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Which is the reason we only provide training on the
client's site, using the client's data and solving the client's problems.
We price higher than an "Authorized Training Site", but an
engineering, trucking or cable client gets little benefit from a training
session that has been populated by real estate and marketing
people.
When our trainer leaves, the client is solving immediate company problems,
making her boss very happy. We have gained an insight to their operations
and stand ready to help with other solutions. More Sales!!
You are exactly right but unfortunately most of the
training I have been involved in from vendors has been way over priced(
several hundred $'s/day) and not very good, if not awful. Some tech person
talks in a monotone and reads line by line from a poorly prepared
instruction manual that has an example dataset that has nothing to do with
what the student needs to be working on. Effective training has to have
an evaluation component to see if the student is understanding or retaining
the material so that they can move on to the next topics in the course
with confidence. I have never seen this done in commercial
courses.
I have found that the local community college does a far
better job and charges for a 10 week course $100 or so.
The GIS industry, as like the rest of the software world,
needs to re-invent training programs. I'll bet if a serious study were done
of current programs that the effectiveness would be rated at less than 10%,
that is, the student retains less than 10%of the material 1 day after taking
the course. But the responsibility is not all the vendor's. Companies send
staff to software training and their management puts nothing in place to
evaluate the effectiveness of the training or do they attempt to measure
whether their investment paid off, and seldom do they give the staff member
time to just sit at their terminal and go through the manual chapter by
chapter. ESRI is putting affordable courses on the Internet, I have no
idea if they are any good or not.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2000 7:46
AM
Subject: RE: MI Best GIS for
dollar
First the disclaimer - I work for a
MapInfo VAR and we have an ATC (Authorized Training
Center).
With that said, whether ERSI, MapInfo,
Maptitude, Mamifold, etc.... if you intend to be a power-user, or need a
team of strong users,
it is essential to budget in training as
well. I've taken and taught training on both sides (MI &
ESRI). GIS, however convincing the marketing
blush,
is a complex and difficult field for new
users. Just understanding the concepts (and limitations) of
geographic analysis takes time to digest.
Its only user friendly if the user has a
clue.
Where time is money and a limited
resource, good training class can save you hours of
wasted project time
with an ever-approaching and unforgiving
deadline. Even if you later switch products, a firm
grasp of GIS concepts makes learning
competitor software much easier. Will any
of us be using the same software in five years?
Doubtful.
Eventually the GIS user is powerful, and the
software just a tool.
When budgeting for software, budget for GIS
training as well. It will pay for itself tenfold regardless
of the final product choice.
Dick,
Perfectly put. Very few of us use anywhere near the
potential of any software; we learn what is necessary to do our
tasks and complete our mission.
It is great to be innovative but a couple of old expressions
sum up the risk..."The first guy on the beach gets the
bullet" and "The leading edge of the sword has the most
nicks."
I like to remember the lesson of Levi Strauss. As
thousands gallumphed into the western horizon to grab the first
chunk of gold, Levi loaded his goods in a slow wagon team and
followed to sell them the standard commodities they would still
need.
My cost of maintaining various editions of MI,
with V Mapper and data versus Maptitude and Surfer 6 and 7 and
both product's programming languages is 8 to 1. MI is around
because my users had MI - although no longer - ESRI made them a
deal they couldn't refuse. So maybe I won't upgrade. However if
you have a job to do, saving money on software and upgrades can
certainly be a false economy. It of course depends on the job.
However, not every GIS user is a developer, or
ever cares to make a GIS app beyond using the programming
language to automate their own task to support. There are a lot
of people who need almost industrial strength GIS tools to work
on particular problems and get things done. Maptitude and
Manifold could fill this void. What I hear from Manifold and
Maptitude sure indicates that they are not exactly stuck ... new
things are going to appear which I don't think ESRI or MI are
capable of doing now because they are "stuck" in a GIS
paradigm that won't be here in 5 years.
Of courser, it depends on what you need to do,
and I would submit that a whole lot of people are spending $1400
when they could be spending $400. Seems that MI is not exactly
preparing for when folks figure that out.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2000 3:06
PM
Subject: RE: MI Best GIS for
dollar
> For what it's worth -
>
> Overall, I have to agree that Maptitude is the best
generic GIS value. Great
> data set, good
functionality, fabulous import/export capability, built
in
> routing, etc.
>
> But there are still
plenty of reasons to go with other more expensive
packages.
>
> A major factor in deciding which GIS
use for many of us is the 3rd party tools
>
available. Mapinfo and Arcview both have hundreds of free
public domain
> utilities and programs available, and
dozens more for sale. Practically any
> vertical
market need a user has, from site selection to watershed
analysis, has
> been covered by the third party developer
and VAR channel.
>
> Maptitude is really deficient
here, even though the package has a good
> programming
language. Maptitude's sale price is so low that Caliper
can't
> afford to have a decent reseller program (nor have
they ever tried hard to
> cultivate one), which forces
them to try to do everything in-house. Hence, they
>
have a good generic package, but very little vertical market
tools or
> penetration. Routing applications are the
one exception, which Caliper has
> developed
in-house.
>
> And there's something to be said for
critical mass. ESRI and Mapinfo have most
> of the
market share, most of the trained GIS users, and most of the
installed
> base. If your company is making mission
critical decisions with GIS, and you
> need to find
trained GIS users with experience in your particular industry,
the
> extra expense of going with an established market
leader is inconsequential
> compared to the risk of making
bad operational decisions by trying to save a few
> bucks
up front.
>
> Berk Charlton
> Geographic
Marketing Solutions.
>
>
> >
-----Original Message-----
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Leore, Robert
> > Sent: Thursday,
May 11, 2000 9:41 AM
> > To: MapInfo-L
> >
Subject: RE: MI Best GIS for dollar
> >
>
>
> > Maptitude by Caliper is the best GIS for the
dollar. At US$395 it is the
> > cheapest path to
a full-featured GIS. I used to use MI but I now
use
> > Maptitude and its big brother TransCAD
exclusively. Check these programs
> > out at
www.caliper.com.
>
>
> > Bob
> >
> >
>
>
> > > > Hi Everyone,
> > >
>
> > > > I have been reading the threads on
MI and ArcView in the same office and
> > >
am
> > > > interested in peoples opinions as to
value. I am considering purchase
> > > of
a
> > > > GIS but would like info on value
vs functionality.
> > > >
> > > >
Can anyone suggest a GIS system that gives the best 'bang for
your buck'
> > > > for business applications such
as demographic studies, network analysis
> > >
and
> > > > has decent spatial modeling
capabilities? Map Design and layout
> > > >
capabilities are important also.
> > > >
>
> > > I have used ArcInfo and ArcView but realise there
are other systems such
> > > as
> > >
> MI, Esri Atlas GIS and Manifold. Unfortunately, as
everyone knows many
> > > > systems lack basic
functionality required to complete a project and
> >
> either
> > > > you need to buy expensive
'add-on' modules or use a different program to
> > >
> complete the project.
> > > >
> >
> > For example, what does the Esri Atlas GIS give that
you cannot do with
> > > > ArcView and a business
add-on? Manifold claims it does way more than MI.
> >
> > Are there users experienced with several of these
systems that could
> > > shed
> > > >
some light on the relative strengths and weaknesses of these
systems?
> > > >
> > > > Is one of
these systems head and shoulders above the rest?
> >
> >
> > > > Thanks in advance,
> >
> >
> > > > Shepherd Stewart
> >
>
> >
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>
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>
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