Shlomi Fish wrote:
On Thursday 01 December 2005 22:42, Dotan wrote:
Alon Altman wrote:
On Thu, 1 Dec 2005, Dotan wrote:
I didn't talk of W2L I talked of the web archives and I did advertise
JLCs W2L series on FOSS related sites (you might want to check which
club has its coming events on the events boards in Whatsup,
Linmagazine and IGLU, you may also check which club had ads in the
Tapuz and Nana forums prior to it's series opening and the
instaparty. BTW in Tapuz it was some tech forum that made my
announcment sticky and not the Linux forum)
So, you took care of your own interests, when you could have invested
exactly the same amount of effort to advance the W2L series for all
clubs.
No I couldn't because you choose to address CS-students and such that
look for linux on google. This is not the audiance I was advertising for.
It seems that you are more interested in your own personal success than
advancing free software in Israel. Way to go!
Well... the W2L site does not link to the JLCs W2L dedicated site but we
link to yours.
A link could easily be added, if you told us to.
I'm sure you know of the site. You can decide where and what to link. I
choose to link the general site but the general site webmaster choose
not to link the JLC page.
The general W2L site is ugly and unappealing to the JLC target audiance
(non geeks, non cs-students, non linuxers wannabe, just the avarage
unsetisfied PC user), I pointed this few times
And what did you do about it? I'm maintaining the W2L site, and most of my
time I had to spend on adding and updating content there, and the various
things from Alon. The look of the site can be easily updated (in just one
place), but I did not do it due to other priorities. I can do it now.
I can't and naturaly won't do everything. I got Ram to offer his help.
BTW, as I pointed out in a previous message, the jlc.org.il site has several
deficincies which also weren't fixed:
<<<<<<<<<<<
1. Uses un-userfriendly URLS:
http://jlc.shared.mirimar.net/?page=lectures/lectures
Why the "?". Components should be seprated by slashes. Otherwise up buttons
don't work.
I guess it comes from the PHP. BTW Does IE has up button?
2. Doesn't have a contact the webmaster link in a footer at the bottom.
Contact details and other inforamtion regarding the site are availble in
seperate page linked from the sidebar.
http://www.jlc.org.il/?page=thissite
Naturaly it wasn't my call but I think it gives a clean nice look.
3. Is Hebrew only and doesn't have content written in the English language for
international users.
We are a local club - Lectures are givven in Hebrew, the forums are in
Hebrew, the common language in the meetings is Hebrew and our target
audiance (which include school kids as equale participants) knows Hebrew
much better then English
4. Is slow.
I'm using it now and it seem fine. Maybe you ment its "slower then pure
html" but thats something else.
Anyway trying to open your homepage took longer than opening the JLC page
5. The navigation menu at the right does not look well in Konqueror.
Looks great on my Konqueror. As I know your habits you probably disabled
some option which cause the menu to look wrong.
6. The current link in the navigation menu is not highlighted.
You might note pages have titles.
7. No next page/prev page/up page navigation controls in the Mozilla
navigation bar, or otherwise.
True. I never used it so I didn't notice.
8. Is written in PHP, which is unnecessary in this context. A static HTML site
is perfectly fine. (and mine is).
So?!
Note that I began revamping the existing jlc.iglu.org.il site, but then after
a JLC meeting which I did not attend, someone called me and informed out of
the blue, that he created a new site in PHP for the club, and that I should
host it on Eskimo.
You might recall we had different problems with the site and that those who
volunteered to update it did not give results.
I'm very happy with the whole new site Yehuda came up with in a time frame
which the previous existing site didn't even got to be updated.
but some people seem to
like ugly "informative" websites.
I like informative websites, but I don't think they should be ugly. If the
website is ugly it's because no-one moved a muscle to change the fact.
Ram offered his help but was sent from one person to the other cause one
don't have time and the other don't like PHP/frames/icons/links...
I can understand why he preffered to make better use of his time
Moreover the general W2L was not updated long after the JLC published
its schedule and untill pretty short time before the series actualy
started.
Did you send me the up-to-date schedule in time?
Yes
All in all I believe our site was much better then the general one
and it's too bad you choose not to link it (AFAIK Ram was willing to make
the general site look better but his offers were rejected).
No, they were not. Ram contacted me about the site. I told him it's not
necessary to write the site in PHP, and he thought the only alternative was
to write it directly in HTML. I told him he should use my existing Web Meta
Language framework, but he did not know it, and refused to invest time in
learning it. Alon eventually told me to let him write the site in PHP, and I
told Ram it's OK, but Ram did not produce any results since.
Eventualy is the key word here.
I thinks visitors of the general W2L site could and yet may get a very
wrong impression about Linux due to look and content of the site.
Perhaps, but that's what we have now, mainly because only Alon and I updated
it.
As I said there were other options that beurocracy scared away (this
refers to what you called "eventualy").
BTW Haifux too started building a dedicated site but couldn't came up
with one in time.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
Dotan
P.S. Do not CC me
