On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 4:54 PM, Kynn Jones <kyn...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 3:52 PM, Michael Droettboom <md...@stsci.edu>wrote:
>
>> On 11/17/2010 03:41 PM, Kynn Jones wrote:
>>
>> Hi. I am finding that matplotlib does not allow me to decouple certain
>> actions from the GUI as much as I'd like.
>>
>> For example, I have not been able to do any of the following tasks.
>> Some of these tasks are certainly artificial, but they all succinctly
>> illustrate some of the problems I've been running into when doing more
>> realistic stuff.
>>
>> 1. *without bringing up any GUI window*,
>>
>> Set the backend to a non-GUI backend, such as agg, pdf, ps, svg or cairo
>> by setting the 'backend' rcParam in matplotlibrc, or doing:
>>
>> import matplotlib
>> matplotlib.use("Agg") # Must be the first call after importing
>> matplotlib
>>
>> generate a list of all the filetypes available to a specific
>> matplotlib installation for saving graphics (e.g. .ps, .svg, .pdf, .png,
>> etc.);
>>
>> >From a figure object:
>>
>> figure.canvas.get_supported_filetypes()
>>
>> returns a dictionary of supported file extensions, with mapping to more
>> detailed descriptions of each.
>>
>
> Yes, but this solves the problem only for the non-GUI backends. It does
> not work for GUI backends, or at least for the MacOSX backend, which is the
> only graphics backend that I've managed to get to work (despite of,
> literally, days trying unsuccessfully to install other ones). With this GUI
> backend, as far as I know, generating a figure object (even an empty one),
> causes the window to pop up.
>
>
Actually, the macosx backend is alone in this matter. This behavior was
recently reported and is a bug. The other backends do not pop up a window
unless interactive mode is turned on.
> That's the point of this task: to illustrate that even something like
> getting a list of supported files, which does not require any graphical
> output, is nonetheless tightly coupled with displaying the GUI. As far as I
> can tell, there's simply no way to get these filetypes for GUI backends
> without bringing up a window. (I'm assuming here that the MacOSX backend is
> representative in this respect.)
>
>
By the same token, it is not possible to iterate over all the possible
> backends within the same script to find the filetypes they support, because
> the call to matplotlib.use(BACKEND) must happen before one imports
> matplotlib.pyplot, which is required to generate the figure.canvas to
> interrogate for possible filetypes. This is another illustration of what I
> refer to a tight coupling with the GUI.
>
There is a switch_backends function in pyplot, but it is experimental and
tricky:
http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/api/pyplot_api.html?highlight=switch_backend#matplotlib.pyplot.switch_backend
I have not checked, but maybe that get_supported_filetypes() could be made
intto a static function? That could address your complaint in that regard
because an instance of the backend does not need to be made.
> 2. switch back-and-forth between sending graphics objects for display to
>> the GUI and sending them for saving to any of the available filetypes (as
>> defined in (1));
>>
>> Once set to any of the GUI backends, you can use "show()" and "savefig()"
>> interchangeably.
>>
>
> Yes, but only for the filetypes associated with that backend; once the GUI
> backend is chosen, it blocks any other backend (even a non-GUI one) from
> loading. I'd argue that this is another example of tight coupling with the
> GUI, because there's no reason why making a choice of GUI should restrict
> the filetypes that can be saved. The problems of displaying a graphic and
> saving a file are completely orthogonal. Picking a solution for one should
> have no impact at all on what one chooses for the other.
>
I would argue that it is because no one has asked for this feature before.
Necessity is the mother of all inventions. We have a very basic
switch_backends function, but maybe you could help us make it better?
The reason for the different backends having different supported filetypes
is that some of the backends are speciality backends ("pdf", for example)
and obviously only supports the pdf file type. In some other situations,
the saving of the figure data is off-loaded to convenience functions in the
various gui toolkits. The main reason for this is that those gui's provide
the proper clipping and other rendering tricks needed for proper production
of the images. I am not as familiar with exactly what happens in the
backends, but as far as I know, the available file formats are the same
across all the major gui backends and Agg. It is only the specialty
backends that this is not the case.
If you find a discrepency, it is probably a bug and should be reported as
such.
3. (by far the most important one) *without activating any backend*, create
>> a graphics object (I explain what I mean by this below).
>>
>> To clarify what I mean by (3), the best I can do is to give an example
>> from Mathematica. In Mathematica, a Graphics object does not need to be
>> displayed. It can be defined as a collection of Graphics primitives,
>> without ever displaying it in the GUI. One such definition would be
>> something like
>>
>> In[1]:= g = Graphics[Line[{{1., 2.}, {2., 3.}, {3., 5.}}]];
>>
>> This is what I mean in (3) by creating a graphics object without
>> displaying it (in the GUI). From a design perspective, this makes a lot of
>> sense, since a Graphics object, as an idea, is entirely independent of
>> whatever mean one chooses to display it. I want my code to reflect this
>> conceptual independence.
>>
>> Regarding task (2), to make it more concrete, consider this (also
>> artificial) exercise: write a script that iterates over all filetypes
>> identified in (1); at each iteration, generate some random graphic (e.g. of
>> the sort shown here
>> http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/examples/api/patch_collection.html),
>> display it on the GUI, and save it as a file of the type corresponding to
>> the iteration.
>>
>> I would very much appreciate some hints/guidance on how to solve them.
>>
>> As I noted, by far the most important of these tasks is (3). From
>> looking into the matplotlib source code, it looks to me impossible to do
>> this with standard matplotlib functions. But I am very much of a noob with
>> mpl, so I still hope there's a way.
>>
>> In the worst case scenario (i.e. (3) can't be done directly using
>> standard mpl functions), then the only solution that I can think of would
>> involve implementing a separate layer of abstract graphics objects, distinct
>> from mpl's. This layer would then delegate to mpl the task of displaying
>> the graphics objects whenever the user requests it. Any suggestions on how
>> best to do this would be much appreciated. In particular, I'd like to know
>> what would be the right place to insert this new graphics object layer into
>> the matplotlib objects stack. I think it would be best to make this
>> connection at a level deeper than the axes object, but I'm not quite sure
>> how to do this.
>>
>> I think you'll find matplotlib works exactly as you want. I think you
>> might find this part of the documentation useful:
>>
>> http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/faq/installing_faq.html#backends
>>
>
> I'd read that before (that's where I learned the little I know about
> backends).
>
> Still, I don't see how one does (3). Here's an example problem:
>
> 1. generate (without bringing up a GUI window!) two different graphics
> objects, each corresponding to a unit circle;
> 2. perform a random translation/scaling transformation on each of the two
> circles;
> 3. combine the two circles into a single graphic object (so that they have
> a common coordinate system);
> 4. finally, display the resulting object.
>
>
>
As far as I can tell, steps 1-3 cannot be done before choosing (and locking
> in) a specific backend. If this backend is a GUI one (or at least the
> MacOSX one), then just carrying out (1) will cause a window to pop up.
>
>
As already covered above, the macosx backend is the only one to do this, and
it is a bug. Therefore, while backend has to be chosen at load-time, this
is not an issue, as it is not used until later.
To do what you want, you might want to take a look at these:
http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/users/path_tutorial.html
http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/users/artists.html
And maybe some stuff in the examples library. Matplotlib makes extensive
use of various artist objects, and collections of those objects to represent
the components of the figure to be plotted. So, you could create Circle
patch objects and others (before you make a call to figure()), and then add
them to an axes when ready.
As an additional note, if you are having difficulty compiling for MacOS X,
why not just ask for help with that?
Ben Root
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