Hi Count, yep you're right, I'm no diplomat. (And - viziers and consuls - here in Germany with its baleful history, we have a different paradigm about states servants than in the hegemonic proud Ex-Ottoman Empire, German consuls aren't only servants of the state, but also servants of the people).
Anyway, the arrests of tourists having picked up a stone from the beach are always also a part of a political game. Partially because of the permanent refusal of the EU to start negotiations with Turkey for its admittance to the EU, and partially because of Turkey's aggressive policy to claim back antiquities and cultural heritage from other governments. From the Rep. of Germany for instance, they want to have back that stuff: http://www.geo.de/reisen/community/bild/regular/220723/Pergamon-Altar.jpg (Btw. one important reason for not declaring meteorites to be "cultural" heritage. That would bring the big historic institutional collections in hard troubles). Best! Martin -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: Count Deiro [mailto:[email protected]] Gesendet: Freitag, 19. April 2013 04:55 An: Martin Altmann; [email protected] Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Uh! Oh! Hallo Martin, I said meteorite to him and the answer was "no". I don't want to call attention to myself by asking for a further clarification. My feeling is that he would take offense at my having the impudence (Frechheit) to quote his own laws to him. Alles bestes Guido -----Original Message----- >From: Martin Altmann <[email protected]> >Sent: Apr 18, 2013 12:14 PM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Uh! Oh! > >Hi Count, > >maybe you could ask the consul again, to give you the respective law? > >Decisive is the Law No. 2863 of July 21, 1983 on Conservation of >Cultural and Natural Property (as last amended by Law No. 5835 of >February 4, 2009 and Law No. 5917 of June 25, 2009) > >Here it is in English version: >http://www.wipo.int/wipolex/en/text.jsp?file_id=249359 > >It definitely has no meteorites in the catalogue-articles, where all kind of >object-categories are explicitly named. > >Neither cover the definitions of "cultural property" nor "natural >property", given in Chapter 1, Art. 3a) 1)&2) Meteorites in general, but would >need an interpretation by a court. >E.g. a find of H5 could perhaps not be regarded "unique" (nor being of beauty, >if it's W3, hehe). > >And even if covered, if purchased from a dealer with the right license, they >could be exported like antiquities in such cases too. > >On the other side, rocks are per se not "o.k." see the definition of "natural >property". > > >Best, >Martin > > >-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- >Von: [email protected] >[mailto:[email protected]] Im Auftrag von >Count Deiro >Gesendet: Donnerstag, 18. April 2013 20:31 >An: Anne Black; [email protected] >Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Uh! Oh! > >Dear Anne, > >In reading the story, the two suspected artifacts are described in the body of >the article. > >I have contacted the Turkish Cultural and Economic Affairs office in Los >Angeles, California and His Excellency, Aydın Topcu, Consul General for >Turkey, informs me that the collection of meteorites for removal from Turkey >is forbidden under law and that there is no permit process. > >So "rocks" ok...other things not. > >Cordially, > >Count Deiro >IMCA 3536 > >-----Original Message----- >>From: Anne Black <[email protected]> >>Sent: Apr 18, 2013 11:09 AM >>To: [email protected], [email protected] >>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Uh! Oh! >> >>Sorry, but this does not add up. >>I have been to Turkey twice, beautiful country, very friendly people. >>I have bought minerals, some multi-colored marbles, picked up some >>blue serpentine on the side of the road, and had no problem at all >>bringing them back. >>I also visited many archaeological sites, but I certainly would never >>pick up anything there. >> >>I wonder what his "stones" look like! >> >> >>Anne M. Black >>www.IMPACTIKA.com >>[email protected] >> >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: Count Deiro <[email protected]> >>To: meteorite-list <[email protected]> >>Sent: Thu, Apr 18, 2013 10:48 am >>Subject: [meteorite-list] Uh! Oh! >> >> >>Hello Listees, >> >>Take a look at how Turkey is handling "rock collectors". And this one >>a tourist! >> >> >>http://www.myfoxdc.com/story/22013551/us-tourist-faces-jail-in-turkey- >>f or-collecting-beach-stones#axzz2QpOTN1Sq >> >>"It will never be he same." >> >>Count Deiro >>IMCA 3536 MetSoc >>______________________________________________ >> >>Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com >>Meteorite-list mailing list >>[email protected] >>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> > >______________________________________________ > >Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >[email protected] >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >______________________________________________ > >Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com >Meteorite-list mailing list >[email protected] >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list [email protected] http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
