So, I agree with the proposal. L8 could be seen as a new start and not an achievement... new developers mean new functionalities, evolving organization. I think we can build something around that. Marketed as the mix of different knowledge as distinguishing elements.
Regards, Régis Le ven. 7 avr. 2023 à 00:14, Italo Vignoli <it...@vignoli.org> a écrit : > I have written that developers have a different mindset from marketing > people. I have never said that developers are dumb people, and I have > never even thought this. > > On 06/04/23 23:45, Regis Perdreau wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > So if i understand correctly, developers are dumb people, talking only to > > its computer, and marketer have the privilege to speak to real user... > > Well, all the day, i speak to real user, and all say that marketers talk > > non sense about Microsoft compatibility... > > I wonder how to solve daily cognitive dissonnance > > * > > < > https://context.reverso.net/traduction/anglais-francais/cognitive+dissonance > >* > > Just kidding > > > > Cheers, > > Régis Perdreau > > > > > > > > Le jeu. 6 avr. 2023 à 23:00, Gustavo Buzzatti Pacheco < > gbpach...@gmail.com> > > a écrit : > > > >> Hi, Nigel, Ben, Eyal, all! > >> > >> Let me add some comments. :) > >> > >> For sure, the current approach is a requirement for our internal > >> development organization, as Ben noted. Also, it was really important in > >> the first years of LibreOffice/TDF, when we used it to demonstrate we > were > >> ahead of Apache OpenOffice for the users and the strong > project/community > >> we were building. > >> > >> On the other hand, for the current moment of LibreOffice as a project > and > >> product, I think we can do more or different things. Nigel wrote > >> exactly what I mean about 'boring' from the user perspective: most of > the > >> users don't care about minor changes. > >> > >> So, I think, now, we should decide about releases with a Marketing > >> perspective and the number 8 could be a first step to do it, even > without > >> big changes. > >> > >> Could it mean we will do a marketing trick? > >> > >> I think no, because we will be transparent with our users as we always > >> have been. If the release won't have big improvements, we won't talk > about > >> big improvements. > >> > >> Why release a version without big improvements? > >> > >> That is the other point: I don't think we should focus only on big > code > >> improvements to use major version numbers (or even version names). We > >> aren't only a product. We are a project and community. Indeed, the > released > >> product is our final work but a major version can also be used to spread > >> (or celebrate) the maturity of the product/project/community. This is a > >> different approach than paid software/non FLOSS. This is what I mean > with > >> consolidation. > >> > >> > >> On Thu, Apr 6, 2023 at 8:22 AM Nigel Verity <nigelver...@hotmail.com> > >> wrote: > >> > >>> Hi Gustavo > >>> > >>> This is a very good point. > >>> > >>> If I see that some software I use regularly has gone from 7.5 to 7.6, > >>> say, I wouldn't rush to upgrade unless I knew it fixed a problem that > >>> affected me. I'm pretty sure that I would upgrade from 7.5 to to 8.0 > far > >>> more quickly, if for no other reason that the psychological one of > wanting > >>> to be using what my head tells me must be an improvement over my > current > >>> version. > >>> > >>> Of course release notes are available to determine what really has > >>> changed but I rather suspect that most users never read them. > >>> > >>> The discussion of the different motivators for development and > marketing > >>> people is very interesting. When I was a developer neither I nor > anybody in > >>> my teams was ever let anywhere near sales activities - and I think for > very > >>> good reasons. > >>> > >>> Cheers > >>> > >>> Nige > >>> > >>> > >>> * LibreOffice - Free and open source office suite: LibreOffice Website > >>> <https://www.libreoffice.org/> * > >>> * Respects your privacy, and gives you back control over your data* > >>> ------------------------------ > >>> *From:* Gustavo Buzzatti Pacheco <gbpach...@gmail.com> > >>> *Sent:* 05 April 2023 22:05 > >>> *To:* TDF Devs <libreoff...@lists.freedesktop.org>; TDF Marketing < > >>> marketing@global.libreoffice.org>; TDF Design < > >>> des...