All, 

> On Dec 9, 2025, at 11:04 PM, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <[email protected]> 
> wrote:
> 
> Tony –
>  <snip>
> I have suggested “Flooding Algorithm Leaderless Mode” – but if you have a 
> different preference, I would be happy to consider it.
>  ok, what about "Active flood reduction algorithm" ? <end snip>

The latter sounds good to me. 

Thanks,
Acee


>  Sure.
>     Les
>  From: Tony Przygienda <[email protected]>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2025 11:56 AM
> To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <[email protected]>
> Cc: Acee Lindem <[email protected]>; shraddha <[email protected]>; lsr 
> <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [Lsr] Re: WG Adoption IPR Poll for "Flooding Reduction 
> Algorithms Framework" - draft-prz-lsr-interop-flood-reduction-architecture-01
>    On Tue, Dec 9, 2025 at 1:02 AM Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) 
> <[email protected]> wrote:
> Tony –
>  Thanx for the reply.
>  My request here is simple.
>  We now have two sub-TLVs of the Router Capability TV – both of which 
> advertise supported flooding algorithm(s).
> But as used they have different semantics.
>  The existing sub-TLV defined by RFC 9667 advertises a (set of) supported 
> flooding algorithms which can potentially be used by the area leader when 
> choosing what algorithm to enable (distributed mode). It is named “IS-IS 
> Dynamic Flooding”.
>  The new sub-TLV advertises a single algorithm which indicates what the 
> advertising node has actually enabled. It currently does not have a name – 
> but IANA will require one.
> I am simply asking that you choose a string which allows for an intuitive 
> recognition of the difference between the two sub-TLVs.
> I have suggested “Flooding Algorithm Leaderless Mode” – but if you have a 
> different preference, I would be happy to consider it.
>  ok, what about "Active flood reduction algorithm" ? 
>   Although there will be a clear reference in the IANA registry to the 
> document which defines the sub-TLV, it seems helpful to choose a name which 
> facilitates the reader being able to recall the functional difference between 
> the two sub-TLVs w/o having to go reread(sic) the relevant documents.
>  I am not asking or suggesting that the draft should discuss how leader 
> based(RFC 9667) and leaderless based flooding can coexist.
> I agree this is possible, but I see no reason why the 
> flood-reduction-architecture draft needs to discuss it. As you have pointed 
> out, we agreed that was out of scope for the draft – and I still think that 
> it is the correct choice.
>  ok
>   As for OSPF codepoints, I mentioned that as a simple review comment.
>  ok
>   Hope we are in sync now.
>     Les
>   From: Tony Przygienda <[email protected]>
> Sent: Monday, December 8, 2025 12:34 AM
> To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <[email protected]>
> Cc: Acee Lindem <[email protected]>; shraddha <[email protected]>; lsr 
> <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [Lsr] Re: WG Adoption IPR Poll for "Flooding Reduction 
> Algorithms Framework" - draft-prz-lsr-interop-flood-reduction-architecture-01
>  Les, inline ... 
>  On Sun, Dec 7, 2025 at 6:36 PM Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <[email protected]> 
> wrote:
> Tony –
>  My bad – you are right. Apologies.
> The new signaling is needed.
>  The reason the new signaling is needed is because what is defined in this 
> document is a leaderless deployment whereas RFC 9667 defines a leader-based 
> deployment.
> I forgot about this (which had been discussed along the way).
>  I am wondering if a name could be assigned to the new sub-TLV to make it 
> easier to identify the difference between it and the existing sub-TLV defined 
> by RFC 9667?
> Perhaps “Flooding Algorithm Leaderless Mode” ??
> (Open to other suggestions.)
>  actually this architecture and signalling works fine for leaderless _and_ 
> leader based. Imagine two components X and Y both running different leader 
> based algorithms. Perfectly fine stuff. 
> X can signal something specific to X saying "here we are in a partition 
> \alpha and if you're in partition \alpha there is a leader that says 
> 'everyone in X runs X now'". Y can 
> do the same stuff as \beta using the same algorithm or even with a different 
> one. 
>  As long everyone in both components indicates via this signalling (as they 
