안녕 하세요 신정식씨?
On Tue, Feb 24, 2004 at 08:43:09PM +0900, Jungshik Shin wrote: > Please, read what I wrote more carefully. I did write that deleting > the last letter is more useful when you're in the middle of typing a > sequence of letter to form a syllable. I think we're talking past eachother here... I noted that and I agree with it. It's specifically the fact that once I type the third character of a hangeul glyph, I can't backspace and change ONLY that last character, that annoys me. You say that most Koreans prefer that behavior, and I believe you. But I can't for the life of me understand why... ;-) To me, it seems unnatural and inefficient. Almost invariably once I've committed an erroneous syllable, it's not the whole syllable I need to replace, but only the last character which I flubbed. Otherwise, if I made a mistake before the syllable was committed, I already fixed it. [Assuming, of course, that it's a typing mistake, and not a language mistake... ;-)] The default behavior of Ami seems strange to me, in that regard. But it's probably just because I've been typing western alphabets all my life, I guess... > Once a syllble is committed into the backing store, however, most > Korean people want the cursor movement, the selection and editing > operations like deletion/insertion to be done syllable by syllable. Sure... I can see that it's useful, but it would be nice to be able to do both. > However, incremental search needs to be done with individual letters > as unit instead of syllables. I think Indian people have similar > needs. 알겠어요. > These behaviors are default with XIM servers for Korean like 'Ami' > (http://kldp.net/projects/ami ) or 'Nabi' (http://kldp.net/projects/nabi). > > > blunt, I find that really annoying, and if there's a way to change > > that behavior, I certainly would like to know how... > > What input method server do you use? The msg strings for Ami are available > in English, too. That is, setting LC_MESSAGES to en_US.UTF-8 gives you > English menus in Ami. Indeed. I'm using Ami, and what you say is true. The trouble is that if I try to set LC_MESSAGES to a non-korean value when I start some other program, then the application in question seems to not work properly with ami. I'll get to that in a moment... > > can't see how... Perhaps my biggest problem is that I can't find any > > documentation about using Korean with Linux which isn't written in > > Korean. Which is all well and good, if you already happen to speak > > Korean fluently... ;-) > > I used to post 'Hangul and Internet in Korea FAQ' to > soc.culture.korean regularly, but that's a way too outdated by now. > Pls, feel free to ask me off-line if you have any problem. Well, I will take you up on that. I have a few... > > It seems like a perfectly viable solution. But I can't help but think > > that it would be better if the kernel allowed for language-specific > > IME modules in the console/tty drivers. Then you could deal with it > > uniformly at all levels of input management... One API to enter > > characters, whether you're typing in a terminal emulator or at the > > console. What I'm essentially envisioning is that all input > > It's not for kernel, but you may find it interesting to know more > about IIIMF and SCIM. http://www.openi18n.org/subgroups/im/IIIMF/ I'll have a look. Since I moved to Korea, Internationalization and multi-language support has (understandably) become more interesting and important to me... :) > > about the right way to be able to enter hangeul, while still > > maintaining English menus and messages and such. So far, my research > > has turned up precious little, and I have only been able to type in > > Well, it's easy. I always do that because I don't like the quality of > Korean translation in most software, commercial or open-source. Add > this to your ~/.i18n (or equivalent. ~/.profile ) > > ---------- > LANG=en_US.UTF-8 (or en_GB.UTF-8, en_CA.UTF-8) > LC_CTYPE=ko_KR.UTF-8 > LC_MESSAGES=en_US.UTF-8 # not necessary unless LC_ALL is set, but > LC_TIME=en_US.UTF-8 # just to be sure. > ----------- Hmmm... I've been managing Unix systems for years in a multi-language environment for part of that, so I'm no stranger to locales. I more or less do this, but I so far have found that it doesn't work. Well, honestly I use an all-english locale generally, but then I start specific applications with a Korean locale. Specifically, I do this: # .profile (or whatever) LANG=en_US.UTF-8 LC_COLLATE=C # I like ASCII sorting for most applications... ... export LANG LC_COLLATE ... Then, when I start up an application where I want to type Korean, I originally tried startiing it like this: $ LANG=ko_KR.UTF-8 LC_COLLATE=ko_KR.UTF-8 LC_MESSAGES=en_US.UTF-8 gedit& I also tried other combinations of both UTF and non-UTF locales. One of two undesireable things always happened: 1. Menus were in Korean 2. Hangeul input via ami simply didn't work. Now, I admit I haven't reade the locale man pages in a long time, so it may be that this particular combination of variables isn't quite right to accomplish what I want to do. But it seems like it should be sufficient. As it happens, until recently the most common case I want to do this was with mozilla. It wasn't a major problem then, because my installation of Mozilla had no Korean. But as my Korean improves, I have more and more cases where I want to do this. Of course, I'm also better able to navigate the menus, but that's beside the point... :) I'll play around with my locale settings again, and I'll get back to you with the results. Thanks, Derek
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