damnant quad non intelligunt:(latin)They condemn what they do not understand..dj
On Thu, Jan 7, 2010 at 7:15 PM, <[email protected]<minds-eye%[email protected]> > wrote: > Today's Topic Summary > > Group: http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye/topics > > - Are Muslims Making You > Nervous?<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_group_thread_0>[7 > Updates] > - Can God be mocked? Do blasphemy laws make > sense?<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_group_thread_1>[4 > Updates] > - to maintain educational standards and > interest<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_group_thread_2>[2 > Updates] > - the > naturalists<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_group_thread_3>[1 > Update] > > Topic: Are Muslims Making You > Nervous?<http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye/t/f9226b1784c7fcde> > > Slip Disc <[email protected]> Jan 06 08:50PM -0800 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > *Braying Loudly* > > > > > > Don Johnson <[email protected]> Jan 07 08:41AM -0600 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > > ? I'm slightly confused by this. The word bastard relates to > unmarried > > parents or a heritage otherwise in doubt, at least so far as I've > ever > > seen. Is this a regional use of the word that denigrates blacks? > > Could be a translation thing. It is generally considered insulting to > point out a black person's dilution with white blood. Half breed, > Mulatto, Zebra, 'high yellow' etc. Here in the U.S., it's a reminder > of slave roots and oppression. Possibly an allusion to the rape of > their female ancestors by whites as well. Not cool. > > All the black folks I know are very proud to be black. And > comfortable with the shade of their skin. That said, I will say there > is a definite distinction from African or dark Indian immigrants and > descendants from slaves in America. There seems to be some > condescension towards African-Americans. From what I've observed. > > -Don > > > > > > > fiddler <[email protected]> Jan 07 11:31AM -0800 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > Having a daughter of mixed race, I'm generally pretty cognizant of > racial insults. I see how that might be seen in that light, it is just > generally not used like that in my experience. Bastard is a word that > seems (and in my experience is) far more likely to insult a > "pedigreed" or high-class-wannabe far more than most people. > I guess it goes back to most racial arguments, where people confuse > melanin level with"race." > > > > > > gabbydott <[email protected]> Jan 07 02:39PM -0800 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > I guess we are having it a bit easier over here in Germany. We don't > apply the category race to human beings but to the animal realm. We > mostly distinguish human beings by their ethnicity or nationality. > > > > > > Slip Disc <[email protected]> Jan 07 02:56PM -0800 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > *Hee Haw Hee Haw* snort snort *Braying* > > > > > > archytas <[email protected]> Jan 07 06:51PM -0800 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > Mannered societies are violent Justin and manners themselves can be > very nasty - think of the brutalities that must be suffered to fit in, > whether with a street gang or debutante's 'coming out'. Norbert Elias > made a sociology of this long ago. The thinking here is more complex > - more like what you have to say on Wootten Bassett > - and I thoroughly agree with that. The Muslim proposing the march is > subject to character assassination in our press as a benefit scrounger > (getting more from benefits than some troops), vile and so on. Slip's > original question is still open on whether we have something to fear > from this cleric, but any demonstration which brought out your points > would only be welcome. They are sadly missing in our public debate, > which looks like a particularly bad version of some of the bunk > projections aimed at Slip. > The manners I have in mind are those that always prevent us being to > see all the elements of debate. I sense you have quite a lot wrong in > your post, but can still see lot worthy in it. You are right on > Wootten Bassett, yet would probably be beaten to death by either > faction there! > > So certain it ain't from 'out there' Orn? I'm not. I'd ask if it was > an idol of the tribe or cave. And that we might still hold what's > wrong without a decision of this. No one tell Gabby that the guy did > the stabbing to get jail time for some peace and security. > > > > > > > Don Johnson <[email protected]> Jan 07 08:52PM -0600 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > > *Hee Haw Hee Haw* snort snort *Braying* > > > > http://www.dailyfinance.com/story/company-news/german-lingerie-ad-lifts-the-veil-of-muslim-women/19306843/?icid=main|hp-laptop|dl3|link3|http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dailyfinance.com%2Fstory%2Fcompany-news%2Fgerman-lingerie-ad-lifts-the-veil-of-muslim-women%2F19306843%2F<http://www.dailyfinance.com/story/company-news/german-lingerie-ad-lifts-the-veil-of-muslim-women/19306843/?icid=main%7Chp-laptop%7Cdl3%7Clink3%7Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.dailyfinance.com%2Fstory%2Fcompany-news%2Fgerman-lingerie-ad-lifts-the-veil-of-muslim-women%2F19306843%2F> > > That's what I did when I saw this add. However, I think I would know > if a women was wearing high heels regardless of how covered up her > feet were. The clickity clack is a dead give away. Also, what would > be the point in the sexy clothes if they're all covered up? I thought > the whole idea was to show off. I find it difficult to believe all > that primping and cruel shoes and strings in uncomfortable places is > done just to cover it all up. Fashion is about letting it all hang > out. I thought. > > -Don > > > > > Topic: Can God be mocked? Do blasphemy laws make > sense?<http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye/t/d9f9cd4326caa7c9> > > [email protected] Jan 06 11:10PM -0500 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > You Mr. Fiddler are perfectly correct. The core term in this discussion > about God and dissent is in asking and answering the question: who is the > final authority in one's life. To me this is a no brainer but a difficult > one to accept. Each of us is our own final authority whether we like it or > not. Since every experience necessarily involves an interpretation > (conscious and unconscious meanings assigned to whatever we select as > something to register - including the concept and perhaps experience of > GOD- > we are - if we think God is supreme - still assigning our final authority > to > the supreme Being. In so doing we are make a choice to project our final > authority to him, her, or it. So be it... but it is still a choice no > matter > how much it will be argued that it is the way it is. > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fiddler <[email protected]> > To: "Minds Eye" <[email protected]> > Sent: Mon, Jan 4, 2010 10:48 pm > Subject: [Mind's Eye] Re: Can God be mocked? Do blasphemy laws make > sense? > > > Why should any person worship a god that: > 1) ...cannot take any form of criticism? This does not matter whether > or not it is a "god" that cannot take the criticism or "just" it's > followers. If a person speaks for god, the god spoke(presumably a god > can stop someone if they misrepresent that god). > 2) ...has a holy book condemning blasphemers to death or worse? Same > criticism as above if slightly modified. Please see what the > punishment for apostasy is in islam for an all too contemporary > explanation. > 3) ...forbids humans to do exactly what humans were made to do? > Blasphemy is often raised here but so is sex, murder/war, and > scientific thought. This may seem loose but, too many of both > christian and muslim fundamentalist groups act as if "god said so" is > an answer to anything and everything. We are genetically driven to > explore, define, explain, think, redefine, travel, and otherwise push > the envelope of reality. Why would any god with the power to grant > this, then decide that we are not allowed to on pain of death and > damnation? > > More if you'd like, but my views on religion and it's terrible > repercussions is not hidden. The sad and basic truth is this: religion > detests those that argue it simply because there is no corresponding > argument FOR it. Unless of course, one simply keeps saying "but those > aren't true (insert deity fan club) morals." Unfortunately, the same > ones that claim the "no true scotsman" fallacy, then try the "ad > populum" fallacy and say 1.6 billion can't be wrong. > > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > ""Minds Eye"" group. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > [email protected]<minds-eye%[email protected]> > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en. > > > > > [email protected] Jan 06 11:20PM -0500 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > Mock spelled backwards is kcom. > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: ornamentalmind <[email protected]> > To: "Minds Eye" <[email protected]> > Sent: Wed, Jan 6, 2010 5:51 pm > Subject: [Mind's Eye] Re: Can God be mocked? Do blasphemy laws make > sense? > > > “…We can only degrade ourselves by swearing and mocking God, because > in one way or another that degradation will come back to us….” – MFTE > > While I don’t necessarily disagree with you, would you like to unpack > how this comes back to us?...what mechanism is in place etc.? > > > On Jan 6, 1:28 pm, Manfraco Frank the Elder <[email protected]> > wrote: > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > ""Minds Eye"" group. