Linux-Advocacy Digest #617, Volume #34 Sat, 19 May 01 04:13:03 EDT
Contents:
Re: Linux posts #1 TPC-H result (W2K still better) ("Les Mikesell")
Re: Mandrake astroturfing? ("Les Mikesell")
Re: Microsoft BACKDOORS AGAIN! MORE CHEATERY!!! ("Les Mikesell")
Re: Discuss Linux Here! Flame Kulkis Somewhere Else Please! (Ray Chason)
Re: W2K/IIS proves itself over Linux/Tux ("Les Mikesell")
Re: Linux beats Win2K (again) (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Linux beats Win2K (again) (Pete Goodwin)
Re: Mandrake 8 sets the standard - for Desktop users anyway. (Pete Goodwin)
Re: W2K/IIS proves itself over Linux/Tux (GreyCloud)
Re: W2K/IIS proves itself over Linux/Tux (GreyCloud)
Who to install a .gz.tar file? (Lamar Thomas)
Re: Linux beats Win2K (again) (GreyCloud)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Les Mikesell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux posts #1 TPC-H result (W2K still better)
Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 05:11:21 GMT
"Ayende Rahien" <Don'[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:9e2ni2$137$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> "Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:9e1mjh$lor$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > Windows comes with WSH, which come with VBS & JS support. You can add
> > > Perl & Python from activestate.com (free). C#, VB.NET comes with .NET
> > > beta, and there are also other languages that you can hook there, I
> > > believe.
> >
> > Sounds better than it was, though with UNIX, you can use an arbitrary
> > executable as the interpreter.
>
> You can do the same in Windows, what is your point?
How do you make a .bat file interpret itself with perl and pass some
arguments as it starts? Under unix, making the first line:
#!/usr/bin/perl -w
would make perl execute it and turn on warnings.
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: "Les Mikesell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Mandrake astroturfing?
Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 05:38:11 GMT
"Flacco" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:cW_M6.13901$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> I've noticed a lot of messages, in a lot of places, praising the new
> Mandrake release - in the newsgroups, in talk-backs of the various Linux
> sites and ZDNet...
>
> Some of them don't seem particularly "natural", some seem repetitive, and
> sometimes they are just barely relevant to the message to which they
> reply.
>
> Is there some kind of Mandrake astroturf campaign underway?
>
> Just an observation...
No, they really did a good job on autodecting hardware. As late as the
3rd beta it wasn't working with either a Toshiba laptop's PCMCIA
network card or an Adaptec scsi controller on the machines I tested
but the 8.0 release worked right on both, and automatically set up
an existing Win2k partition for dual booting.
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: "Les Mikesell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Microsoft BACKDOORS AGAIN! MORE CHEATERY!!!
Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 05:40:59 GMT
"Erik Funkenbusch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:yCjN6.1642$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> > Only what MS told any publication or editor... pure spin doctoring.
> > Doesn't take a genius to spot it either.
> > It's MS that is spinning its tales.
>
> Ok, so now The Register isn't smart enough to spot FUD? Any way you spin
> it, you're nailing your favorite publication and will never be able to use
> it as a reliable source to back up your claims again.
How can anyone know the truth without access to the source? Did MS offer
it for an independent audit?
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: Ray Chason <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Discuss Linux Here! Flame Kulkis Somewhere Else Please!
Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 05:42:13 -0000
"spicerun" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Too much bandwidth has been wasted on Offtopic Flames! The Linux/MS
>bashing is far more interesting and Ontopic for this group.
Amen. Ignore (i.e. plonk) Kooklis and he'll go away.
--
--------------===============<[ Ray Chason ]>===============--------------
PGP public key at http://www.smart.net/~rchason/pubkey.asc
Delenda est Windoze
------------------------------
From: "Les Mikesell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: W2K/IIS proves itself over Linux/Tux
Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 06:13:19 GMT
"Jan Johanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:3afdd7fd$0$82794$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> >
> > I was referring to this Jan fellow, specifically. By the way he presents
> > himself around here, he strikes me more as high school kid than a
> > professional.
>
> Perhaps because you hate my in-your-face style of debate. I don't dance
> around the topic. I throw facts fast and furious. I give some hard lines
> instead of grey conversation. I'm stating as a fact I've got W2K servers
> that are perfectly reliable. You just don't want to accept that. HELL - it
> would be even better if I were a high school kid so I could add in: "and a
> high school kid apparently can setup a server better than you unix-gurus
who
> can't keep windows 2000 running for a day without a crash- AHAHA"
You still haven't told us what this server serves. It isn't hard to keep
an idle box running.