@global.libreoffice.org> > >>> *Subject:* Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [libreoffice-design] Moving > >>> to LibreOffice 8? > >>> > >>> Hi Eyal, all! > >>> > >>> I also respectfully disagree with you on some points. ;D > >>> > >>> I like the idea to move to 8, even with no big technical innovation > (if > >>> we > >>> have, for sure it will be better). > >>> > >>> IMHO, long sequences of minor releases (7.6, in the current case) are > >>> getting boring and not important for the users (for both enterprise and > >>> individual profiles). > >>> > >>> I'm not saying that we should embrace the Firefox approach, but > thinking > >>> about Italo's idea (8 <-> infinite), I guess the message of this > version > >>> could be consolidation, not exactly innovation. > >>> > >>> Best > >>> Gustavo > >>> > >>> > >>> On Tue, Mar 28, 2023 at 4:23 AM Eyal Rozenberg <eyalr...@gmx.com> > wrote: > >>> > >>>> I respectfully disagree with Italo. > >>>> > >>>> First, about the "frame of reference". In my opinion, decisions such > as > >>>> major version number bumping are not, first and foremost, marketing > >>>> decisions. That is a _consideration_, since the version number is > >>>> declarative than technical. But - such an action should be "truthful" > >>>> before being "marketable". > >>>> > >>>> It is more important, in my opinion, that users and potential users > >>>> receive trustworthy signaling from the project - not just w.r.t. > version > >>>> numbers, but generally - than for the media to get a gimmick for > >>> coverage. > >>>> > >>>> A second point is that bumping a version number without a major > >>>> innovation moves you a few more steps into the category of, say, > Firefox > >>>> and such, where versions just increase automatically with no meaning > >>>> whatsoever. Italo, you said we are perceived as a "real innovator"; > >>>> well, when a real innovator starts having hollow version number > bumping, > >>>> that perception fades. > >>>> > >>>> Finally, everyone who likes the marketing potential of version 8 - > >>>> great, but - keep that benefit for when we have a significant step > >>>> forward to celebrate. Don't squander it. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Eyal > >>>> > >>>> PS: availability on a new platform is not a reason to bump a version > >>>> number. It's the "same" software, but built for another target, so > same > >>>> version as before. IMHO anyway. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> On 27/03/2023 20:11, Italo Vignoli wrote: > >>>>> Moving to LibreOffice 8 (instead of 7.6) makes sense for marketing > >>>>> purposes, as media is looking at LibreOffice as the real innovator in > >>>>> the open source office suite market, and the feeling of journalists > is > >>>>> that we are forever stuck at 7.x. > >>>>> > >>>>> We all know that the next version will not include any significant > >>>>> innovation which can justify the change of version, apart from the > new > >>>>> build system for Windows and the availability of LibreOffice for Arm > >>>>> processors on Windows (which has not been announced). > >>>>> > >>>>> Playing with the number 8, which can be rotated 90° to become the > >>>>> "infinite" symbol, we can frame the next version as LibreOffice for > an > >>>>> infinite number of users, as we cover all hardware platforms and all > >>>>> operating systems for personal productivity. > >>>>> > >>>>> This is my opinion. If the community wants to stick with 7.6, I won't > >>>>> insist. I have received enough insults both public and private for > the > >>>>> marketing plan, and I am still receiving them from a few people, that > >>> I > >>>>> am not willing to enter into that process again (even if the decision > >>> on > >>>>> the "community" tag has not been mine, but it looks like people have > a > >>>>> very short memory). > >>>>> > >>>>> Looking forward to your thoughts. > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> To unsubscribe e-mail to: > marketing+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org > >>>> Problems? > >>> > >> > > > -- > Italo Vignoli - it...@vignoli.org > mobile/signal +39.348.5653829 > hangout/jabber italo.vign...@gmail.com > GPG Key ID - 0xAAB8D5C0 > DB75 1534 3FD0 EA5F 56B5 FDA6 DE82 934C AAB8 D5C0 > > -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: marketing+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/ Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy