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > [email protected]<minds-eye%[email protected]> > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en. > > > > > iam deheretic <[email protected]> Jan 07 12:11PM +0100 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > HMMM > > > > Mock spelled backwards is kcom. > > > Just what is kcom? > Allan > > > > -- > ( > ) > I_D Allan > > > > > Manfraco Frank the Elder <[email protected]> Jan 07 02:07PM -0800 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > The mechanism is there all the time if you look for it. Look, how many > friends you make while you are swearing? Or even afterwards when you > calm down? > I am sure nobody in their right mind look to you for inspiration? They > all will try to avoid you for a while. This is the mechanism in which > God in conjunction with Mother Nature abound. > Then there is also to keep in mind the spiritual side of all this, if > there is an afterlife and we are punished for our sins; what is the > advantage to mock God by swearing at him? > > > > > Topic: to maintain educational standards and > interest<http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye/t/3a64ae6f690645c7> > > Lee <[email protected]> Jan 07 04:19AM -0800 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > Hey Fiddler, > > Yes I guess you did not use those exact words, I was as I said > paraphrasing. You did say this though. > > 'Whenever I see a perfectly good mind wasted on religion, I feel a > deep and abiding sadness. These people voluntarily surrender their > intellectual capacity' > > Words and language as we know are a strange beast. Within the English > language it is possible to say much in many ways. Now I must ask what > sort of people would 'voluntarily surrender their intellectual > capacity'? Well only an idiot would do that surly? Hence you sir, > even though you now claim this is valid for 90% of religious people, > certianly did suggest that all religious people are idiots. > > Of course you may not have intended it to look like it, and the fault > may all be mine, however I can only go on the words which you choose > to use to interpret your meaning. > > Control of people, I'm not even sure that this is possible, without > some form or physicality happening. Are rewards and threats really > control? If for example some bloke slapped your partner whilst you > were all haveing a quiet drink in the pub. Knowing that assault is > agianst the law does the threat of arrest and maybe imprisionment help > you to control your actions, or are you likely to go and grab the > bloke anyway? > > I won't deny that violence has been used in regards to religon, yet > one of the points I am trying to make here is that religion is not the > sole divisive idea that has lead to violence. Why then choose to > highlight only religion? I'm guessing because you have a deep dislike > for it. > > This is just plainly incorrect: > > '...every religion that entered the world stage did so by force and > murder, bar none' > > What like the Jains, and the Sikhs and the Bhudists? To name just > three. > > > > > > > > ornamentalmind <[email protected]> Jan 07 09:38AM -0800 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > Butting in where I most likely shouldn’t, when it comes to ‘control’, > a strange notion indeed, in almost every way we all are ‘controlled’ > daily. I say this based on the notion of manufacturing consent which > is used through every outlet from word of mouth to the media in > general. Further, IF advertising wasn’t extremely effective, it > wouldn’t be a trillion dollar industry. I have great doubts that we > know of most of the ways we are ‘controlled’ at almost every turn. > And, I say this even though I'm sure most would protest the idea. > > > > > Topic: the > naturalists<http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye/t/b598cb90f0ce0090> > > [email protected] Jan 06 11:04PM -0500 > ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> > > The natural is a super place to be? > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Lee <[email protected]> > To: "Minds Eye" <[email protected]> > Sent: Mon, Jan 4, 2010 8:37 am > Subject: [Mind's Eye] Re: the naturalists > > > Hey hey Pat! > > Supernatural huh. > > Okay try this one. > > In the natural world a man dies, 3 months latter his wife starts to > see him in the house they owned and she still lives in. Ghost! > Ohhhher! > > It's all going to get down to semantic wordplay-eer-isim agian isn't > it? > > What do we mean by Supernatural? > > Personaly I would say that all things are perfectly natureal, even > those things we term supernatureal. > > > On 1 Jan, 00:46, Alan Wostenberg <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > On Dec 29, 6:04 am, Pat <[email protected]> wrote:> On > 26 Dec, > 18:08, Alan Wostenberg <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > naturalists, chemists slightly more frequently, biologists > more, and > > > > > then when you get into the social sciences and philosophy, > naturalism > > > > > and even anti-religious sentiments often play a large > role."http://bedejournal.blogspot.com/2009/12/naturalists.html > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > ""Minds Eye"" group. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > [email protected]<minds-eye%[email protected]> > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en. > > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > ""Minds Eye"" group. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > [email protected]<minds-eye%[email protected]> > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en. > >--
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