Because we've got both ATmega's, programmers and dismount nano I (we) will try to build one jtag finder and plug it in (this could be a difficult task due to the size of the pads but we'll try) ;)
JD. On 06/10/2007, MsTiFtS <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Well, this is exactly the thing we were talking about. If you are > experienced with these AVRs and have a programmer lying around, what > about building such a finder? Then try to get your hands at a nano with > a broken display etc. to have a cheap nano to play around with and find > out the pinout. > > serpilliere schrieb: > > http://www.hackaday.com/2007/09/29/automatic-jtag-pinout-detection/ > > > > it uses an avr (atmega RUlez) to automaticly detect jtag pin amount 30 > > pin : > > it seems to use some jtag behavior (from jtag normal automata) to detect > > each jtag pin > > > > it has been presented at ph neutral 06 (http://hunz.org/jtag.pdf) > > > > > > and erf, it seems to work! > > My personnal experience with atmega is humm quite good so maybe such > > system is feseable:) > > > > + > > serpilliere > > > > > > > > MsTiFtS wrote: > > > >> Well, a PIC programmer for a serial port is nothing more than 4 or 5 > >> resistors, some connectors and a power supply. At least for legacy > >> serial ports. A programmer for AVRs is a little more complex, it > >> requires an IC as far as I read. I never had an AVR, too, but I'm pretty > >> used to fiddling around with PICs. > >> > >> mat h schrieb: > >> > >> > >>> I tried to build a programmer for a pic i failed miserably and in the > >>> process destroyed 3 pics at 9.95 each! Never again. Ill stick to the > >>> software side thanks > >>> > >>> On 10/5/07, * MsTiFtS* <[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > >>> wrote: > >>> > >>> Come on, building programmers is a lot easier than building that JTAG > >>> finder and these Mega32s aren't that expensive... > >>> > >>> mat h schrieb: > >>> > If I had an ATMega32 and a prgrammer for it I would attempt building > >>> > one but since I dont I wont. ;( > >>> > > >>> > On 10/5/07, *MsTiFtS* < [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>>> wrote: > >>> > > >>> > Sorry, I have neither a dissected iPod nor an ATMega32 lying > >>> > around here :( > >>> > In the presentation they stated that they found the JTAG > >>> ones out > >>> > of 30 > >>> > pads in a few hours using that finder. With 15 pins it will take > >>> > 1/8 of > >>> > the time. If can rule out a bunch of pads because they are > >>> tightly > >>> > connected to ground or VCC (not pullable through 330R > >>> resistors), you > >>> > can probably reduce the pad count to about 10 pads. That's > >>> 1/27 of the > >>> > time they needed for their 30 pins. So I think it's worth a > >>> try, > >>> > but as > >>> > I said, I won't open my nano to do that. If I manage to get > >>> one with a > >>> > broken display/battery/etc. I'll do it. > >>> > > >>> > JD schrieb: > >>> > > I read the paper long ago and I continue to think it's too > >>> > difficult > >>> > > but if you want to try... be my guest :) > >>> > > > >>> > > JD. > >>> > > > >>> > > On 05/10/2007, MsTiFtS <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>>> > >>> > wrote: > >>> > > > >>> > >> You only need to find the first 3 pins, if you have got these > >>> > you'll see > >>> > >> what the 4th is. > >>> > >> And with level tests, you can simply rule out all these > >>> VCC and > >>> > GND pins > >>> > >> and further reduce the number of pins you need to test. > >>> > >> Have a closer look at the PDF presentation of the JTAG finder > >>> > site, it's > >>> > >> all described there. > >>> > >> > >>> > >> JD schrieb: > >>> > >> > >>> > >>> I take a look on that JTAG finder, it's a good tool to find > >>> > out JTAG > >>> > >>> pins when you know where the pins are (but you don't > >>> know pin > >>> > order). > >>> > >>> The problem with level test is other chips may got the > >>> same level > >>> > >>> characteristcs than a JTAG signal. > >>> > >>> And there a permutation of 4 pins in 15 pads is more around > >>> > 30000 possibilities. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> JD. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On 05/10/2007, MsTiFtS <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> > <mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>>> wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>> Well, IF there are ONLY 15 pads (I could not make out > >>> any on > >>> > the scans, > >>> > >>>> where the heck are they?), you can probably reduce them to > >>> > about 10 with > >>> > >>>> signal level tests, so there are only about 110 or 1000 > >>> > possibilities to > >>> > >>>> go, depending what scheme you use. That's done withing > >>> a few > >>> > seconds > >>> > >>>> using that JTAG finder. Who has a dissected nano to try it > >>> > out? ;) > >>> > >>>> > >>> > >>>> JD schrieb: > >>> > >>>> > >>> > >>>> > >>> > >>>>> Of course there is a way to put binaries on the > >>> devices but > >>> > I don't > >>> > >>>>> think we can find how without the original > >>> documentation, mainly > >>> > >>>>> because: > >>> > >>>>> > >>> > >>>>> 1. There is no proof that JTAG is used here. > >>> > >>>>> Only the ARM got a JTAG interface on our board and the > >>> main > >>> > JTAG > >>> > >>>>> feature is daisy chaining multiple chips on a single bus. > >>> > Maybe the > >>> > >>>>> in2g is initially programmed by an other protocol / bus, > >>> > even by an > >>> > >>>>> homemade simple serial bus. > >>> > >>>>> But okay if I have to bet I choose JTAG. > >>> > >>>>> > >>> > >>>>> 2. The JTAG pins aren't clearly defined, that doesn't mean > >>> > there are > >>> > >>>>> no pins on our board but maybe the pins are one of the > >>> many > >>> > board pads > >>> > >>>>> ( approximatly 15 pads and 4 JTAG pins -> impossible to > >>> > guess even > >>> > >>>>> with signal level tests (maybe I'm wrong but even if it's > >>> > possible > >>> > >>>>> this will take a very very long time)). > >>> > >>>>> > >>> > >>>>> I really think there is no hope about JTAG without proper > >>> > schematics / > >>> > >>>>> boards layout. > >>> > >>>>> > >>> > >>>>> JD. > >>> > >>>>> > >>> > >>>>> On 04/10/2007, MsTiFtS < [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>>> wrote: > >>> > >>>>> > >>> > >>>>> > >>> > >>>>> > >>> > >>>>>> I doubt there are JTAG pins anywhere accessible on the > >>> > board. I am > >>> > >>>>>> wondering how they loaded the initial code to these > >>> > devices, but I can't > >>> > >>>>>> see any way to do this except before the chips where > >>> > soldered to the > >>> > >>>>>> boards. There is simply nothing on this board you > >>> cold make > >>> > a quick > >>> > >>>>>> connection to except the dock port, but I doubt that > >>> JTAG > >>> > is in there > >>> > >>>>>> somewhere. That JTAG finder just helps to get the > >>> pinout if > >>> > you have a > >>> > >>>>>> dozen touchpoints on the board. Whe have the exact > >>> opposite > >>> > problem: > >>> > >>>>>> Nothing to hook up to. (Well, at least nothing I can > >>> see on > >>> > the various > >>> > >>>>>> PCB scans, I didn't get my fingers on a dissected > >>> iPod yet.) > >>> > >>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>> mat h schrieb: > >>> > >>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> http://www.c3a.de/wiki/index.php/JTAG_Finder > >>> > <http://www.c3a.de/wiki/index.php/JTAG_Finder> ? > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> On 9/28/07, *mat h* < [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > >>> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> > <mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>>>> wrote: > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> just an idea what chip is the ram? Alot of chips > >>> have > >>> > debugging > >>> > >>>>>>> pins on them ( JTAG etc) does the ram chip? > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> On 9/28/07, *Jeremy Prater* < > >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > >>> > >>>>>>> <mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>>>> wrote: > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> Hmmm, im going to stop my hunt then, I searched > >>> > 19% of the > >>> > >>>>>>> keyspace, but it sounds like im wasting time > >>> here. > >>> > Has anyone > >>> > >>>>>>> had any luck or ideas on how to dump the > >>> 256mbit/ > >>> > 8meg ram? > >>> > >>>>>>> Ive got no ideas on even trying to get the > >>> ram out > >>> > of there. > >>> > >>>>>>> Hehe except with a hammer... ok later im > >>> going to > >>> > keep at it. > >>> > >>>>>>> -- Jeremy > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>> > >>>>>>> From: Emmanuel Fleury [mailto: > >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > >>> > >>>>>>> <mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>>>] > >>> > >>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 10:20 PM > >>> > >>>>>>> To: Hardware and developpement mailing list. > >>> > >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Linux4nano-dev] Update to rc4 > >>> key search > >>> > >>>>>>> (optimized) > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> mat h wrote: > >>> > >>>>>>> > ok, just give me a bell if you need cpu power. > >>> > >>>>>>> > > >>> > >>>>>>> > Anyway what makes you so sure that the key > >>> is RC4? > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> It's not. We have some good clues against it. > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> Comparing several consecutive encrypted > >>> firmwares > >>> > show us that > >>> > >>>>>>> the same > >>> > >>>>>>> key is used each time. > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> In the case of an RC4 (or any stream cipher > >>> > scheme), it would > >>> > >>>>>>> mean that > >>> > >>>>>>> we could have some statistical properties poping > >>> > out when > >>> > >>>>>>> XORing of two > >>> > >>>>>>> encrypted firmwares (namely we should see > >>> > something similar to > >>> > >>>>>>> the > >>> > >>>>>>> statistical property of an ARM binary... As > >>> > Serpilliere did > >>> > >>>>>>> mention it, > >>> > >>>>>>> ARM binaries have very specific statistical > >>> > properties (on the > >>> > >>>>>>> 'command' > >>> > >>>>>>> part)). > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> We tried and nothing came out from this, which > >>> > means that it's > >>> > >>>>>>> very > >>> > >>>>>>> likely a block cipher scheme (with a fixed key). > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> Regards > >>> > >>>>>>> -- > >>> > >>>>>>> Emmanuel Fleury > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> I