next, since when do americans differentiate between different
european countries? You know that there is europe usually
but nothing more! (Berlin is in France!) :-)
I live in Germany, but am originally from Croatia. I've had to
much frontations with the so called civil war in Yugoslavia.
But that doesn't count here. That is simply the point.
Now, the time has come for you to hit my killfile, as
of so many people in here!
*plonk*
--
Z ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
"LISP is worth learning for the profound enlightenment experience
you will have when you finally get it; that experience will make you
a better programmer for the rest of your days." -- Eric S. Raymond
------------------------------
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