I checked my TPS and it only shows WOT when I move the throttle to WOT. I even pulled the Thermosensor off the back of the head and checked that.
i am running out of things to check. I am going to pull a DataLog and see what that says. I have been getting this car ready for the Dragon all summer. I really don't want to take my kiddo's car. Eric On Sun, Jul 15, 2012 at 1:10 AM, Ray <[email protected]> wrote: > P.S. If the ECU thinks that the throttle is wide open during cranking > it will kill the fuel. WOT during cranking is the universal > clear-flooded-condition signal for most OEMs. Is your WOT indicator on? > > > > *From:* Ray <[email protected]> > *Sent:* Saturday, July 14, 2012 9:04 PM > *To:* Eric McCord <[email protected]> ; Bill > Cardell<[email protected]> > *Cc:* [email protected] > *Subject:* Re: '91 fires, won't stay on... > > It still sounds like the ECU is doing the initial fuel prime spray > before you start cranking, but nothing (or not enough to fire) after that. > See if you can verify that with a test light. All injectors should do the > same amount of prime and all 4 at the same time. An incandescent test > light doesn’t react fast enough to light up for short injector pulses so > you need an LED type. > > Look at the inj pulse width displayed on the keypad while the engine is > running on spray can fumes. Does the width look like the correct value, or > is it too short? > > *From:* Eric McCord <[email protected]> > *Sent:* Saturday, July 14, 2012 4:24 PM > *To:* Bill Cardell <[email protected]> > *Cc:* Ray <[email protected]> ; [email protected] > *Subject:* Re: '91 fires, won't stay on... > > I honestly can't say, it was my neighbor under the hood. He had to work on > his boat so he just popped over for a min to help. He did have a kit for > checking the injectors but none of the test lights worked. He then put test > light on it. I will try again after work tomorrow when he is around. > > On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 7:12 PM, Bill Cardell <[email protected]> wrote: > >> ** >> How did you put the light on it? You need to put an led type light >> "across" both leads or ground the light and probe the "Not" white/red wire >> while you crank. >> >> >> Bill Cardell >> Owner >> Flyin' Miata >> 1-800-359-6957 (sales) >> 970-464-5600 (tech support) >> www.flyinmiata.com >> www.fmwestfield.com >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> *From:* Eric McCord [mailto:[email protected]] >> *Sent:* Saturday, July 14, 2012 4:47 PM >> >> *To:* Bill Cardell >> *Cc:* Ray; [email protected] >> *Subject:* Re: '91 fires, won't stay on... >> >> we put a test light on one of them and it did not pulse. >> >> On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 6:40 PM, Bill Cardell <[email protected]>wrote: >> >>> ** >>> How about if you put a noid light or led test light across the injector >>> leads while you crank? Should pulse if you're getting a switched injector >>> ground from the ecu. >>> >>> >>> Bill Cardell >>> Owner >>> Flyin' Miata >>> 1-800-359-6957 (sales) >>> 970-464-5600 (tech support) >>> www.flyinmiata.com >>> www.fmwestfield.com >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> *From:* Eric McCord [mailto:[email protected]] >>> *Sent:* Saturday, July 14, 2012 4:08 PM >>> *To:* Bill Cardell >>> *Cc:* Ray; [email protected] >>> >>> *Subject:* Re: '91 fires, won't stay on... >>> >>> yes >>> >>> On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 6:01 PM, Bill Cardell <[email protected]>wrote: >>> >>>> Do you have. 12 volt to the white/red wires going to the injectors? >>>> >>>> Bill Cardell >>>> Owner, Flyin' Miata >>>> Www.flyinmiata.com >>>> 1-800-FLY-MX5s >>>> 970-464-5600 >>>> >>>> >>>> On Jul 14, 2012, at 3:40 PM, "Eric McCord" <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Latest update. If I spray carb cleaner into the intake tract it runs. >>>> I also tried ANOTHER CAS. It dies when the spray is stopped. >>>> >>>> Eric >>>> >>>> On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 5:00 PM, Eric McCord >>>> <[email protected]>wrote: >>>> >>>>> I have both, but the Data Link Lab expired. I used it for another >>>>> issue and then didn't purchase. I have since purchased it but have not >>>>> received my key code yet. >>>>> >>>>> RPM changes on the keypad as well as INJ. I have +12 and ground at the >>>>> MAP box with the key on. >>>>> >>>>> I have also tried it with the F/P to GND in the Diagnostic connector >>>>> which keeps the pump on and I get the same symptoms. >>>>> >>>>> I just swapped out the connector at the CAS because one of the wires >>>>> looked iffy, but no change. >>>>> >>>>> Eric >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Jul 13, 2012 at 8:20 PM, Ray <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Do you have a keypad or datalogger? If so, do all of the sensor >>>>>> readings look normal at key-on before cranking? Do RPM and MAP values >>>>>> change as expected and do the injector pulse width & ign advance look >>>>>> normal during the brief run that you do get? Do you have gnd and +12v >>>>>> power at the MAP box when the key is on? >>>>>> >>>>>> Since the engine fires briefly but doesn’t continue to run even with >>>>>> the fuel pump jumpered to stay on, I’d guess that the plugs are firing, >>>>>> and >>>>>> the initial start is fueled by prime fuel but the ECU thinks that there >>>>>> is >>>>>> high manifold vacuum or high coolant temp and isn’t supplying enough fuel >>>>>> to continue running ... or maybe the fuel map in the ECU got hosed >>>>>> somehow. The FP shutting off when the starter isn’t running says that >>>>>> something is wrong with the MAP box or connections to it. Normally the >>>>>> ECU >>>>>> turns that transistor on in the map box to keep the FP relay energized as >>>>>> soon as it senses RPM > 60. >>>>>> *From:* Eric McCord <[email protected]> >>>>>> *Sent:* Friday, July 13, 2012 11:39 AM >>>>>> *To:* [email protected] >>>>>> *Cc:* [email protected] >>>>>> *Subject:* Re: '91 fires, won't stay on... >>>>>> >>>>>> Swapped out both the ignition switch and CAS. No change. I have >>>>>> only used the Link. I also swapped out the fuel pump before purchasing a >>>>>> fuel pressure guage. I am getting 40 psi at the rail at all times with >>>>>> the >>>>>> key on. It is not looking like it is fuel related. >>>>>> >>>>>> Eric >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Jul 13, 2012 at 2:35 PM, [email protected] < >>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> A long shot here, but it may be that the ignition switch is faulty, >>>>>>> allowing to to start the car and then losing electrical contact, or >>>>>>> perhaps >>>>>>> the current from the ignition to the CAS has been interrupted. WAIT! >>>>>>> You >>>>>>> are using the Link now, but did you EVER use another method of engine >>>>>>> management? Did you use an MSD? I recall long ago having a problem >>>>>>> develop after I upgraded from the Bell Sys II to full FM II spec with >>>>>>> link, >>>>>>> and it turned out that old wiring for the MSD unit had developed a short >>>>>>> (or some problem... was years ago!) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> LGO >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> From: Eric McCord <[email protected]> >>>>>>> To: Mark Phillips <[email protected]> >>>>>>> Cc: miatapower <[email protected]> >>>>>>> Sent: Fri, Jul 13, 2012 11:54 am >>>>>>> Subject: Re: '91 fires, won't stay on... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> No luck. I just replaced that transistor and it is still doing the >>>>>>> same thing. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Eric >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 13, 2012 at 10:41 AM, Eric McCord < >>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I am off to the Shack. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Eric >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 13, 2012 at 10:39 AM, Mark Phillips < >>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Yes. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 07/13/2012 10:28 AM, Eric McCord wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> on yours it was T2? Did you just replace the transistor to get it >>>>>>>>> back up and running? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Eric >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 13, 2012 at 10:25 AM, Mark Phillips < >>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The relay has 12 volts applied to one side of the coil with the >>>>>>>>>> ignition on. When you jump F/P to GND you are taking the other side >>>>>>>>>> of the >>>>>>>>>> relay coil straight to ground bypassing the transistor. Normally the >>>>>>>>>> transistor performs this grounding function (sinking current). T2 >>>>>>>>>> also >>>>>>>>>> interacts with other circuity in the MAF box. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> This happened to me about 4-5 years ago on my '92. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Mark >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 07/13/2012 10:00 AM, Eric McCord wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> When I jump out the F/P to GND the pump stays on but I still have >>>>>>>>>> the same symptoms. If that transistor drives the relay but I jump it >>>>>>>>>> out >>>>>>>>>> should that not run? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Eric >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 13, 2012 at 9:54 AM, Mark Phillips < >>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Hi Eric, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I sent this out earlier but didn't see it repost. I apologize if >>>>>>>>>>> its a repeat. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> There is a transistor in the Link box that replaces the AFM; it >>>>>>>>>>> drives the fuel pump relay. It is an NPN transistor, is marked "T2" >>>>>>>>>>> and may >>>>>>>>>>> have failed. About $1.50 and a soldering iron to replace. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Mark Phillips >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 07/13/2012 09:40 AM, Eric McCord wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I just swapped out the CAS and same symptoms. If it's a bad MAF >>>>>>>>>>> box where can I get one of those? Since my Baja went down the Miata >>>>>>>>>>> has >>>>>>>>>>> been my only transportation and Kaitlyn and I are leaving in a week >>>>>>>>>>> and a >>>>>>>>>>> half for the dragon and our road trip. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Eric >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 13, 2012 at 9:18 AM, Ray <[email protected]>wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Can also be that one of the two signals from the CAS is not >>>>>>>>>>>> there. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> *From:* Eric McCord <[email protected]> >>>>>>>>>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, July 12, 2012 6:21 PM >>>>>>>>>>>> *To:* [email protected] >>>>>>>>>>>> *Cc:* [email protected] >>>>>>>>>>>> *Subject:* Re: '91 fires, won't stay on... >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Just checked that connector. It looked fine, I reseated it >>>>>>>>>>>> and still have the same symptoms. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Eric >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jul 12, 2012 at 9:07 PM, [email protected] < >>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Have you checked the manifold pressure connection (heck! I >>>>>>>>>>>>> think that's what its called - I can't remember!) ? If it comes >>>>>>>>>>>>> loose, it >>>>>>>>>>>>> may begin to fire and then die. On mine its the small box with >>>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>>> AFM-like connector (multi-pin) on the driver's side. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> LGO >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>>> Miatapower mailing list >>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>>>>>>>> http://list.miatapower.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/miatapower >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------ >>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>> Miatapower mailing list >>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>>>>>>> http://list.miatapower.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/miatapower >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> Miatapower mailing >>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]http://list.miatapower.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/miatapower >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> Miatapower mailing list >>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>>>>>> http://list.miatapower.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/miatapower >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Miatapower mailing >>>>>>> [email protected]http://list.miatapower.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/miatapower >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> ------------------------------ >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Miatapower mailing list >>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>> http://list.miatapower.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/miatapower >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Miatapower mailing list >>>> [email protected] >>>> http://list.miatapower.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/miatapower >>>> >>>> >>> >> >> > >
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