> > It makes a good desktop OS. I've not heard flattering reviews of its'
> > abilities as a server. (I don't take testimonials here under
consideration
> > at all, BTW, as they tend to be colored more by individual bias than by
> > accuracy. I listen to folks I've known and dealt with for years and who
> are
> > competent enough to know what they're talking about. They don't much
care
> > for it)
>
> obviously your opinion has been set by others and not your own experiences
> so I see no further value in debating with you over something you've no
1st
> hand experience in
My experience is that IIS 5.0 crashes by popping up a dialog box and waiting
for someone to click the button several times a day on servers using
the msxml3.dll object to do xslt formatting. Once in a while it won't
restart even after clicking the button. If you would like to debate
about how nice this is, go for it.
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux beats Win2K (again)
Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 06:44:41 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> I think the guys who use computers to do number crunching
> (e.g. on Crays) would disagree.
And they're in the majority, are they?
--
Pete
------------------------------
From: Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux beats Win2K (again)
Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 06:49:12 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> Hardly. I beleive ASCI White still holds that record - 12.3 teraflops
> for the first version released a year ago. The goal is 100 teraflops by
> 2004.
>
> http://www.llnl.gov/asci/platforms/white/
Interesting! And what OS is that running? Linux?
AIX, IBM's proprietary implementation of UNIX.
--
Pete
------------------------------
From: Pete Goodwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Mandrake 8 sets the standard - for Desktop users anyway.
Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 06:55:12 GMT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
> > I installed Mandrake 8.0 on my old PC166 - it went ok. I see the
> > installer has improved. I'm still mystified by the 'select % of packages
> > you want installed' - how can you install 45% of gcc, I wonder? 8)
>
> Mandrake just doesn't install smaller apps or games, in that case
> I assume.
You assume - you don't know!
> > I've not tried it on my dual network AMD Duron 850MHz, the one with SuSE
> > 7.1 and the manually started DHCP. Why should I go through yet-another-
> > install for a package that didn't work too well with 7.1 and 7.2?
>
> Fun ;-)
If I want fun, I go play Serious Sam, Undying or Unreal Tournament. All
of them with 3D positional audio. It's quite an experience, and currently
_not available_ on Linux.
> Find out why, and fix it ?
Delete it and use something that works?
> > I've seen recommendations elsewhere to _not_ do this.
>
> Yeah, I think that seamless upgrades are just not possible, either with
> Linux OR Windows.
Yet I've done a few upgrades with Windows and they appear to work.
> At least with Linuxits as easy as saving your /home dir,then just
> installing the new version from scratch.
That saves your data... well that's not hard on Windows.
--
Pete
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: W2K/IIS proves itself over Linux/Tux
Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 00:04:18 -0700
Snaggler wrote:
>
> On 18 May 2001 20:24:12 -0500, "Jan Johanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Edward Rosten" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >news:9duli0$rlp$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> >> >> Linux improves for free. Guffaw.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > If your time is worth nothing...tee hee...
> >> >>
> >> >> If your time is worth nothing, install Linux.
> >> >>
> >> >> If both your time and money are worth nothing, then install Microsoft.
> >> >
> >> > I am convinced there is almost no way you attend oxford - unless your
> >> > parents paid off admissions...
> >>
> >> Hahahaha! LOL!
> >>
> >> You checked the root of my email address then!
> >>
> >> Well, I've got news for you buddy, my parents didn't pay off admissions
> >> (that kind of stuff doesn't happen any more) and besides if they did, I
> >> would have failed my first exams with flying colours and have been kicked
> >> out. Oh, BTW I passed, so I'm good enough to stay here.
> >>
> >> If you still don't believe me, go to the following URL:
> >>
> >> http://users.ox.ac.uk
> >>
> >> And look under my name under private pages. If you're lazy, here's a
> >> short cut:
> >>
> >> http://users.ox.ac.uk/~scat1148/
> >>
> >> -Ed
> >
> >he said "scat" hehehe
> >
> Yeah, that usually makes airheads giggle.
So that's where Beavis and Butthead had gone to! :-)
--
V
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: W2K/IIS proves itself over Linux/Tux
Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 00:02:04 -0700
Michael Vester wrote:
>
> GreyCloud wrote:
> >
> > Matthew Gardiner wrote:
> > >
> > > > It seems that Cal. isn't the only state having troubles with black outs.
> > > > We're starting to see some server farms drop off the net for a while
> > > > because the server farms aren't being told a rolling black out is
> > > > coming.
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > V
> > >
> > > Why not build more power plants? New Zealand is already building two more power
> > > plants to handle the ever increasing demand. 70-80% of power is from hydro, and
>the
> > > rest is from Geothermal, Coal, and Gas fired plants. Up at the garbage dump
>there
> > > is a small power plant running off the methane produced from the rubbish dump,
>so,
> > > maybe California should setup one of those outside Microsoft to capture all the
>crap
> > > that they produced.
> > >
> > > Matthew Gardiner
> >
> > Power Plants?? We can't because all the environmentalists won't allow
> > it. They don't like logging either. Sure hope they don't miss their
> > toilet paper.
