Corsilio et prudentia:(Latin) By wisdom and prudence.... On Thu, Jan 7, 2010 at 9:59 PM, dj Briscoe <[email protected]>wrote:
> damnant quad non intelligunt:(latin)They condemn what they do not > understand..dj > > > > > On Thu, Jan 7, 2010 at 7:15 PM, > <[email protected]<minds-eye%[email protected]> > > wrote: > >> Today's Topic Summary >> >> Group: http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye/topics >> >> - Are Muslims Making You >> Nervous?<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_group_thread_0>[7 >> Updates] >> - Can God be mocked? Do blasphemy laws make >> sense?<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_group_thread_1>[4 >> Updates] >> - to maintain educational standards and >> interest<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_group_thread_2>[2 >> Updates] >> - the >> naturalists<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_group_thread_3>[1 >> Update] >> >> Topic: Are Muslims Making You >> Nervous?<http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye/t/f9226b1784c7fcde> >> >> Slip Disc <[email protected]> Jan 06 08:50PM -0800 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> *Braying Loudly* >> >> >> >> >> >> Don Johnson <[email protected]> Jan 07 08:41AM -0600 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> > ? I'm slightly confused by this. The word bastard relates to >> unmarried >> > parents or a heritage otherwise in doubt, at least so far as I've >> ever >> > seen. Is this a regional use of the word that denigrates blacks? >> >> Could be a translation thing. It is generally considered insulting to >> point out a black person's dilution with white blood. Half breed, >> Mulatto, Zebra, 'high yellow' etc. Here in the U.S., it's a reminder >> of slave roots and oppression. Possibly an allusion to the rape of >> their female ancestors by whites as well. Not cool. >> >> All the black folks I know are very proud to be black. And >> comfortable with the shade of their skin. That said, I will say there >> is a definite distinction from African or dark Indian immigrants and >> descendants from slaves in America. There seems to be some >> condescension towards African-Americans. From what I've observed. >> >> -Don >> >> >> >> >> >> >> fiddler <[email protected]> Jan 07 11:31AM -0800 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> Having a daughter of mixed race, I'm generally pretty cognizant of >> racial insults. I see how that might be seen in that light, it is just >> generally not used like that in my experience. Bastard is a word that >> seems (and in my experience is) far more likely to insult a >> "pedigreed" or high-class-wannabe far more than most people. >> I guess it goes back to most racial arguments, where people confuse >> melanin level with"race." >> >> >> >> >> >> gabbydott <[email protected]> Jan 07 02:39PM -0800 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> I guess we are having it a bit easier over here in Germany. We don't >> apply the category race to human beings but to the animal realm. We >> mostly distinguish human beings by their ethnicity or nationality. >> >> >> >> >> >> Slip Disc <[email protected]> Jan 07 02:56PM -0800 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> *Hee Haw Hee Haw* snort snort *Braying* >> >> >> >> >> >> archytas <[email protected]> Jan 07 06:51PM -0800 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> Mannered societies are violent Justin and manners themselves can be >> very nasty - think of the brutalities that must be suffered to fit in, >> whether with a street gang or debutante's 'coming out'. Norbert Elias >> made a sociology of this long ago. The thinking here is more complex >> - more like what you have to say on Wootten Bassett >> - and I thoroughly agree with that. The Muslim proposing the march is >> subject to character assassination in our press as a benefit scrounger >> (getting more from benefits than some troops), vile and so on. Slip's >> original question is still open on whether we have something to fear >> from this cleric, but any demonstration which brought out your points >> would only be welcome. They are sadly missing in our public debate, >> which looks like a particularly bad version of some of the bunk >> projections aimed at Slip. >> The manners I have in mind are those that always prevent us being to >> see all the elements of debate. I sense you have quite a lot wrong in >> your post, but can still see lot worthy in it. You are right on >> Wootten Bassett, yet would probably be beaten to death by either >> faction there! >> >> So certain it ain't from 'out there' Orn? I'm not. I'd ask if it was >> an idol of the tribe or cave. And that we might still hold what's >> wrong without a decision of this. No one tell Gabby that the guy did >> the stabbing to get jail time for some peace and security. