Pat, cut out this know - all attitude. It's not worth a fig ! Just state what you know, in few lines.
I have no need of your kindness or its contrary from you. Just spell it out, in simple terms we all here can understand. If you are ashamed to admit that you do not know, let me assure you that is no crime ! And we all know the substance of experiences most charlatans bandy about ! The world would be better without them and their delusions. To get back to the core : Spell it or shut up, Pat ! On May 25, 9:27 pm, Pat <[email protected]> wrote: > On 25 May, 15:14, vamadevananda <[email protected]> wrote: > > > What do you know of the next life, Pat ? > > Plenty. But you would probably disagree. > > > If you do, please spell it out now. If you do not, it would be only > > fair on your part to spare the rational minds who congregate here of > > such obscure notions ! > > There isn't enough time to 'spell it out'. It would take many long > discourses and, of course, you'll view that as 'an excuse', but it is > the truth. There are many details that your rational mind (more > likely, your preconceived notions) may take issue with; however, that > would be the problem of your rational mind and not of my knowledge. > I've had several experiences that have given me some keen insights > into what CAN happen in the next life. If you're asking me, > specifically, as to what will happen to you, then, I would be > prohibited from stating such details, even if I were informed OF those > specifics. Nevertheless, they ARE fixed and you can do nothing to > change them. Although, my kinder side will allow me to say that you > won't have many worries. ;-) > > > > > On May 25, 5:25 pm, Pat <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > On 24 May, 21:00, gabbydott <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > Again, just out of curiosity, have you ever tried to see your off- > > > > spring as your next life, Patty? > > > > In the sense that they represent a certain aspect of 'immortality', of > > > course. But they WILL die some day, and, as we are all still alive, > > > they cannot be my 'next' life, rather, they are a vital part of this > > > life. For all I know, in the next, we may never know one another. > > > Then again, we may spend all of eternity together. The next life is > > > not to be confused with any part of this life and progeny are a vital > > > part of THIS life. > > > > > On 24 Mai, 18:22, Pat <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > On 24 May, 14:16, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > "the difference isn't in THIS life, but the next" - the next life, > > > > > > yes, but also in this - less anger and fear, more peace and > > > > > > compassion... > > > > > > True. One need only fear God in this life FOR the next. There is no > > > > > need to fear 'creatures' in this life, as they will only harm you if > > > > > The Creator has already dictated that. And if He has, then there is > > > > > no avoiding it, if He has not, then there is no way to bring on that > > > > > harm. Therefore, only fear The Creator and never fear ANY creatures. > > > > > > > " Proof isn't available, except > > > > > > to those who can reckon it." - yes, yes - and I would go further to > > > > > > say, the proof is in the living of it! > > > > > > I.e., the proof is in "the putting" rather than "the pudding". For > > > > > those who reckon it, their life is the putting forward of the proof, > > > > > yes. > > > > > > > On May 24, 7:28 am, Pat <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > On 21 May, 22:31, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Pat, we've been on this roller coaster too many times. Can you > > > > > > > > see > > > > > > > > what you are saying? > > > > > > > > > The "One" - "True" God told a man................ Well who is > > > > > > > > verifying this information of a true god speaking to a man? > > > > > > > > It's > > > > > > > > absurd, which is why you follow with........."Now, Imagine for a > > > > > > > > moment.........."........Well hell Pat I could Imagine that a > > > > > > > > one true > > > > > > > > god spoke to my dog and told him to chase a kill > > > > > > > > squirrels..........We > > > > > > > > could imagine anything. > > > > > > > > The verification is IN the Qur'an. I made the statements the way > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > did because I knew that you wouldn't accept it any other way. The > > > > > > > fact that I can't even couch my statements in an acceptable way is > > > > > > > proof that the Qur'an is true...if you but read it and understood > > > > > > > it. ;-) > > > > > > > > > Then you say.."If you accept the premise............." > > > > > > > > > I don't accept the premise of any religion, I find all of it > > > > > > > > sometimes > > > > > > > > amusing but mostly annoying. I don't care about the Quran, the > > > > > > > > Bible > > > > > > > > or the deep sea scrolls, I've checked it all out and regardless > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > what ancient man conjured up or whatever was discovered at Nag > > > > > > > > Hammadi > > > > > > > > and elsewhere, I find the whole nuisance of it an infringement > > > > > > > > upon my > > > > > > > > right to just live and have a happy existence; fact is I'm happy > > > > > > > > without it. > > > > > > > > Yup, well, best of luck! > > > > > > > > > The Hindus, Buddhists, Christians, Muslims and the rest of the > > > > > > > > loonies > > > > > > > > can go peddle their wares somewhere else. I don't see any need > > > > > > > > to be > > > > > > > > concerned about any "One True God". > > > > > > > > Unless, of course, He exists. In which case, you will. > > > > > > > > > I've been living for 60 years without one and anytime I've ever > > > > > > > > entertained the idea it was more trouble than