I agree that the Opteron is probably a better system, but when I price one out at Monarch, it comes up around $5000. Money is not a big object with us right now, thank God, but I'm not going to spend that much money on this thing. The Dell should be more than enough for what we need for some time to come.
Even building an Opteron system myself comes up more than the Dell. BTW - Using Dell's configurator, look at a tower system PowerEdge 2900. It comes out at $4,381 -- but they discount it $1,350 once you add it to the cart -- so the end price is $3,381 plus shipping. It is more than I would like to pay, but I can live with that. I'd rather have the Opteron, but I think both politics and economics are going to dictate the Dell. fp ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mgr. Peter Tuharsky" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Hieromonk Peter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 3:26 AM Subject: Re: [Ltsp-discuss] Raid 1 or Raid 5? New server advice. > Hi, Peter > > > Your calculation isn't wrong. > > I have taken a look at Dell PowerEdge 2900 and see some differences, that > in my opinion make it less valuable system than this "custom". > -memory -I don't see any mention about ECC. Seems, that Dell puts ordinary > memory into server. Cheap, but I won't do so. You mention that You will > store Your data on the server... > -not sure whether hot-swap is "default" or "option" in Dell, however it is > in TYAN > -the difference in real CPU throughtput, mentionet earlier > > I cannot figure out, where did You get the price $3300. I went to the > Dell's page, I used configurator to achieve similar system than our > "custom", and get the price near $8900! > > Please, take in account, that for the price of "custom" system You get > professional 4-way server (more than equivalent to 4-proc. Intel Xeon > one), with 8G server memory (ECC, registered) and professional SCSI RAID. > I assume, that equivalent system from HP or IBM would cost even more. > > You can save some money buying MB with SATA RAID1, cheap SATA drives, > cheap ordinary memory etc. It depends, how much do You value Your data and > where is the border between price and reliability. > > I went to Monarch, mentioned in mailing-list, however I ended up with > price around $6000. I don't know, why they offer only expensive 8xx series > Opterons. > > Please, re-check Your calculations at Dell. Did You really calculate both > processors, all memory, drives, rackmount chasis etc? > > > Peter > > > > > Hieromonk Peter wrote / napísal(a): >> Elis sI appreciate the advice very much -- really, I do -- but when I >> price out the components to build the server myself, the numbers just >> don't ever seem to come out saving me more than about $300. And for >> that, I'd rather have someone else build the thing. >> >> Yes, if I skimp out and choose some of the slower processors, etc., I can >> save more a little more money, but not all that terribly much. At most I >> might save a third -- not build it for a third. >> >> I tried to price out a server based on what you recommended. Here is >> what I came up with: >> >> AMD Dual-Core Opteron 270 Italy 1000MHz HT 2 x 1MB L2 Cache Socket 940 >> Processor - Retail >> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103552 -- >> $461.00 x 2 = $922.00 >> >> TYAN S2895UA2NRF Dual Socket 940 NVIDIA nForce4 Professional SSI EEB 3.5 >> Server Motherboard - Retail >> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813151149 -- >> $539.99 >> >> Patriot Signature 2GB 184-Pin DDR SDRAM ECC Registered DDR 400 (PC 3200) >> System Memory - Retail >> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820220098 -- >> $286.99 x 4 = $1147.96 >> >> HITACHI Ultrastar 10K300 HUS103014FL3600 (08K2479) 147GB 10,000 RPM 8MB >> Cache SCSI Ultra320 68pin Hard Drive - OEM >> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16822145078 -- $279.99 >> x 2 = 559.98 >> >> >> Just that comes to $3,169.93 -- and there is still more to buy. >> >> Or am I doing something completely stupidly wrong in the way I am pricing >> this out? That could be. And if so, feel free to tell me -- but more >> importantly, please tell me how to do it right, because I just don't get >> it. >> >> I mean, yes, it makes sense that building it yourself should save a >> person money, but the numbers are just not coming out that way for me. >> >> Again, I thank you; but what am I missing? >> >> fp >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Mgr. Peter Tuharsky >> To: Hieromonk Peter >> Cc: [email protected] >> Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 3:12 AM >> Subject: Re: [Ltsp-discuss] Raid 1 or Raid 5? New server advice. >> >> >> Hi, Peter >> >> >> You're asking for experience, so I'd just add my own. >> >> I prefer using dual Opteron systems for servers and by the mean of >> performance, they have never disappointed me. Opteron just has better >> architecture (NUMA; Non-Uniform Memory Access) compared to Intel's old >> SMP (Symetric MultiProcessing). >> With Opteron, every processor has it's own builtin memory controller and >> own memory slots on mainboard, although another processor can of course >> ask for data that are stored in peer processor's memory. Each processor >> is directly connected to another processor. >> With Intel, everything goes thru FSB (Front-Side-Bus), even CPU-to-memory >> and CPU-to-CPU communication, so that system easily gets flooded by >> intense I/O or memory access even if processors don't have much to do. >> This is also the reason, why it often dosen't make much sense to add more >> and more processors to Intel SMP box; The problem usually lays in FSB >> bottleneck, not in lack of processor power. >> >> With Opteron, I have never experienced a situation when system was >> unresponsive. You can really feel the difference against any PC; the FSB >> is no more the bottleneck. >> >> >> You may want to save some money and build a system at Your own, because >> branded servers are expensive and hardly You get exactly what You want. >> On the other way, if You do have enough money, find the configuration >> that best fits Your needs and buy the HP or such server. Youl'll pay >> 3-times more, but You have guarantees and warm feeling :o) >> >> >> This is my advice: >> >> We have a local supplyer that is able to build systems exactly by our >> specification. >> You can use these components: >> >> -Tyan barebone system such as >> http://www.tyan.com/products/html/gt24b2891.html >> This way You get solid rack case with good power supply and motherboard >> inside, that altogether perfectly fit each other. Thus You do avoid >> problems with milimeter-wide disorders and non-fitting components that >> You'd face if You've built from separate MB, case and PSU components. >> >> -2x dual-core Opteron processors (for example model 270) >> >> -8x 1GB ECC registered memory (manual should instruct You, how to use the >> memory slots to gain fast dual-channel memory access) >> >> -The Tyan barebones are in several variants, for example the GT24 has a >> variants for SATA or SCSI disks. I'll go with SCSI, buy some hw RAID >> controller (for example the ADAPTEC 2130SLP for 64-bit 133MHz PCI-X slot) >> -4x identical disks (I'd choose Seagate). Install 3 disks in RAID5 >> configuration and leave the 4th disk aside, unplugged, for the case of >> malfunction of one of the three. >> >> And that's it, server made of quality, professional components for 1/3rd >> of price of branded server. >> >> Please note, that I have never used EXACTLY this server configuration. >> I'm only giving my best advice. I work with similar, however less >> powerful (2x single core Opteron, 2GB memory) and tower-based servers >> (Thermaltake case), the newer of them based on Tyan motherboard. >> Currently our supplier is going to build two new systems from Tyan >> barebones (GT20 (B2865) and GT24 (B2881G24S4-LC)) for us. >> >> I hope these information are of any value for You. >> >> >> Peter >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? >> Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job >> easier >> Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache >> Geronimo >> http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642 >> _____________________________________________________________________ >> Ltsp-discuss mailing list. To un-subscribe, or change prefs, goto: >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss >> For additional LTSP help, try #ltsp channel on irc.freenode.net >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642 _____________________________________________________________________ Ltsp-discuss mailing list. To un-subscribe, or change prefs, goto: https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/ltsp-discuss For additional LTSP help, try #ltsp channel on irc.freenode.net
