Shouldn't we just try to rely on state militias for our nations defense? It seems the military industrial complex has our national military by the balls.....I still haven't seen miller respond with any info that points to his Ron Paul accusations. He keeps saying we don't understand the gay issues. I'm not sure what he means. We do seem to understand the gay issues. I just want to know in which debate did Ron Paul say he would not repeal don't ask don't tell. Maybe I'll ask him myself on myspace.
thanks, Tony --- Anthony Gregory <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Well, I think it is wrong to initiate force against > children. And it's wrong > to initiate force against the blind. And it's wrong > to initiate force > against gays. > > Libertarianism is about non-aggression. If blind > people don't have a right > to be in the military, then neither do gays or > straights or any other group. > All individuals have a right not to be aggressed > against. Clearly, being > fired from a government job is not aggression. No > one has a right to live at > the expense of another. Working for the government > is no one's right. > > How can you disagree with this, fancy yourself a > libertarian, and accuse > others of emotionalism? > > I never once implied that gays would be no more > competent than children or > the blind in serving the state. As I said before, > gays are probably just as > good at straights at serving the state in the > military. But what does this > have to do with libertarianism? > > On 11/1/07, Brian Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > Now there's a line that will lead to much > electoral and outreach success. > > Gay people are legally incompetent (like children) > and handicapped (like the > > blind), and gay servicepersons are like organized > criminals. > > > > Bonjournée, boys, I'm back to work. > > > > Brian > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > From: Anthony Gregory <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: Brian Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Cc: Anthony Burke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Brian > Holtz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; > > [email protected] > > Sent: Thursday, November 1, 2007 12:39:48 PM > > Subject: Re: My last e-mail on this stuff > > > > Do children have a right to join the military? How > about blind people? > > > > A right is something that all individuals have. > You can't all have a right > > to join the military. Military jobs are, at best, > welfare programs. No one > > has a right to be on welfare. Typically, they > involve committing aggression > > against people abroad. No one has a right to that. > You have no more > > libertarian right to join the military than you do > to join the Mafia. > > > > On 11/1/07, Brian Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > > > I've got a lot of work to get done today, and > not a lot of time to do > > > it, so I'm not going to get in a long and > circular discussion. > > > > > > Suffice to say: > > > > > > 1) Of course being booted out of the military > based on one's sexual > > > orientation is a violation of one's rights. > It's fundamentally in > > > opposition to the equal protection clause of the > Constitution. > > > > > > 2) Seriously, guys, if you're interested in > these issues, rather than > > > e-mailing me asking such basic questions, read > up on the issues and become > > > involved. Our web site at > http://www.outrightusa.org has a wealth of > > > material on the issues, as well as links to > various other forums where > > > Outright activists participate or contribute > content. > > > > > > The most effective lobby for military LGBTQ > issues is Integrity In > > > Service, which is headed up by Pepe Johnson (a > Libertarian Party member). > > > There's a link from our web site, but you can go > there directly at > > > http://www.integrityinservice.org > > > > > > The lack of familiarity with Outright's > positions based on Libertarian > > > Party theory and platforms here is precisely > what I was talking about > > > earlier on LGBTQ issues. Outright studies these > issues, corresponds with > > > the queer community (and the Libertarian > community) and builds bridges that > > > lead to electoral and financial contribution > success. That's why it's > > > important to have solid grounding in the issues, > legislation, positions of > > > politicians in all the national parties, etc. > We have equal commitments to > > > the rights of the LGBTQ community and the > success of the LP (and libertarian > > > movement). That's one reason we ask that those > who demand libertarian > > > support be real libertarians on the issues of > importance to the community as > > > a whole. > > > > > > If you blindly charge into a discussion in the > queer community waving > > > your sword and striking at LGBTQ Libertarians, > as well as gay people who > > > might not be on board with the LP, all you do is > shut out the libertarian > > > movement's chances of growing membership and > support. That doesn't help the > > > LP, but it has been typical practice by many in > this thread. > > > > > > Go to outrightusa.org, read our position papers, > our scorecards, and > > > check out the (extensive) blog archives -- > including the survey responses > > > from the Libertarian nomination candidates. Get > educated on the issues in > > > the scorecard, and then if you really care about > the LGBTQ community's > > > issues, take them to your candidate of choice > and ask him to engage honestly > > > with queer Libertarians and our supporters, as > well as the larger LGBTQ > > > American community. > > > > > > And if you don't care about them, then just say > so and drop the > > > pretenses. Many Ron Paul supporters have been > honest in that regard, and I > > > respect them for it. > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > > > Brian > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > > > From: Anthony Gregory < > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > To: Brian Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Cc: Anthony Burke < [EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Brian > Holtz < [EMAIL PROTECTED]>; > > > [email protected] > > > Sent: Thursday, November 1, 2007 12:04:14 PM > > > Subject: Re: Ron Paul a "homophobic bigot"? > > > > > > Brian, do you really believe that being kicked > out of the military is a > > > rights violation? As a radical, why would you > favor the right of anyone to > > > work for a criminal institution? > > > > > > On 11/1/07, Brian Miller > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > I'm all for straight allies. There are lots > of them, many of them are > > > > informed about the issues. > > > > > > > > Unfortunately, all the criticism of Outright's > scorecard is without > > > > basis, and when it comes from people who > aren't involved in any of the > > > > issues in question -- sans Outright's > input/involvement -- it becomes > > > > ludicrous. > > > > > > > > The attacks on Outright's factual assessment > of Ron Paul's policy > > > > positions have no basis in fact. We've > defined concrete areas for each of > > > > them, and have invited his supporters to > demonstrate policy areas where he > > > > differs from our assessment. > > > > > > > > For example, on gays on the military, we do > not ask "do you support > > > > letting gays serve in the military," as that's > an === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
