Linux-Advocacy Digest #152, Volume #33 Wed, 28 Mar 01 04:13:03 EST
Contents:
Re: I regretfully conclude that Linux is a piece of CRAP. (Matthew Gardiner)
Re: Kulkis not Chad, Gates (was Re Unix/Linux Professionalism) ("David Brown")
Re: Why can't we just all be friends? (Matthew Gardiner)
Re: Linux dying (GreyCloud)
Re: Linux dying (GreyCloud)
Re: I regretfully conclude that Linux is a piece of CRAP. (Terry Porter)
Re: New worm infests Linux machines/Exposes root backdoor (GreyCloud)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: I regretfully conclude that Linux is a piece of CRAP.
Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 20:38:18 +1200
In New Zealand, we hate large, bossy corporates that dictate what should happen, hence
the
reason why it never happen in New Zealand, it would be political suicide. Most tax
cuts of the
last 9 years have been for Jane and Joe average, not large corporates that produce
nothing.
With that being said, three companies come to mind, The Warehouse, Hubbards Foods and
Mainfreight are three companies that pay their taxes, treat there employees with
respect, and
still turn over a bloody reasonable profit. Those are examples of companies that New
Zealanders
like. Unfortunately, there is a bottom-kissing-cultural inbred in the Yankee brain
that makes
them put large corporates on pedestals (for those who don't know, its a small chair),
claiming
how great they are, an example of this idiocy would be Microsoft, how many, uneducated
idiots
still put Microsoft on a soap box claiming how great they are?
A couple of days ago, a brewer (DB Brewers), which is a multi-billion dollar company,
tried to
close down one of its manufacturing plants in the West Coast (in the South Island,
http://search.nzoom.com:9999/?NZoom+NZoomHTML+start0+quant10+search=Monteith for the
full
story), simply put, they were going to close down a very profitable plant just to save
20%, and
move the production of the "boutique" beer up to Auckland, the locals got pissed off,
and what
do you know, a nation wide boycott of DB Products, after 3 days, they (DB) changed
their tune,
and have agreed to keep the plant open.
Matthew Gardiner
"Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
> Matthew Gardiner wrote:
> >
> > That doesn't include the tragic devestation corporate welfare has done to the
>environment
> > and the community, as much needed resources are rediverted to lining the pockets of
> > Multi-nationals and greedy politians, aka, large companys living off the hard work
>of the
> > average Joe and Jane.
>
> Very true. And as usual, the corporate welfare came into law under the auspices
> of the party which POSES as "defenders of the under-privileged against the
> evil corporations"
>
> In the United States, it's the Democrat party which has implemented the
> vast majority of corporate welfare.
>
> >
> > Matthew Gardiner
> >
> > "Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
> >
> > > Matthew Gardiner wrote:
> > > >
> > > > The question at hand is why does your government give out subsidies, and price
> > > > garentee schemes on unsustainable, inefficient agricultural sector output.
>Also, that
> > > > doesn't include the non-tariff barriers the US has on imports, such as
>quota's, slow
> > > > import documentation processing etc etc The reason why I bring up this
>question is
> > > > that New Zealand is mainly and agricultural based economy (as New Zealand has
>the
> > > > largest Dairy Co-Op in the world). I also must admitt that the US is not the
>only one
> > > > guilty of this hanis crime of protecting inefficient industries, Europe is
>another
> > > > example of over subsidise, inefficient famers getting a hand out.
> > > >
> > >
> > > Damn straigth.
> > >
> > > Reminds me of the PDQ Bach song..
> > >
> > > "The farmer on the Dole
> > > The farmer on the Dole
> > > Hi ho the merry-o
> > > The farmer on the Dole"
> > >
> > > You can be assured that this did NOT go over very well at a University with
> > > such a large agriculture school and vet school like Purdue.
> > >
> > > > Matthew Gardiner
> > > >
> > > > chrisv wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >Very easy accomplised with an ULTRA-ULTRA-ULTRA protected economy, example
>of this
> > > > >
> > > > > What a total moron! What a bufoon! What an idiot!
> > > > >
> > > > > Sorry, but "ULTRA-ULTRA-ULTRA protected" to describe what's obviously
> > > > > one of the most open markets in the world? What a stupid sh*t!
> > > > >
> > > > > By the way, one stupid sheep example does not equal an entire market.
> > > > > Moron.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Aaron R. Kulkis
> > > Unix Systems Engineer
>
> --
> Aaron R. Kulkis
> Unix Systems Engineer
> DNRC Minister of all I survey
> ICQ # 3056642
>
> K: Truth in advertising:
> Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shelala,
> Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakan,
> Special Interest Sierra Club,
> Anarchist Members of the ACLU
> Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
> The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
> Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
>
> J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
> The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
> also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
>
> I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
> challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
> between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
> Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
>
> H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
> premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
> you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
> you are lazy, stupid people"
>
> G: Knackos...you're a retard.
