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I think the proposal below reflects theoretical lacunae that led to syndicalism 
on the one hand and utopianism  on the other, 'tho lessons on the art of 
proletarian solidarity building were gleaned from both.

For capitalist surplus value to be transformed into socialist social value*,
State power remains necessary to tax a portion for the general welfare or human 
societal services the most "productive" proletariat (exchangers of their labor 
power for the means to reproduce it) may  not consider essential, certainty not 
in the early stages of unconscious transition, especially where labor is 
"slicing and dicing, manufacturing, packaging and delivering loans to sell 
lenders.  As the president said, when running in March 2008, when the measure 
of our  Gross Domestic PRODUCT is more determined by the  sales of derivatives 
than steel I beams, you know something is wrong. Or words to that effect which 
persuaded me the man understands.  Some of us might have preferred production 
of commodities we deem more humanizing, or more free time instead of triple 
over time in exchange for lay offs  and declining union memberships,  but we 
did not have state power nor determine use value.


Limiting our understanding of surplus value to the context of the exploitation 
of labor to extract maximum growth in what we can see today may as well be 
called "privatized monetized world average surplus time, social surplus, or 
social value" and  
learning to explain it only in the context of organizing industrial workers' 
wages and projected sale prices of the products of their particular industry, 
was a function of the historic mode of production in which we organized and the 
form in which data were available to us.
However it blinded us to fully utilizing what Marx and Engels bequeathed us to 
strive(much less stride) toward socialism. In mho that is, and based of course 
on my limited practice.

  I thought of going back and changing "our" "us" and "we" to "I my and me" so 
as to not appear to be speaking FOR others, but it is my opinion from the 
practice of all other, and far better  than I, organizers I've observed.

* definition of social surplus: "difference between
world average time we workers add to products of same kind 
minus
 that that others  put in what we have to pay 
for to work another day" 
cf: www.peggydobbins.net/dwellingintents/epilogue.HTML to tune of Solidarity

On Nov 20, 2010, at 12:50 PM, Greg McDonald <gregm...@gmail.com> wrote:

> 
> 
> 
> Instead of their typical capitalist structures that split employers
> from employees, a post-capitalist structure would position workers as,
> collectively, their enterprise's own board of directors -- Marx's
> "associated workers." The era of capitalist employers (e.g., corporate
> boards selected by and responsible to major private shareholders)
> would then have come to an historic end. The capitalist class
> structure of production would have been superseded by such a
> collectivization of surplus appropriation inside enterprises (Wolff
> 2010).
> 
> For example, consider enterprises newly structured such that the
> workers produce outputs in the usual way Mondays through Thursdays,
> but on Fridays, assembled in both plenaries and subgroups, they make
> decisions previously taken by boards of directors selected by (major)
> shareholders. That is, the workers democratically decide what, where,
> and how to produce and how to distribute their realized surpluses.
> They decide when and how to expand and contract. But they do not do
> that alone. They enter into co-respective power-sharing agreements
> with the local and regional communities where their physical
> production facilities are located. The workers participate in the
> residential communities’ decision-making processes and vice-versa.[8]"
> 


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