Carlos has kindly replied, but I am not sure he has answered all your
questions.
He says that he mistakenly called the string KFN, when actually they
are "Savarez Alliance KF". The density of the composite, he says, is
the same as monofilament carbon (1790 Kg/M3). However, he thinks you
need to take into account the quality of each lute, and each player
rather than applying some fixed rule (but I think we are all aware of
that).
He says that for the monofilament strings (like David Tayler mentions)
he rubs them down with 0000 wire-wool, or better Micromesh 3600 to
remove the surface noises of the over polished strings. He thinks this
is not necessary for the composite strings over 91.
He doesn't know the KFG strings, so can't comment. He says he did not
like the old nylgut, although he knows many people who love them, so it
is just his taste, and he goes on to say that for him the most
beautiful sound still remains gut.
I will wait for your response (and any other comments), and then
address a message to Savarez for everyone.
Regards
Anthony
El 11/12/2010, a las 10:13, [1]anthony.h...@n
__________________________________________________________________
De : Martyn Hodgson <[email protected]>
A : Anthony Hind <[email protected]>
Cc : [email protected]
Envoye le : Sam 11 decembre 2010, 10h 17min 38s
Objet : Re: Re : KF Harp strings and other types
Thank you Anthony,
I think when you say 'below 0.95 the strings are composite' you mean
the reverse - below 0.95 means thinner than this.
I would only consider using these KF strings for basses and look
forward to Saverez's reply - if they do....
regards
Martyn
'
--- On Sat, 11/12/10, Anthony Hind <[email protected]> wrote:
From: Anthony Hind <[email protected]>
Subject: Re : KF Harp strings and other types
To: "Martyn Hodgson" <[email protected]>
Cc: [email protected]
Date: Saturday, 11 December, 2010, 9:02
Dear Martyn
I will send your message to Savarez; but I think it will take
time for them to answer.
Carlos says that below 0.95 the strings are composite, above no.
I have no direct experience with carbon, except as a listener. I Know
Jacob Heringman used KF on his 5th course, and Martin has done so too,
with some success. I believe that for the fourth course and above, the
density of the monofilament KF is too dense and makes for too thin a
string. I know players and lute makers can compensate for this, but New
Nylgut is surely a better synthetic option.
I believe, below the 5th course the monofilament was too damped, but
perhaps the composite harps strings behave better, and may be this was
what Stephen Gottlieb had tried and found fairly satisfactory. This
could perhaps allow players to avoid wirewounds in situations where
they feel they can't use gut.
I don't think, however, we should pretend that any of these strings
will quite have the warmth and expressivity of gut, even if the
"touche" of a good player may well be far more important than strings.
I still feel that string choices can make that small expressive
difference.
I do feel that how strings are combined, can almost be as important as
the strings themselves. I have heard loaded strings combined with the
old nylgut and neither then sounded very good. The old nylgut sounded
too cold, in comparison with the warm loaded strings. Perhaps, the new
nylgut might work better, but I honestly think that as a minimum loaded
gut should be combined with gut octaves, and that the type of gut
octave chosen is also important.
Sorry to all for having apparently made a break away thread from the
original. I have been having computer problems, and became a little
confused after a number of hours trying to put things right.
Regards
Anthony
__________________________________________________________________
De : Martyn Hodgson <[email protected]>
A : [email protected]; Anthony Hind <[email protected]>
Cc : [email protected]
Envoye le : Sam 11 decembre 2010, 9h 35min 28s
Objet : Re: KF Harp strings and other types
Dear Anthony,
Many thanks for your trouble and, yes, I'd like to take up your kind
offer of asking Saverez (in perfect French!):
1. Are these 'new' strings the same as the old KFG? And does KFN relate
to the newness (nouveau) of the new strings?
2. Are the strings less than .0.95mm in diameter monofilament and only
thicker ones composite?
3. What is the density of the composite strings (to allow for stringing
calculations)? What is the density of the monofilament strings?
I'd also like to ask for the modulus if elasticity etc but fear they'd
freak out!
regards
Martyn
From: Anthony Hind <[email protected]>
Subject: KF Harp strings and other types
To: "Martyn Hodgson" <[email protected]>,
[email protected]
Cc: [email protected]
Date: Friday, 10 December, 2010, 23:52
Dear Martyn and Martin
It is true that Carlos' original message was slightly ambiguous,
but I have asked him to clarify this question, and he tells me that
between KFN33 et KFN91 the strings are still simplex monofilament, it
is only below the diameter of 0,95mm (KFN95) that strings are
composite. He goes on to say that in his experience the lowest limit
for lutes is KFN140.
Carlos sends you his friendly regards
Best wishes
Anthony
PS If you have more detailed questions, I will try to ask them to
Savarez.
Thank you for this Martin and Anthony. These strings are interesting as
a further alternative to loaded, wire wound and the 'spring' string;
especially for those with a large number of instruments to string.
I looked into these Saverez KF strings some time ago (are you sure
they're 'new' out?) and had reports at the time that
they
were simply
PVF(carbon) strings like any other of the same ilk. I'd be grateful for
any clarification you can
offer.
Martin, you say they only become multi strand above 0.95mm dia but in
Anthony's message he gives someone using thinner KF strings with the
implication that they are these new multi-strand type. 'an example of
the stringing he uses on a lute or 7c Vihuela : g' KFN33 - d' KFN43 -
a KFN52 - f KFN66-33 - c KFN84 - 43,5 - G KFN 112 - 57 - F KFN126 -
62.' Is it possible that the 'new' aspect of these KF strings are that
Saverez now makes these multistrand strings at smaller diameters?
What's the signoficance of the N in KFN? Does it mean new/nouveau type
of KF strings?
The Saverez website is next to useless only giving marketing blurb and
lists of available sizes but says the strings are made from 'composite
fibres' which again
implies that all sizes are multi strand. They also
make the claim that they are new but perhaps they simply haven't
updated an
old website?
ALLIANCE KF COMPOSITE, Strings for harp
A real innovation! This strings are manufactured from composites fibres
A production which requires fine and sophisticated technologies that
only Savarez could implement until now.
Thanks to the technologies, Savarez can produce strings which
geometrical qualities are perfect and which resist to the tensions
required by the harp. Many years of work and a focusing of complicated
technologies were necessary to obtain such a result.
A long work on the molecules, some molecular relationships and the rate
of "cristalinity" allow Savarez to obtain an elongation and an
elasticity identical to the ones of the gut.
The density of these strings is extremely close to the one of the gut,
so
the comparison takes more value. So though gut strings still are
very popular, Alliance KF strings have a perfect alternative sound
for
those who wish to take profit of gut sound and synthetic strings
advantages.
Martyn
Dear All,
I have been using these KF strings for some years. The smallest
diameter is .95mm, but this is the equivalent of a gut string of about
1.07mm. The one I use is "KF95A", but I think the "A" just refers to
the fact that it is a 2m length. It works well as a 5th course on a
renaissance lute (with an octave - I have not tried unison). It looks
more like a gut string, opaque rather than clear. I have not tried the
thicker strings, but it seems that it might be worth a try - I think
Jacob Heringman may have done so. I think the next size down is .91mm,
but it is a plain monofilament PVF string. I think some people are
using them for a unison 5th course.
Best
wishes,
Martin
--
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