> must) that they run _an algorithm_ so all components can compare and follow 
> the framework then leader, no leader or even astral ascendancy determining 
> what all nodes in a component do is a private matter. 
>   This will help when folks look at the codepoint registry (in years to come) 
> to intuit the difference.
>  As you know I thought mashing the things together in the 9667 registry was 
> never a particularly good idea since it's not necessary (registries are 
> cheaper than cheap to create) and only leads to a ball of yarn and then 
> "intuiting the difference" means that we start to introduce some funny stuff 
> because things that have different semantics are being mixed together. 
>  Especially since, AFAIR on your suggestion the draft now also says 
>  "
> Dealing with interoperability or lack thereof between this framework
>    and other published frameworks such as e.g.  [RFC9667] is explicitly
>    outside the scope of this document.
>  "
>  Though ultimately your comment/suggestion of moving the signalling from 
> disttopo to -arch draft was spot on ... 
>    BTW, now that you have made this applicable to OSPF, you need to define 
> codepoints for OSPFv2/v3 as well.
>  yes.  Acee I think prefers another document for OSPF. I'm not religious 
> either way and see what falls out. Rather trivial addition AFAIS. 
>  --- tony 
>      Les
>   From: Tony Przygienda <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, December 5, 2025 11:18 PM
> To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <[email protected]>
> Cc: Acee Lindem <[email protected]>; shraddha <[email protected]>; lsr 
> <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [Lsr] Re: WG Adoption IPR Poll for "Flooding Reduction 
> Algorithms Framework" - draft-prz-lsr-interop-flood-reduction-architecture-01
>    On Tue, Dec 2, 2025 at 1:06 AM Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) 
> <[email protected]> wrote:
> Tony –
>  I agree with you that this is applicable to OSPF as well.
>  good 
>   Related to that, I just noticed that in the new IETF version of this draft 
> you introduced new signaling 
> inhttps://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-ietf-lsr-isis-flood-reduction-arch-00.html#name-signaling
> defining a new sub-TLV in Router Capability TLV.
>  The signalling is not new and nothing has been "introduced" here. All of  
>  
> https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-lsr-interop-flood-reduction-architecture-00.txt
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-prz-lsr-interop-flood-reduction-architecture/00/
> https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-prz-lsr-interop-flood-reduction-architecture-01.html
>   (on which this call is extended!) 
>  contain it already.
>   But this is not necessary. You should be able to use the signaling already 
> defined in RFC 9667: 
> https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc9667.html#name-is-is-dynamic-flooding-sub-
> RFC 9667 also defines signaling for OSPF – so you will be covered in this 
> regard when you expand the scope of the draft to both protocols.
>  It is absolutely and perfectly necessary and the argument has been made 
> previously AFAIR. I repeat them to keep the list straight. 
>  RFC9667 TLV is simply unfit for the purpose.  It says 
>  "Indicate that it supports dynamic flooding. This is indicated by the 
> advertisement of this sub-TLV.
> Indicate the set of algorithms that it supports."
> The TLV necessary for  
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-lsr-isis-flood-reduction-arch/ 
> has totally different semantics, it indicates the algorithm that is _actively 
> running_ on the node and it can announce _one and only one_. 
> Additionally, RFC9667 TLV lacks any normative language as to mandating its 
> advertisement.  
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-lsr-isis-flood-reduction-arch/ 
> clearly says that such a TLV MUST be announced for things to work properly 
> "The Sub-TLV MUST be advertised by a node that is actively running any pruner 
> except a zero-pruner."
>  Ultimately, I think based on your comment/requirement the draft specifically 
> ended up saying  
>  "Dealing with interoperability or lack thereof between this framework and 
> other published frameworks such as e.g. [RFC9667] is explicitly outside the 
> scope of this document."
>  and hence intertwining the stuff with 9667 given its differing and 