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Don Johnson <[email protected]> Jan 07 08:52PM -0600 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> > *Hee Haw Hee Haw* snort snort *Braying* >> >> >> >> http://www.dailyfinance.com/story/company-news/german-lingerie-ad-lifts-the-veil-of-muslim-women/19306843/?icid=main|hp-laptop|dl3|link3|http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dailyfinance.com%2Fstory%2Fcompany-news%2Fgerman-lingerie-ad-lifts-the-veil-of-muslim-women%2F19306843%2F<http://www.dailyfinance.com/story/company-news/german-lingerie-ad-lifts-the-veil-of-muslim-women/19306843/?icid=main%7Chp-laptop%7Cdl3%7Clink3%7Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.dailyfinance.com%2Fstory%2Fcompany-news%2Fgerman-lingerie-ad-lifts-the-veil-of-muslim-women%2F19306843%2F> >> >> That's what I did when I saw this add. However, I think I would know >> if a women was wearing high heels regardless of how covered up her >> feet were. The clickity clack is a dead give away. Also, what would >> be the point in the sexy clothes if they're all covered up? I thought >> the whole idea was to show off. I find it difficult to believe all >> that primping and cruel shoes and strings in uncomfortable places is >> done just to cover it all up. Fashion is about letting it all hang >> out. I thought. >> >> -Don >> >> >> >> >> Topic: Can God be mocked? Do blasphemy laws make >> sense?<http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye/t/d9f9cd4326caa7c9> >> >> [email protected] Jan 06 11:10PM -0500 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> You Mr. Fiddler are perfectly correct. The core term in this >> discussion about God and dissent is in asking and answering the question: >> who is the final authority in one's life. To me this is a no brainer but a >> difficult one to accept. Each of us is our own final authority whether we >> like it or not. Since every experience necessarily involves an >> interpretation (conscious and unconscious meanings assigned to whatever we >> select as something to register - including the concept and perhaps >> experience of GOD- we are - if we think God is supreme - still assigning >> our >> final authority to the supreme Being. In so doing we are make a choice to >> project our final authority to him, her, or it. So be it... but it is >> still >> a choice no matter how much it will be argued that it is the way it is. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fiddler <[email protected]> >> To: "Minds Eye" <[email protected]> >> Sent: Mon, Jan 4, 2010 10:48 pm >> Subject: [Mind's Eye] Re: Can God be mocked? Do blasphemy laws make >> sense? >> >> >> Why should any person worship a god that: >> 1) ...cannot take any form of criticism? This does not matter whether >> or not it is a "god" that cannot take the criticism or "just" it's >> followers. If a person speaks for god, the god spoke(presumably a god >> can stop someone if they misrepresent that god). >> 2) ...has a holy book condemning blasphemers to death or worse? Same >> criticism as above if slightly modified. Please see what the >> punishment for apostasy is in islam for an all too contemporary >> explanation. >> 3) ...forbids humans to do exactly what humans were made to do? >> Blasphemy is often raised here but so is sex, murder/war, and >> scientific thought. This may seem loose but, too many of both >> christian and muslim fundamentalist groups act as if "god said so" is >> an answer to anything and everything. We are genetically driven to >> explore, define, explain, think, redefine, travel, and otherwise push >> the envelope of reality. Why would any god with the power to grant >> this, then decide that we are not allowed to on pain of death and >> damnation? >> >> More if you'd like, but my views on religion and it's terrible >> repercussions is not hidden. The sad and basic truth is this: religion >> detests those that argue it simply because there is no corresponding >> argument FOR it. Unless of course, one simply keeps saying "but those >> aren't true (insert deity fan club) morals." Unfortunately, the same >> ones that claim the "no true scotsman" fallacy, then try the "ad >> populum" fallacy and say 1.6 billion can't be wrong. >> >> >> >> -- >> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups >> ""Minds Eye"" group. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> >> [email protected]<minds-eye%[email protected]> >> . >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en. >> >> >> >> >> [email protected] Jan 06 11:20PM -0500 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> Mock spelled backwards is kcom. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: ornamentalmind <[email protected]> >> To: "Minds Eye" <[email protected]> >> Sent: Wed, Jan 6, 2010 5:51 pm >> Subject: [Mind's Eye] Re: Can God be mocked? Do blasphemy laws make >> sense? >> >> >> “…We can only degrade ourselves by swearing and mocking God, because >> in one way or another that degradation will come back to us….” – MFTE >> >> While I don’t necessarily disagree with you, would you like to unpack >> how this comes back to us?...what mechanism is in place etc.? >> >> >> On Jan 6, 1:28 pm, Manfraco Frank the Elder <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups >> ""Minds Eye"" group. