On Sat, 4 Jun 2005, Peter wrote:
On Sat, 4 Jun 2005, Matan Ziv-Av wrote:
No it is not. There are many examples of kernel modules that provide
support for modems, network drivers and other devices, which are NOT open
source and NOT 'aggregations'. If you don't want to make your 802.11g
wireless card work
If the modules are distributed apart from the kernel itself (as is usually
the case for the modules you speak of), then Linus allows this. Some other
I.o.w., if the modules come on disk and are loaded at run time by a script
it's ok. You know what ? That's exactly what they are doing. Unbelievable.
No. If they are distributed together (as in the case of an embedded
device), it is surely not "mere aggregation".
What is 'distributed' in an embedded context ? An appliance is a device. It
contains everything that needs to be in it to make it work. Even the
Please read some theory of copyright law before puting your foot in your
mouth. In order to create the device (the specific modem that is
cuerrently in my closet), they made a copy a compiled linux kernel. By
law they are not allowed to make such a copy, except if Linus (and all
other linux developers, naturally) allows them. Linus allowed them under
specific conditions, which they fail to meet, so they distribute without
permissions.
batteries sometimes. And Linus and the authors of the libraries and of the
utilities (and of busybox) know this and they are ok with this, as far as an
Alan Cox is not OK with this. Harald Welte is not OK with this. Erik
Andersen is not OK with this. Just to name a few.
kernel specifically do not allow this, so anyone who distributes such
modules is at risk. For modules that come together with the kernel, as is
the case with the ECI router, this is not allowed by Linus' exception, nor
by anything else.
Would you mind my hearing this from Linus ? Because he knows about these
See what Linus shouts, loud and clear:
http://www.ussg.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0312.0/1014.html
embedded systems, and endorses them as far as I know. And the author of
Busybox is quoted on linuxdevices.com as endorsing at least one of the
products because it (the built in busybox) lets him work so well with it.
Andersen is OK with devices that include Busybox and comply with the
GPL. He is very unhappy with devices that include Busybox and violate
the GPL:
http://busybox.net/shame.html
So I can create copies of CDs I buy in the store, and "rent" them to other
people? ECI do not have a right to "rent" Linux kernel or Busybox, except
if they follow the GPL, which they do not.
Yes, you can, if and only if it's linux or open source based and the license
permits you to do that. You are allowed to charge money for it. You can copy
it and sell the copies. This is explicitly specified in the GPL. The idea is
Did you actually read the license? It does not say what you think it
says.
Monta Vista provides source with every binary of a GPL program that they
provide. What has that got to do with ECI?
Hello ?! We are talking about an ECI router box that runs a Monta Vista Linux
kernel and busybox, yes ? Don't lose focus on the original topic, I will not
follow you in philosophical pursuits.
Try following this, it is not very hard.
1. The ECI router runs Linux.
2. ECI got a copy of Linux from Montavista.
3. Montavista gave ECI both binary and source, so they comply with the
license.
4. ECI gave Matan a binary copy of Linux.
5. ECI did not give matan the corresponding source, and did not offer to
give such source.
6. Therefore, they did not comply with the license.
7. Therefore, they copied Linux without having a legal right to do so.
This is ridiculous. What do you expect them to do, email you a cdrom ? What
do you mean what has this got to do with the ECI router ?!! Where do you
think I got the information about Monta Vista on that box ?!! I ssh'd into it
and typed cat /proc/version !!!
I expect them to include on the CD, the source that the binaries were
made of. But it does not matter what I expect, since I have no standing.
Here is what two people that could sue them and win expect:
http://www.gpl-violations.org/faq/vendor-faq.html
http://busybox.net/license.html
You have no idea what you are talking about, you are interpreting things in
Funny, coming from someone who speaks about the GPL, but does not know
what it says.
--
Matan Ziv-Av. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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