>
> F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
> adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
>
> E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
> her behavior improves.
>
> D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
> ...despite (C) above.
>
> C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
>
> B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
> method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
> direction that she doesn't like.
>
> A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: "David Brown" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: Kulkis not Chad, Gates (was Re Unix/Linux Professionalism)
Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 10:32:58 +0200
GreyCloud wrote in message ...
>David Brown wrote:
>>
>> GreyCloud wrote in message ...
>> >
>> >Thats because we have one very important ingredient... FREEDOM!
>> >We can either choose or not to choose without having a gun held to your
>> >head.
>> >Take a look at Cuba.. go live there and tell me its a good life. Food
>> >problems, scrounging for very little goods, while one fat chicken fucker
>> >Castro reaps the benefits of the poors' labor.
>> >
>>
>> What do you mean by freedom? A Cuban today can critisise his/her
government
>> with much more freedom than Americans in the Macarthy days. Of all
>> dictorships in the world, Cuba is probably the freest, and one that works
>> hardest for the benifit of the people (just look at its health system -
>> despite the lack of money and materials, it takes much better care of the
>> poor than the US health system). In Cuba, there are great limitations
such
>> as the choice of goods in shops and the prospect of trade with other
>> countries, but that the limits apply to the country as a whole. Cuba's
main
>> problems stem mostly from USA's inhumane oppression of the country.
>
>I have freedom to make as much money as I know how. I can live in the
>lifestyle of my choosing.
And those that don't know how are left behind in the dirt. The US system is
obsessively money-oriented - more so than any other capatilist country.
I am not trying to argue for or against capatilism or communism - each
system has its advantages and disadvantages. But within these classes,
there is a wide range of attitudes and philosophies. Cuba is a communist
country which makes a great effort to care for its citizens - the USA is a
capatilist country which takes great care to disregard its citizens'
well-being entirely. After all, its a free country and a free market - if
you can't afford your medical bill, try a cheaper hospital. And if you
can't do that, you are free to choose a lifestyle with a high income so that
you can afford treatment (spot the flaw in this reasoning).
>I have observed nothing but squalor down
>there. Only the U.S. does not do business with them. The other
>countries do business with Cuba.
The US forces other countries to comply with their arrogant and petty
mallous towards Cuba. Yes, other countries can trade with Cuba, but the US
makes sure it costs them.
>So why hasn't the squalor been taken
>care of?
Um, because the US is trying to strangle the country? The US makes great
noises about its love of freedom, but it seems to be very keen on forcing
the rest of the world to follow its version of "freedom".
>You call that good?? Why do we see our own Coast Guard
>turning back Cubans on life rafts, boats, or whatever they are floating
>on? Why are their own people leaving and risking their lives to
>leave?? No one is stopping people leaving our borders. Think again
>about the freedom issue. I have been in foreign countries and believe
>me we got it made in this country as compared to a lot of others.
In the US, there is the *potential* to have a better life and more money
(same thing, really, in the US). Many people think it is worth the gamble,
and move there from all over the world, from both capatist and communist
countries. Most fail.
>
>> Don't make the mistake of judging all countries alike just because they
have
>> a dictator. Castro is not "reaping the benifits of the poor's labour" -
>> even if he wanted to, he could not because he can't sell the country's
>> products on a fair market. There are any number of other countries in
South
>> America and Africa with far more corrupt dictatorships which are well
>> supported by the US and friends, just because they have the name
"democracy"
>> instead of "communism". Who cares that there is only one name allowed on
>> the ballot paper, as long as they are not communist?
>>
>All countries are not alike. How would you know that Castro is not
>reaping the benefits of his people?? I see no evidence of his people
>living in a good lifestyle.
Where is your evidence that Castro is living a good lifestyle? In many
African countries (and in other parts of the world), the corruption is
obvious - while most of the people starve, the president ("democratically"
ellected by cutting off the hands of the opponent's supporters) lives in a
grand palace with great luxury. But somehow this is OK for the US (and
other western countries - Europe is not entirely blameless).
>I've seen in Panama people that live in
>squalor too. That gov. has taken a different path of money laundering.
>Isn't it odd that the down town strip is loaded with Bank Of America,
>Chase Manhatten, ETc. The shoe shine boys don't deposit their money
>there and making the banks rich. The banks there get rich laundering
>money. The world is a corrupt place, and I didn't make it I just try to
>live in it. But I'd rather not live in any communist country.
So Panama is very corrupt. What difference does that make to Cuba? Is
Panama capatalist or communist (or something else entirely)?