> underspecified semantics makes zero sense overall. 
>  --- tony
>      Les
>   From: Tony Przygienda <[email protected]>
> Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2025 7:16 AM
> To: Acee Lindem <[email protected]>
> Cc: shraddha <[email protected]>; lsr <[email protected]>
> Subject: [Lsr] Re: WG Adoption IPR Poll for "Flooding Reduction Algorithms 
> Framework" - draft-prz-lsr-interop-flood-reduction-architecture-01
>  back from some days off and starting to track down all the 
> comments/updating. Wouldn't it be more natural to leave out the -isis- out 
> here, this stuff applies to ospf or anything in LSR space really w/o being 
> specific ? 
>  And I'll knuckle down and do some !primitive! ascii figures ;-) 
>  -- tony 
>  On Wed, Jun 4, 2025 at 1:38 PM Acee Lindem <[email protected]> wrote:
> Hi Tony,
> 
> Sounds good. Can you republish the document as 
> draft-ietf-lsr-isis-flood-reduction-arch-00.txt?
> 
> Thanks,
> Acee
> 
> > On Jun 4, 2025, at 4:24 AM, Tony Przygienda <[email protected]> wrote:
> > 
> > No sorry, it took us a bit internally to finally push out the disclosure 
> > that's why the thread was hanging
> > 
> > I read the threads/comments and see no need to update 
> > -flood-reduction-architecture- right now AFAIS. The comment you had on the 
> > lack of ASCII figure is correct but that's work once adopted. I'm still 
> > open to better terms/language but that's probably best over a beer in 
> > madrid 
> > 
> > on the other hand, dist topo will be rev'ed once more before IETF mostly 
> > based on implementation/testing experience
> > 
> > thanks 
> > 
> > -- tony 
> > 
> > On Tue, Jun 3, 2025 at 5:41 PM Acee Lindem <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Thanks Tony - Sorry, we had so much "noise" on the LSR list related to LSR 
> > drafts in WG last call that I neglected to complete the adoption call.
> > 
> > Are you ready for adoption of the current version or were you going to make 
> > some modifications based not the comments?
> > 
> > Thanks,
> > Acee
> > 
> > > On Jun 3, 2025, at 11:18 AM, Tony Przygienda <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > 
> > > Acee, all the relevant IPR I am aware of has been disclosed now  
> > > 
> > > thanks 
> > > 
> > > -- tony 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > On Mon, Apr 28, 2025 at 8:02 AM Shraddha Hegde <[email protected]> 
> > > wrote:
> > > Juniper is in the process of declaring IPR.
> > > I am not aware of any other IPR related to this draft.
> > >  Rgds
> > > Shraddha
> > >   
> > > Juniper Business Use Only
> > > From: Tony Przygienda <[email protected]>
> > > Sent: 28 April 2025 01:01
> > > To: Acee Lindem <[email protected]>
> > > Cc: Shraddha Hegde <[email protected]>; lsr <[email protected]>
> > > Subject: Re: WG Adoption IPR Poll for "Flooding Reduction Algorithms 
> > > Framework" - draft-prz-lsr-interop-flood-reduction-architecture-01
> > >  [External Email. Be cautious of content]
> > >   we are in the process of disclosing the IPR. thanks. tony   On Sun, Apr 
> > > 27, 2025 at 4:40 PM Acee Lindem <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > Co-Authors, 
> > > 
> > > Are you aware of any IPR that applies to 
> > > draft-prz-lsr-interop-flood-reduction-architecture-01?
> > > 
> > > If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules  
> > > (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
> > > 
> > > There currently aren’t any IPR declarations on this simple protocol 
> > > extension - 
> > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/search/?submit=draft&id=draft-chen-lsr-prefix-extended-flags
> > > 
> > > If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond
> > > to this email regardless of whether or not you are aware of any
> > > relevant IPR. *The response needs to be sent to the LSR WG mailing
> > > list.* The document will not advance to the next stage until a
> > > response has been received from each author and contributor.
> > > 
> > > If you are on the LSR WG email list but are not listed as an author or
> > > contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of
> > > any IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.
> > > 
> > > There currently aren’t any IPR declarations on this draft:
> > > 
> > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/search/?submit=draft&id=draft-prz-lsr-interop-flood-reduction-architecture
> > > 
> > > Thanks,
> > > Acee
> > 

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