> >
> > --
> > V
> We are facing the same problems here in Alberta. Caused by deregulation
> without enough generating capacity. Already had two short blackouts this
> May. I just acquired a much bigger UPS. The new UPS should be good for a
> solid half hour. It will be installed sometime this weekend. The old UPS
> will be relegated to running my alarm clock. Was late for work once
> because of an overnight outage. Woke up to a flashing 12:00.
>
It seems to me when anything gets deregulated it sends a signal to that
particular industry to start using any tactics necessary to jack up the
prices. The population didn't increase that much in one year to cause
these power shortages. Most of the power industry says that they have
their plant down due to maintenance. They used to do these in a short
period of time and made for other arrangements for alternative
generation. Now they just keep them offline to jack up the price. Just
like the 73 oil shortage.
I use wood heat and don't need an alarm clock anymore. So I'm not in a
bind if they do shut down the power for a while.
> My father was so annoyed with our power situation, he installed a 6.5
> kilowatt gasoline generator and wired it into his house. If we get some
> long blackouts, I am going to get a generator too.
>
> --
> Michael Vester
> A credible Linux advocate
>
> "The avalanche has started, it is
> too late for the pebbles to vote"
> Kosh, Vorlon Ambassador to Babylon 5
--
V
------------------------------
From: Lamar Thomas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
linux.redhat.misc,comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.help,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.linux.networking,comp.os.linux.redhat,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Who to install a .gz.tar file?
Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 07:15:27 GMT
I am running RH 7.1 on an Intel system. I am trying to get me CDRW
working and the "CD-Writing-HOWTO" said that I needed to download and
install "mkisofs". Well I downloaded it but I can't seem to find a way
to install it. I ran the commands: "gunzip filename.gz" and "tar -xvf
filename.tar" and extracted the files. Now what? Can anyone help?
Thanks,
Lamar
------------------------------
From: GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Linux beats Win2K (again)
Date: Sat, 19 May 2001 00:40:03 -0700
Pete Goodwin wrote:
>
> In article <9e3ti2$2jv$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] says...
>
> > > I question your use of *real* world. How is it the *real* world when it
> > > is a very small market?
> >
> > It is the real world because it is a real market, not some cooked up
> > benchmark. You will realise that I was quoting an example of Linux
> > thrashing Win2K in scalability and price/performance after a glut of
> > trolling about TPC (ie not a real world application) from the wintrolls.
> >
> > If supercomputers aren't real world scalibility then what is? A TPC
> > benchmarking machine, perhaps?
>
> How about the desktop supercomputer by SETI and Intel? Hmmm? Ten times
> bigger, hmmm... now if the desktop is predominantly Windows, that means
> this supercomputer is mostly Windows.
>
> The Intel one is of course Windows only.
>
> > > If you said "And in the world of scalability"... your use of *real* is
> > > as kind of 'hook', implying that anything else is somehow 'unreal' or
> > > maybe even inferior.
> >
> > No, I was trying to keep the discussion on the original topic posted,
> > something which you are clearly unable to do.
>
> By avoiding the question?
>
> > > In the real real world, everywhere.
> >
> > In the real world of scalibility (ie not a benchmark setup) windows is no
> > where to be seen.
>
> Really? The biggest computer in the world is Windows dominated, and you
> say it's nowhere to be seen?
>
> > Now:
> >
> > The original thread was about real world scalibility, which was posted to
> > counter laods of trolling about benchmarks. Please stop trying to throw
> > it completely off topic just to show I'm wrong about something I'm
> > not[1]. If you care so much about the issues you keep raising which are
> > irellevant in this discussion, then start a new thread about it.
>
> I'm not trying to show you're wrong - except for the biggest
> supercomputer I've mentioned - only that your use of the certain words
> has led me to question you - and you've not exactly answered any of my
> questions.
>
> > [1] You have not given me any indication of how Win2K beats Linux in
> > terms of real world scalibility and price/performance. Remember, if you
> > read the OP, you would realise that is what I started talking about.
> > Hint: this has nothing to do with desktops.
>
> Windows (not Win2K) appears to be the biggest supercomputer out there in
> the *real* world. And it's all on the desktop.
>
> Scalability? How many machines is this supercomputer? 100? 1000?
> 1,000,000 (SETI) and 500,000 (Intel).
>
> --
> Pete
I think the SETI program is a farce! No offense to you, but I often
wonder what good does it do them? Radio waves travel a little slower
than the speed of light. And if the radio waves are coming from many
million light years away I'd say it was very old news we would be
receiving. But I doubt they will get anything from it as they advertise
they are looking for. All I know is that the end user gets a block of
data to crunch... do we really know what this data is? Could it be
entirely something else?
--
V
------------------------------
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