>
>> And look at the US itself - the president is "elected" on the basis of
being
>> the richest and most manipulative, and having the right friends in the
right
>> places - so what if the other guy got more votes across the country as a
>> whole?
>
>--
>V
------------------------------
From: Matthew Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why can't we just all be friends?
Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 20:42:29 +1200
So, what's your point? Remember this phrase:
"Religion is the opium of the people" ---- Karl Marx
In a nut shell, "stop living in a world of fantasy, and get back to
concentrating on what is important on earth, in this life"
Matthew Gardiner
"Brandur K. Jacobsen" wrote:
> Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for
> it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay," says the Lord.
>
> _brandur_
>
> >pip wrote:
> > > You hath read the scared scrolls incorrectly. "Under the sun"
> refereth
> > ^^^^^^
> >
> > I must correct my error. My noble intention was to say "sacred". You
> see
> > my friend - if you post under the win32 that you are bound by whips
> and
> > chains to toil with thy API's for the eveil of money, then your
> posting
> > contains blasphemies towards the penguin. I am to go and smash
> through a
> > window now as retribution...
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux dying
Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 00:44:08 -0800
Interconnect wrote:
>
> Jan Johanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:3abd198b$0$28176$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >
> > "David Steinberg" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:99ive2$525$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > Chad Myers ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> > > : Compare that with Red Hat, who considers it a major acheivement if
> > > : they only lose x amount vs y amount. Meeting analysts expectations
> > > : consists of not losing as much as normal.
> > >
> > > : And we won't even go into market cap. That $52 that MS has is
> > > : after dozens of splits.
> > >
> > > What a pointless thread.
> > >
> > > If your point is that Microsoft is a larger and more profitable company
> > > than Red Hat, I don't think anyone here is going to disagree.
> > >
> > > However, if you'd like anyone to conclude from this that Linux is dying,
> > > as the subject suggests, you've got your work cut out for you. Quit
> > > telling us what we already know, and prove to us that Linux is dying.
> >
> > How about the fact that despite Linux is free (versus a bizzillion dollars
> > (or so it's claimed by linvocates) for Windows CALs) and that it's been
> > hyped beyond all recognition - it's still not beating NT/W2K installations
> > worldwide?
> >
> Dear Troll,
>
> We purchased Mandrake7.0 at work (2 CD's.)
>
> Question: How many machines is this software installed on?
>
> Answer: Put simply you have no idea.
>
> PS. Try thinking before commiting your inane thoughts to this newsgroup.
(I wonder if this is Microsofts' Bob we're talking to??)
--
V
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux dying
Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 00:46:58 -0800
"Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
>
> Interconnect wrote:
> >
> > Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:TfHv6.30730$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > >
> > > "Brent R" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > > Chad Myers wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > "Jan Johanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > > > news:3abe4f75$0$48801$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > "Charlie Ebert" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > > > > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > > > > > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Brent R wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >Seriously... it's a bargain market right now... the chance that
> > > > > > > >Microsoft will be in business 5 years from now is a lot better
> > than a
> > > > > > > >Linux company's chance. Even though I have conflicing views on
> > their
> > > > > > > >products, Microsoft is a sure bet and solid as a rock.
> > > > > > > >--
> > > > > > > >- Brent
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Seriously, anybody who thinks Linux will just blow away is a
> > > > > > > total fool.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > blow away? disappear? not likely, not soon at least. but, so what...
> > what
> > > > > > good is it if you have a great underground user base of loyal linux
> > > users...
> > > > > > so? all we can hope for as that they'll just go away quietly to
> > their own
> > > > > > little world... far far away from reality...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Even if the commercial market turned away from the product,
> > > > > > > Linux will still be there and be developed. It already has
> > > > > > > a loyal user base and that user base is unshakable.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Anytime you put a FREE product on the market against a
> > commercialized,
> > > > > > > expensive, copyrighted product - the FREE product will win.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > really? EVERY time? can you name some others?
> > > > >
> > > > > Let's see, StarOffice.. oh no, that's right...
> > > >
> > > > StarOffice is more popular than Office?
> > > >
> > > > > How 'bout Linux, for example? Oh no, that's right...
> > >
> > > (Hint, that's my point)
> > > I was being sarcastic and supporting Jan. =)
> > > Neither StarOffice, nor Linux, nor BSD, nor WinE are more
> > > popular than their MS counterparts.
> > >
> > > So, somehow (not suprisingly) Charlie Ebert's "logic"
> > > is incorrect.
> > >
> > > He says, "the FREE product will win", but that
> > > simply isn't true.