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> >> [email protected]<minds-eye%[email protected]> >> . >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en. >> >> >> >> >> iam deheretic <[email protected]> Jan 07 12:11PM +0100 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> HMMM >> >> >> > Mock spelled backwards is kcom. >> >> > Just what is kcom? >> Allan >> >> >> >> -- >> ( >> ) >> I_D Allan >> >> >> >> >> Manfraco Frank the Elder <[email protected]> Jan 07 02:07PM -0800 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> The mechanism is there all the time if you look for it. Look, how many >> friends you make while you are swearing? Or even afterwards when you >> calm down? >> I am sure nobody in their right mind look to you for inspiration? They >> all will try to avoid you for a while. This is the mechanism in which >> God in conjunction with Mother Nature abound. >> Then there is also to keep in mind the spiritual side of all this, if >> there is an afterlife and we are punished for our sins; what is the >> advantage to mock God by swearing at him? >> >> >> >> >> Topic: to maintain educational standards and >> interest<http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye/t/3a64ae6f690645c7> >> >> Lee <[email protected]> Jan 07 04:19AM -0800 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> Hey Fiddler, >> >> Yes I guess you did not use those exact words, I was as I said >> paraphrasing. You did say this though. >> >> 'Whenever I see a perfectly good mind wasted on religion, I feel a >> deep and abiding sadness. These people voluntarily surrender their >> intellectual capacity' >> >> Words and language as we know are a strange beast. Within the English >> language it is possible to say much in many ways. Now I must ask what >> sort of people would 'voluntarily surrender their intellectual >> capacity'? Well only an idiot would do that surly? Hence you sir, >> even though you now claim this is valid for 90% of religious people, >> certianly did suggest that all religious people are idiots. >> >> Of course you may not have intended it to look like it, and the fault >> may all be mine, however I can only go on the words which you choose >> to use to interpret your meaning. >> >> Control of people, I'm not even sure that this is possible, without >> some form or physicality happening. Are rewards and threats really >> control? If for example some bloke slapped your partner whilst you >> were all haveing a quiet drink in the pub. Knowing that assault is >> agianst the law does the threat of arrest and maybe imprisionment help >> you to control your actions, or are you likely to go and grab the >> bloke anyway? >> >> I won't deny that violence has been used in regards to religon, yet >> one of the points I am trying to make here is that religion is not the >> sole divisive idea that has lead to violence. Why then choose to >> highlight only religion? I'm guessing because you have a deep dislike >> for it. >> >> This is just plainly incorrect: >> >> '...every religion that entered the world stage did so by force and >> murder, bar none' >> >> What like the Jains, and the Sikhs and the Bhudists? To name just >> three. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ornamentalmind <[email protected]> Jan 07 09:38AM -0800 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> Butting in where I most likely shouldn’t, when it comes to ‘control’, >> a strange notion indeed, in almost every way we all are ‘controlled’ >> daily. I say this based on the notion of manufacturing consent which >> is used through every outlet from word of mouth to the media in >> general. Further, IF advertising wasn’t extremely effective, it >> wouldn’t be a trillion dollar industry. I have great doubts that we >> know of most of the ways we are ‘controlled’ at almost every turn. >> And, I say this even though I'm sure most would protest the idea. >> >> >> >> >> Topic: the >> naturalists<http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye/t/b598cb90f0ce0090> >> >> [email protected] Jan 06 11:04PM -0500 >> ^<https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&view=js&name=js&ver=qEnx5VtnzxI.en.&am=!5GA6FQbNn1G5A3Gi0fgEIi0UI4emjRbZuunEo0dYu0a43Q#1260bee2e9fef098_digest_top> >> >> The natural is a super place to be? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Lee <[email protected]> >> To: "Minds Eye" <[email protected]> >> Sent: Mon, Jan 4, 2010 8:37 am >> Subject: [Mind's Eye] Re: the naturalists >> >> >> Hey hey Pat! >> >> Supernatural huh. >> >> Okay try this one. >> >> In the natural world a man dies, 3 months latter his wife starts to >> see him in the house they owned and she still lives in. Ghost! >> Ohhhher! >> >> It's all going to get down to semantic wordplay-eer-isim agian isn't >> it? >> >> What do we mean by Supernatural? >> >> Personaly I would say that all things are perfectly natureal, even >> those things we term supernatureal. >> >> > On 1 Jan, 00:46, Alan Wostenberg <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > > On Dec 29, 6:04 am, Pat <[email protected]> wrote:> >> On 26 Dec, >> 18:08, Alan Wostenberg <[email protected]> wrote: >> > > > > naturalists, chemists slightly more frequently, biologists >> more, and >> > > > > then when you get into the social sciences and philosophy, >> naturalism >> > > > > and even anti-religious sentiments often play a large >> role."http://bedejournal.blogspot.com/2009/12/naturalists.html >> >> -- >> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups >> ""Minds Eye"" group. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> >> [email protected]<minds-eye%[email protected]> >> . >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en. >> >> >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> ""Minds Eye"" group. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> [email protected]<minds-eye%[email protected]> >> . >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en. >> >> >--
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