In a way, I'm sort of becoming an evangelist for VO and orca. It's probably because I use them a lot and think they are both pretty good and I don't need to deal with Windows and its many problems. On GNU/Linux I can even try to help fix bugs that bother me in orca.
OT: A friend of mine and I have been thinking about making t-shirts that show an orca busting the surface with a great white shark in its mouth. We'll add the slogan, "Squish the Fish!" The back will say, "Innovate Don't Litigate." It will be an amusing protest against FS and its nasty business practices while also bringing attention to a truly free software screen access tool that is orca. It's hard to find an image for VoiceOver as dramatic as an orca busting the surface (once, a few years ago when I was in Redmond for an MS event, a woman who works for MS and a few of her friends and I went out in kayaks to catch some chinook salmon. While out there, a pod of orca started free jumping to make a "bait ball" which, even if I could only hear it, was one of the most amazing nature oriented experiences I've ever had. We were about 500 meters from the whales so were quite safe. I also got to catch and release a 30 pound salmon which gave me a real sleigh ride in the 15 foot kayak in which I sat). On Dec 10, 2009, at 11:54 AM, James & Nash wrote: > All fair points Chris, although I've always found NVDA to be very good - at > lesat in Word. I too always look at the tools I or another user needs for > the job at hand, thus like you, I am not and hopefully will never be an > evangelist for one platform or piece of AT. > > TC > > James > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chris Hofstader" <c...@hofstader.com> > To: <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> > Sent: Thursday, December 10, 2009 3:04 PM > Subject: Re: questions about NVDA > > > I guess I was referring to NVDA's relatively minimal support for the MS > Office applications which are usually required for a job using a PC in the > US. NVDA has the parts under their hood to equal or even surpass the > support for MS Office in JAWS or Window-Eyes but they haven't the resources > to get it done in the short term. > > Also, in Excel, they may bump up against a patent I think is bogus but would > cost them far too much to defend and I can predict with a huge degree of > certainty that FS will prosecute the patent against a less well heeled > competitor. As this is part of the FS v. GW lawsuit, though, the patent may > be overturned fairly soon as the placemarker patent has been all but > eliminated. GW actually had the liquidity to fight back and it looks like > they will prevail on all points in the case with FS. > > As I am a former employee of Project GNU (www.gnu.org) and having co-founded > League for Programming Freedom (www.progfree.org) with Richard Stallman, my > sympathies are always with free (as in freedom with a lower case "f") > solution like NVDA or orca but I also consider the tools a user needs in > most jobs and that's where, due to the lack of good Office support, that I > feel NVDA falls down. > > cdh > On Dec 10, 2009, at 9:29 AM, James & Nash wrote: > >> Hi Chris, >> You wrote: >> NVDA is a usable program that, unfortunately, doesn't support very many >> applications yet. If you can program in Python, you can help the team >> move >> it forward. As a full time solution, though, it isn't ready for prime >> time >> yet. >> >> I have to disagree with you. I think NVDA is an extremely viable solution, >> but of course it depends what you want to do with your PC,, but then that >> can be said about all Assistive Technologies on all platforms. I know of >> some Windows users in France who cannot afford JFW and the other >> commercial >> applications and use it full time. NVDA has a huge advantage out of the >> box - although E-Speak is not the best voice in the world, it offers >> around >> 45 foreign languages so that users can get to work right away. >> >> But of course there has been criticism from commercial venders and those >> trainers who should really be impartial - at least in my view. They >> believe >> that because NVDA is free and open source then it must automatically be a >> non starter. >> >> TC >> James >> >> TC >> James >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Chris Hofstader" <c...@hofstader.com> >> To: <macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> >> Sent: Thursday, December 10, 2009 1:42 PM >> Subject: Re: questions about NVDA >> >> >> NVDA is a usable program that, unfortunately, doesn't support very many >> applications yet. If you can program in Python, you can help the team >> move >> it forward. As a full time solution, though, it isn't ready for prime >> time >> yet. >> >> I know both Mick and Jamie, the top of the NVDA team, and they work really >> hard but I don't think that either Mozilla or Microsoft is giving them any >> more money so their progress will likely slow now. >> >> SATOGO, a no cost solution for Windows boxes attached to the Internet and >> System Access, it's commercial big brother which is less expensive than >> all >> other credible Windows screen readers, are good free (as in free lunch) >> and >> low cost solutions that work in most programs that most people want/need. >> >> I think SA (both versions) has a magnification portion. I don't think >> I've >> ever heard of anyone actually using it so, as I can't see well enough to >> use >> it, I cannot say much about it. >> >> Someone told me that the magnifier built into Windows 7 is actually quite >> good and, as it is entirely API driven, it is unlikely to introduce as >> many >> stability problems as MAGic or ZoomText. It has a limited feature set but >> it may be good enough for your purposes and as it is included with the OS, >> the price is right. >> >> cdh >> >> >> >> On Dec 9, 2009, at 3:33 PM, Joe Plummer wrote: >> >>> Hi, might want to use satogo on the Windows side also. As far as a >>> magnifying solution you might want to try magic from Freedom Scientific >>> you >>> can use it and use it in conjunction with Jaws. Both of these can be ran >>> in >>> a Demo mode that will let you use it for ever in a 40 minute mode. Just >>> some >>> thoughts. >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>> [mailto:macvisionar...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Ryan Mann >>> Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 2:23 PM >>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com >>> Subject: Re: questions about NVDA >>> >>> NVDA is basically a free screen reader for the Windows platform. It >>> works >>> with programs such as Internet Explorer, Microsoft Word, Microsoft Excel >>> and >>> somewhat with Outlook. In case you don't know, Microsoft Excel is an >>> application for doing spreadsheets and Outlook is the email program that >>> comes with Microsoft Office. >>> >>> On Dec 9, 2009, at 1:53 PM, Christina wrote: >>> >>>> Hello all, >>>> >>>> I saw a discussion earlier and the subject line was something like >>>> back on a mac. Well someone mentioned NVDA on windows seven. I have >>>> not installed windows on my macbook. However I've considered it >>>> simply because I'd like to try using zoomtext to try to look at photos >>>> as I do not feel the built in zoom for the mac is good for that. I >>>> have lost so much vision lately so I'm not sure if even zoom text >>>> would help but I am thinking of trying. I understand that zoomtext >>>> will not work in the virtual environment and therefore I would have to >>>> use boot camp. >>>> >>>> So onto my questions. What is NVDA? I do not have a windows screen >>>> reader like jaws or window eyes so I'm curious as to what this is and >>>> how robust this is. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> Christina >>>> >>>> -- >>>> >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>>> >>>> >>> >>> Ryan Mann >>> rmann0...@gmail.com >>> Get to the root of the problem with the US economy at >>> http://www.dailypaul.com. >>> >>> -- >>> >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >>> >>> >> >> -- >> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "MacVisionaries" group. >> To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >> >> >> >> -- >> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "MacVisionaries" group. >> To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >> >> > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. 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