it's worth. > > > > > > > > Religious > > > > > > > > people and Atheists are all living the same, and all dying the > > > > > > > > same, > > > > > > > > and all suffering from old age and disease. If religion was > > > > > > > > worth the > > > > > > > > paper it was written on then those that were worshiping the one > > > > > > > > true > > > > > > > > god would be much better off than everyone else but because it > > > > > > > > is all > > > > > > > > a figment of man's imagination there exists no "One True > > > > > > > > Difference". > > > > > > > > The difference isn't in THIS life, but the next. This is a > > > > > > > testing > > > > > > > ground and the rewards you reap HERE may actually stand against > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > later. Equal and opposite reaction, you know. If a wealthy man > > > > > > > spends all his money on himself, he gains nothing here or in the > > > > > > > next > > > > > > > life, but, if he uses it to help those in need, he loses wealth in > > > > > > > this life and gains paradise eternally. Which is better: a good > > > > > > > temporary 70 years or a good eternity? Proof isn't available, > > > > > > > except > > > > > > > to those who can reckon it. > > > > > > > > > On May 21, 11:19 am, Pat <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > On 21 May, 16:22, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I had no doubt that we would differ, Pat. What you say > > > > > > > > > > still evokes > > > > > > > > > > the question of a consciousness with intent. To say what > > > > > > > > > > IS just IS > > > > > > > > > > can be viewed as a truth, like the big boulder outside my > > > > > > > > > > window. You > > > > > > > > > > have created the box by imposing a set of inferences. When > > > > > > > > > > looking at > > > > > > > > > > the whole there doesn't have to be a box, which essentially > > > > > > > > > > is a human > > > > > > > > > > construct stemming from the need to address the unknown. > > > > > > > > > > We deal with physical science, the proof of things, a sort > > > > > > > > > > of macro- > > > > > > > > > > religion which defines everything in terms of what we see > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > experience with our physical senses while the natural world > > > > > > > > > > leaves > > > > > > > > > > open ended areas which we have no answers for. This is the > > > > > > > > > > point at > > > > > > > > > > which the constructs begin to take form because there is no > > > > > > > > > > proof > > > > > > > > > > otherwise, eg; the Gallileo experience. Without > > > > > > > > > > scientific proof > > > > > > > > > > anyone can say anything, purport truth from dust and create > > > > > > > > > > "Myth". > > > > > > > > > > Storms, lightning and thunder are no longer angry gods and > > > > > > > > > > sacrificial > > > > > > > > > > human lambs are no longer necessary but for some reason we > > > > > > > > > > have yet to > > > > > > > > > > let go of the main theme of religious belief. > > > > > > > > > > Religion's foundation is completely based on explanation of > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > unknown and the unseen, the perceptions of good and evil > > > > > > > > > > and the need > > > > > > > > > > to explore afterlife. These perceptions/constructs lead to > > > > > > > > > > a oneness, > > > > > > > > > > a central being, a deity and in some cultures a > > > > > > > > > > multiplicity, a > > > > > > > > > > composite of deities assigned to elements of the universe > > > > > > > > > > such as the > > > > > > > > > > ocean and the sun. Tack on the egocentric nature of > > > > > > > > > > humanity and what > > > > > > > > > > you get is man's idea that he is an appendage of the > > > > > > > > > > oneness, an > > > > > > > > > > extension of the almighty. Now we have gods with an uncanny > > > > > > > > > > resemblance to humans; why am I not surprised. Religions > > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > worshiping "Humanity". Jesus = the only begotten son of > > > > > > > > > > god. Why? > > > > > > > > > > We are the children of god. Really? Say's who? This > > > > > > > > > > tendency is > > > > > > > > > > unrealistic for me and no one has ever throughout history > > > > > > > > > > shown in > > > > > > > > > > anyway a proof concerning religious dogma. It all remains > > > > > > > > > > to this day > > > > > > > > > > simple "Myths" from which to launch holy wars, commit > > > > > > > > > > unspeakable > > > > > > > > > > atrocities, build huge organizations that collect tithing > > > > > > > > > > and instill > > > > > > > > > > guilt and fear for living a natural and normal life. > > > > > > > > > > Not exactly the Islamic viewpoint, there, Slip. Their view > > > > > > > > > is that > > > > > > > > > the One True God actually told a man (the Prophet > > > > > > > > > Muhammed[pbuh]) what > > > > > > > > > He did with respect to creation and many other issues > > > > > > > > > regarding 'the > > > > > > > > > unseen' ('al-ghraib' in Arabic). Now, imagine, for a moment, > > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > > THAT is exactly what happened; that God really did > > > > > > > > > communicate to man > > > > > > > > > what He did. If you accept the premiss, then what the > > > > > > > > > message says > > > > > > > > > (if you read the Qur'an) is very much what one would expect > > > > > > > > > to hear > > > > > > > > > from such an entity. BTW, in Islam, there is no such thing > > > > > > > > > as a 'holy > > > > > > > > > war'; rather, there are just wars and unjust wars; but NO war > > > > > > > > > is ever > > > > > > > > > 'holy'. The concept of 'Holy War' was a Christian invention > > > > > > > > > from the > > > > > > > > > Crusades and, of course, the Christians lost most > > ... > > read more »