do not fear computers. I fear the lack of > >>> them. > >>> > >>>>>>> -- Isaac Asimov > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>> > >>>>>>> Linux4nano-dev mailing list > >>> > >>>>>>> [email protected] > >>> <mailto:[email protected]> > >>> > <mailto:[email protected] > >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> <mailto:[email protected] > >>> <mailto:[email protected]> > >>> > <mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > >>> <https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev> > >>> > >>>>>>> http://www.linux4nano.org > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> -- > >>> > >>>>>>> We explore... and you call us criminals. > >>> > >>>>>>> We seek after knowledge... and you call us > >>> criminals. > >>> > >>>>>>> We exist without skin color, without > >>> nationality, without > >>> > >>>>>>> religious bias... and you call us criminals. > >>> > >>>>>>> You build atomic bombs, you wage wars, you murder, > >>> > cheat, and lie > >>> > >>>>>>> to us and try to make us believe it's for our > >>> own good... > >>> > >>>>>>> ....yet we're the criminals. > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> ____________WAUSHARE ROX ______________ > >>> > >>>>>>> Join the dark side we've got cheese > >>> > >>>>>>> Annoying people since 1992 > >>> > >>>>>>> If you hate me, I love you too. It ain't my > >>> fault I'm > >>> > better than you > >>> > >>>>>>> Save Water, Drink Beer > >>> > >>>>>>> God Made Women First, Then He Had A Better Idea. > >>> > >>>>>>> If Barbie is soo popular...how come you have to buy > >>> > her friends? > >>> > >>>>>>> Don't play stupid with me... I'm better at it! > >>> > >>>>>>> You were so cute when you were a baby...What > >>> happened? > >>> > >>>>>>> My folks were always asking me to wear underpants. > >>> > What am I, the > >>> > >>>>>>> pope? > >>> > >>>>>>> I'm calling the police!... Right after I flush > >>> some tings. > >>> > >>>>>>> Join the army, see the world, meet interesting > >>> people, > >>> > and kill them. > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> -- > >>> > >>>>>>> We explore... and you call us criminals. > >>> > >>>>>>> We seek after knowledge... and you call us criminals. > >>> > >>>>>>> We exist without skin color, without nationality, > >>> without > >>> > religious > >>> > >>>>>>> bias... and you call us criminals. > >>> > >>>>>>> You build atomic bombs, you wage wars, you murder, > >>> cheat, > >>> > and lie to > >>> > >>>>>>> us and try to make us believe it's for our own good... > >>> > >>>>>>> ....yet we're the criminals. > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> ____________WAUSHARE ROX ______________ > >>> > >>>>>>> Join the dark side we've got cheese > >>> > >>>>>>> Annoying people since 1992 > >>> > >>>>>>> If you hate me, I love you too. It ain't my fault I'm > >>> > better than you > >>> > >>>>>>> Save Water, Drink Beer > >>> > >>>>>>> God Made Women First, Then He Had A Better Idea. > >>> > >>>>>>> If Barbie is soo popular...how come you have to buy her > >>> > friends? > >>> > >>>>>>> Don't play stupid with me... I'm better at it! > >>> > >>>>>>> You were so cute when you were a baby...What happened? > >>> > >>>>>>> My folks were always asking me to wear underpants. > >>> What am > >>> > I, the pope? > >>> > >>>>>>> I'm calling the police!... Right after I flush some > >>> tings. > >>> > >>>>>>> Join the army, see the world, meet interesting > >>> people, and > >>> > kill them. > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > > >>> > >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>> > >>>>>>> Linux4nano-dev mailing list > >>> > >>>>>>> [email protected] > >>> <mailto:[email protected]> <mailto: [email protected] > >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> > >>> > >>>>>>> https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > >>> > >>>>>>> http://www.linux4nano.org > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>> > >>>>>> Linux4nano-dev mailing list > >>> > >>>>>> [email protected] > >>> <mailto:[email protected]> <mailto: [email protected] > >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> > >>> > >>>>>> https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > >>> > >>>>>> http://www.linux4nano.org <http://www.linux4nano.org> > >>> > >>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>> > >>> > >>>>>> > >>> > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>> > >>>>> Linux4nano-dev mailing list > >>> > >>>>> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > >>> <mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> > >>> > >>>>> https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > >>> > >>>>> http://www.linux4nano.org > >>> > >>>>> > >>> > >>>>> > >>> > >>>>> > >>> > >>>>> > >>> > >>>> _______________________________________________ > >>> > >>>> Linux4nano-dev mailing list > >>> > >>>> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > >>> <mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> > >>> > >>>> https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > >>> > <https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev> > >>> > >>>> http://www.linux4nano.org > >>> > >>>> > >>> > >>>> > >>> > >>>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> > >>> Linux4nano-dev mailing list > >>> > >>> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > >>> <mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> > >>> > >>> https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > >>> <https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev> > >>> > >>> http://www.linux4nano.org > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >> _______________________________________________ > >>> > >> Linux4nano-dev mailing list > >>> > >> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > >>> <mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> > >>> > >> https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > >>> > >> http://www.linux4nano.org > >>> > >> > >>> > >> > >>> > > > >>> > > _______________________________________________ > >>> > > Linux4nano-dev mailing list > >>> > > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > >>> <mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> > >>> > > https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > >>> > > http://www.linux4nano.org > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > _______________________________________________ > >>> > Linux4nano-dev mailing list > >>> > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > >>> <mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> > >>> > https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > >>> <https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev> > >>> > http://www.linux4nano.org <http://www.linux4nano.org> > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > -- > >>> > We explore... and you call us criminals. > >>> > We seek after knowledge... and you call us criminals. > >>> > We exist without skin color, without nationality, without religious > >>> > bias... and you call us criminals. > >>> > You build atomic bombs, you wage wars, you murder, cheat, and > >>> lie to > >>> > us and try to make us believe it's for our own good... > >>> > ....yet we're the criminals. > >>> > > >>> > ____________WAUSHARE ROX ______________ > >>> > Join the dark side we've got cheese > >>> > Annoying people since 1992 > >>> > If you hate me, I love you too. It ain't my fault I'm better > >>> than you > >>> > Save Water, Drink Beer > >>> > God Made Women First, Then He Had A Better Idea. > >>> > If Barbie is soo popular...how come you have to buy her friends? > >>> > Don't play stupid with me... I'm better at it! > >>> > You were so cute when you were a baby...What happened? > >>> > My folks were always asking me to wear underpants. What am I, > >>> the pope? > >>> > I'm calling the police!... Right after I flush some tings. > >>> > Join the army, see the world, meet interesting people, and kill > >>> them. > >>> > > >>> > >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >>> > > >>> > _______________________________________________ > >>> > Linux4nano-dev mailing list > >>> > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > >>> > https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > >>> > http://www.linux4nano.org > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Linux4nano-dev mailing list > >>> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > >>> https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > >>> http://www.linux4nano.org > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> We explore... and you call us criminals. > >>> We seek after knowledge... and you call us criminals. > >>> We exist without skin color, without nationality, without religious > >>> bias... and you call us criminals. > >>> You build atomic bombs, you wage wars, you murder, cheat, and lie to > >>> us and try to make us believe it's for our own good... > >>> ....yet we're the criminals. > >>> > >>> ____________WAUSHARE ROX ______________ > >>> Join the dark side we've got cheese > >>> Annoying people since 1992 > >>> If you hate me, I love you too. It ain't my fault I'm better than you > >>> Save Water, Drink Beer > >>> God Made Women First, Then He Had A Better Idea. > >>> If Barbie is soo popular...how come you have to buy her friends? > >>> Don't play stupid with me... I'm better at it! > >>> You were so cute when you were a baby...What happened? > >>> My folks were always asking me to wear underpants. What am I, the pope? > >>> I'm calling the police!... Right after I flush some tings. > >>> Join the army, see the world, meet interesting people, and kill them. > >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Linux4nano-dev mailing list > >>> [email protected] > >>> https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > >>> http://www.linux4nano.org > >>> > >>> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Linux4nano-dev mailing list > >> [email protected] > >> https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > >> http://www.linux4nano.org > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Linux4nano-dev mailing list > > [email protected] > > https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > > http://www.linux4nano.org > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Linux4nano-dev mailing list > [email protected] > https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev > http://www.linux4nano.org > _______________________________________________ Linux4nano-dev mailing list [email protected] https://mail.gna.org/listinfo/linux4nano-dev http://www.linux4nano.org