> > >
> > > -c
> >
> > It won't happen overnight but eventually the FREE product will win. Just
> > give LINUX more time to improve GUI aspects for desktop users who are not
> > interested in CLI and dev work.
> >
> > Linux will *SMASH* Windows when it eventually provides the end user with a
> > fully featured graphical environment and easier to install and more
> > widespread support for 3D cards, sound, CD burning etc.
> >
> > Also as more people develop games for Linux this will also increase the OS
> > popularity. e.g. Black Isle studios is making NWN for Linux.
> >
> > I imagine anytime in the next 1-3 years I will be Windows free. I have even
> > managed to get some Windows only games working under Linux using WINE. The
> > future looks *BRIGHT* The main thing for me with keeping windows is
> > allowing me to run my Games and an old Access95 database.
>
> ...the future's so bright.... I gotta wear shades...
>
> >
> > By the way why won't Microsoft release it's API calls so that the WINE team
> > can get applications written for Windows running under Linux. That would be
> > a *TRUE* test of OS popularity. Also why is there an Apple Mac version of
> > MS Office but NOT one for Linux. I think you know the answer. More like
> > Windows is the OS that will eventually die a slow death.
>
> --
I see interconnect has found Beavis and Butthead.
> Aaron R. Kulkis
> Unix Systems Engineer
> DNRC Minister of all I survey
> ICQ # 3056642
>
> K: Truth in advertising:
> Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shelala,
> Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakan,
> Special Interest Sierra Club,
> Anarchist Members of the ACLU
> Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
> The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
> Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
>
> J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
> The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
> also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
>
> I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
> challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
> between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
> Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
>
> H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
> premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
> you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
> you are lazy, stupid people"
>
> G: Knackos...you're a retard.
>
> F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
> adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
>
> E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
> her behavior improves.
>
> D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
> ...despite (C) above.
>
> C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
>
> B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
> method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
> direction that she doesn't like.
>
> A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
--
V
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Terry Porter)
Subject: Re: I regretfully conclude that Linux is a piece of CRAP.
Reply-To: No-Spam
Date: 28 Mar 2001 08:56:59 GMT
On Wed, 28 Mar 2001 02:08:16 -0500, Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Terry Porter wrote:
>>
>> On Tue, 27 Mar 2001 14:35:38 GMT, Brent R <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >
>> >Of course, all software worth having costs money. Only broken lawn
>> >chairs and 8-tracks are given away for free.
>>
>> In the Free Software world, the above statement is definitely false.
>>
>> Try www.geda.org and run the free Linux electronic design software there, then
>> tell me how much better the comercial offerings (costing around $5k) are?
>
>Georgia Economic Development Association.
>
>Can you check that URL again?
Oops its :-
http://www.geda.seul.org
My applogies for the error folks :)
Terry
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: New worm infests Linux machines/Exposes root backdoor
Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 01:03:34 -0800
"T. Max Devlin" wrote:
>
> Said GreyCloud in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Mon, 26 Mar 2001 15:39:10
> [...]
> >> >Win9x sucks, though, we've already established that. That's why MS is
> >> >ditching it and going with WinXP which is based on the NT/2K kernel.
> >>
> >> Yes, but we've already established that NT, 2K, and XP all suck, too.
> >> That's the problem.
> >
> >Just refering to win9x series... I claim here as I have earlier that I
> >don't know anything about NT. I leave that to others. But, considering
> >MS track record of reliability, their credibility is in grave doubts
> >here.
>
> Yes, that's a very wise position to take, obviously. NT is, indeed,
> much more stable as an OS than DOS, and 2K does improve on that, as
> well. But I assure you the only reason anyone would consider NT or 2K
> "reliable" is if they've never seriously used anything *but* WinDOS.
> You know how horrid that is. So its no surprise, hmm, that NT or 2K is
> 'the bee's knees' for the Windroid, given the comparison.
>
> I said before that NT is more stable *as an OS*, because the point is,
> as a *platform*, its every bit as unreliable as any other Windows. And
> this, of course, is where the bad design of Windows really shines. NT,
> of course (including W2K and XP) doesn't fall over every time an
> application coughs up a lung, like WinDOS does. But it does crash,
> bomb, freeze, lock, wedge, glitch, or otherwise require a
> re-initialization (to arbitrary extent) on a routine basis.
>
> --
> T. Max Devlin
> *** The best way to convince another is
> to state your case moderately and
> accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
Thats what I thought. I had an older distro on my box but an app in X
froze up, so I alt-F1 to get a virtual terminal, logged in as root, did
a ps -ax and found the ID of that process and killed it. Logged out of
root, did an alt-F(?) (forgot) and back in to my original X gui and
everything was back again. Its one of the best features I've found and
not in any other O/S that I know of.
--
V
------------------------------
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