Hi,
On Thu, Aug 15, 2002 at 09:26:22PM +0300, Oded Arbel wrote:
> Shlomi Fish wrote:
>
> >On Thu, 15 Aug 2002, Ben-Nes Michael wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >>Just wonder, will old UNIX ( for example the UltraSparcs ) will give better
> >>performance then new P4/AMD ?
> >>Does Linux support such hardware well ?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >I've seen S.u.s.e Linux runs nicely on an UltraSparc (I think it was 5 or
> >10). It was pretty fast, but I did not benchmark it against a Pentium.
> >
> >According to Sun the new UltraSPARCS, which have slightly lesser frequency
> >than the cutting edge Pentium 4's still perform better because of the
> >superior architecture. I know Alpha run faster than a Pentium with the
> >equivalent clock speed.
> >
> >
> AMDs run faster then pentiums with comparable clock speeds. PPCs too. hell -
>anything runs better then a pentium with the comparable clock speed !
> I wonder why people still insist on buying inferior technology..
While I generally tend to go with the underdog (AMD), especially if it is
better, and my next CPU will probably be made by AMD (clawhammer,
hopefully? I currently have a 300Mhz Celeron), I wish to comment:
1. Pentium IV was designed from the ground up to achieve high clock speeds.
And it does that pretty well - in terms of clock speed, it is the winner
by far (2.53Ghz vs 1.8Ghz at AMD, with IBM's at PPC 1.3 and all others top
at 1Ghz). So it's not fair to say others are better at the same clock
speed - it was designed for that. I guess they had to make every clock
cycle do some less work to get to 2.53Ghz.
2. This, of course, isn't very interesting - what's usually is is actual
performance. And this, as we all know, depends heavily on the application.
Since I am not an expert, and don't have much experience with non-Intel, I
only cite SPEC's CPU2000 (from www.spec.org), naturally not the best
benchmark for everything, but the easiest one to find so many results for:
CPU Score Score/Mhz
CINT2000 (Integer):
Athlon 2200+ (1.8Ghz) 765 0.425
Intel Pentium 4 2.53Ghz 922 0.364
Compaq Alpha 1.0Ghz 679 0.679
IBM (Power4, not exactly PPC) 1.3Ghz 839 0.645
HP PA-8700 750Mhz 604 0.805
SGI R14000 600Mhz 500 0.833
SUN UltraSparc III 1.05Ghz 610 0.581
Intel Itanium 2 1.0Ghz 810 0.810
CFP2000 (Float):
Athlon 2200+ (1.8Ghz) 671 0.373
Intel Pentium 4 2.53Ghz 901 0.356
Compaq Alpha 1.0Ghz 960 0.960
IBM (Power4, not exactly PPC) 1.3Ghz 1266 0.974
HP PA-8700 750Mhz 576 0.768
SGI R14000 600Mhz 529 0.882
SUN UltraSparc III 1.05Ghz 827 0.788
Intel Itanium 2 1.0Ghz 1356 1.356
I must admit this last one was a big surprize for me. I anxiously wait
for the Hammer to fight back.
So, in "work per cycle" the P IV is worst, but who cares? In
"work per second per $" the fight is not over yet (I didn't check
current prices) but is definitely not towards being efficient.
Conclusion? : In order to win the market share, you need enough money
to build huge fabs that will make a lot of small, high clock
transistors, and not invest a lot on development of slower clock,
higher speed, expensive CPUs. And people love GHz.
I also must say this was one of my longest letters, in terms of
(time to write)/(number of bytes), but I really enjoyed seeing
the results. Hopefully others too.
BTW: None of these is "old". You won't get any of these for 300-400$.
For 300-400$ you will get a machine with performance comparable to
a PC of that price (worse, actually), but you will get the experience,
and nothing can beat the coolness of a well-designed Unix workstation
on your desk.
I personally have an old SGI Indy, that I got for almost free, and I only
use as an XTerminal (for the 300Mhz Celeron "server"). It has a 133Mhz
R4600, with speed comparable to a 100Mhz Pentium, but is quite good
as an XTerminal (with a quite good 19" monitor). And, to answer Michael's
question, Irix runs on it better than Linux for now, so I run Irix and
wait (maybe forever, there is not too much activity on Linux for Indy).
>
> --
> Oded Arbel
> m-Wise mobile solutions
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> ::..
> dreaming earth's end
> fire ice wind rain
> billions served
>
>
Didi
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