Lovely Molly - though this defence doesn't seem available to those accused of speech crimes these days. Of course, responding with hatred to idiots who do mean such rot, trying to include all men and such doesn't help. Gender is non-existent in some species. Personally, I don't think this material is evidence of anything much. The spring to rationalisation is partly provoked in defence of a greater ideal, but sadly becomes just rhetorical, denying mutual understanding or reciprocity - and, of course, much of the evidence (such as Semite-origin religions having been and persisting with sexism). Moving goalposts works until you turn up to play on Saturday. In argument it works until you find other arguments using the same tactics on really important issues and can enter self-awareness on one's lack of reflexivity. Not taking things literally (my guess from wider evidence is they were meant that way) and then coming up with a convenient definition of a distinctly fictional soul-concept is genius (how do we take this.literally or not)? But it's only genius to those who know little about argument, rhetorical tricks and lack an understanding of empirical adequacy and evidence (both really complex). The problem with this form of 'argument' is not in religion per se, but its spread into politics where it is fascist in Orwell's sense of Newspeak, Doublespeak and rationalisation of evil and stupidity. You wouldn't let me get away with this language (and I wouldn't want you to) - so why give these likely much nastier guys such a break?
On Tuesday, February 3, 2015 at 11:56:06 AM UTC, Molly wrote: > > I've learned to not take these literally, but as a diagram for internal > life as in the mystical tradition. We all have a male and female aspect, > and like all other aspects of being, they integrate before we realize the > heaven withing. Likewise with the bit on the soul. Like our finite heart > and brain organs, the soul is an organ of our infinite selves, and not the > whole shebang. > > On Tuesday, February 3, 2015 at 1:28:20 AM UTC-5, archytas wrote: >> >> Took me a while to find it, but I recommend these lines reported by >> Thomas: >> >> 114. Simon Peter said to them, "Make Mary leave us, for females don't >> deserve life." >> >> Jesus said, "Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may >> become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes >> herself male will enter the kingdom of Heaven." >> >> I'd be lynched in one of my own classes if I said this. >> >> And Allan's a bit out in the cold on this one: >> >> 112. Jesus said, "Damn the flesh that depends on the soul. Damn the soul >> that depends on the flesh." >> >> You just have to love it. An all male heaven, except for those who sneak >> in after an operation in 'Brazil'. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. >> >> No one shoot the messenger on the above, please. >> >> >> >> On Monday, February 2, 2015 at 9:47:21 PM UTC, Allan Heretic wrote: >>> >>> I am a fan of doubting Thomas too.. cool dude he went into Egypt and >>> India. You can read his teachings in the Gospel of Thomas.. Coptic >>> teachings from what I understand.. someone wrote down what he said and >>> taught. >>> It is very interesting as they are the only writing directly attributed >>> to sn actual apostle of Jesus.. saul of tarsus commonly know as paul never >>> even met Jesus. . Peter and the other actual apostles didn't care much for >>> him from what I understand.. >>> The Christian gospels the earliest some 60 years after Jesus's death >>> there are a lot of historical record problems. . Like paul's miracle cure >>> from a poisonous snake bite.. archological record indicate there are no >>> poisonous snakes inhabiting Malta.. . Leaves doubt. A lot of conclusion >>> jumping. Old testement and moses.. love it archeology is showing the >>> pyramids were built by labour unions. . Definitely not slaves >>> So what it comes download to is truth and what is fable.. easy to >>> justify what you find of value the rest throw in storage it may make sense >>> later.. >>> I am lucky as i have no problems with the existence of God due to >>> psychotic episodes i choose to call spiritual experience(s)..l am a great >>> believer in sharing as everyone ones has a gift(s) to contribute. >>> >>> As for education IQ test have some good qualities but they only show >>> part of the truth. As for education. My Dad did his doctorate in education. >>> .. as my dad associate professor at the time all the professor brats were >>> subjected doctoral research testing.. amazing what kids can learn.. lol >>> poor teachers. What we learned you do not teach teenagers. . >>> >>> Society has its problems lack of internal guidance is a major problem. >>> I like what has and is being said. Very positve and uplifting. I think we >>> are on a good start. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> تجنب. القتل والاغتصاب واستعباد الآخرين >>> Évitez; assassiner, le viol et l'esclavage des autres >>> Avoid; murder, rape and enslavement of others >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: archytas <[email protected]> >>> To: [email protected] >>> Sent: Mon, 02 Feb 2015 2:10 PM >>> Subject: Re: Mind's Eye Moral compass >>> >>> Molly - we've been friends too long for you to think I mean this in any >>> nasty sense - but this is also the fascist credo. Quite obviously not what >>> you mean and something I'm sure you stand against. Once you have the >>> light, not grounded in Reason, it excuses anything. Reason itself is even >>> problematic once one becomes so sure you have it. Candy rots teeth. >>> >>> We might get round the problems with love. It didn't help Moses any >>> with the Midianites and seems a rather vain hope. I had a friend who >>> wished she had been born good. Temptation to the directive light is >>> obvious. Yet this and other 'inner subjective' claims are the easiest to >>> lie about. Of course, the only enlivening part of the Bible for me was >>> Doubting Thomas. I suppose number one for me is wondering whether the >>> preacher is any different from a double-glazing salesman. >>> >>> Heidegger argues that, in the present crisis, we are waiting for a god >>> who will reawaken us to the poetic, and thereby enable us to dwell in the >>> fourfold. This task certainly seems to be a noble one. Unfortunately, >>> however, it plunges us into the murkiest and most controversial region of >>> the Heideggerian intellectual landscape, his infamous involvement with >>> Nazism. Heidegger sometimes seems to use the term ‘god’ or ‘divinity’ to >>> refer to a heroic figure (a cultural template) who may initiate (or help to >>> initiate) a transformational event in the history of Being by opening up an >>> alternative clearing. These heroic figures are the grounders of the abyss, >>> the restorers of sacredness (Allan's avatars, perhaps). >>> >>> Which brings me to my second. I want to know from real history, not >>> text rendered holy. This may be because I'm Protestant and don't like >>> priests telling me where to learn from. >>> >>> Molly always get me going! >>> >>> On Monday, February 2, 2015 at 12:09:48 PM UTC, Molly wrote: >>>> >>>> At some point, we give up all the do nots and live according to a >>>> guiding light (is it a principle?) that needs no words, but includes all >>>> creation in love. (sacred heart of Christ? Am sure each form of faith has >>>> a >>>> symbol for it) Until we know this (and have to feel it first) creeds and >>>> moral compasses, affirmations and mantras, candy in many forms sweetens >>>> the >>>> pot we sit on. >>>> >>>> On Monday, February 2, 2015 at 6:55:20 AM UTC-5, Allan Heretic wrote: >>>>> >>>>> The objective is a social experiment.. starting with a moral >>>>> guideline. Or as RP put it creed which is probably Is better word to >>>>> use.. >>>>> >>>>> I have cut and pasted the different moral guides members use in day to >>>>> day life.. they are submitted for easier study. >>>>> >>>>> Love the Allfather with my whole Soul & being... >>>>> Love my neighbor as myself >>>>> As I judge other so too will I be judge >>>>> Do No Harm >>>>> Avoid murder, rape or enslavement of others >>>>> Avoid being enslaved by possessions >>>>> >>>>> Molly :-) >>>>> It’s a Sufi saying: Before you speak, let your words pass through >>>>> three gates. At the first gate, ask yourself ‘Is is true.’ At the second >>>>> gate ask, ‘Is it necessary.’ At the third gate ask, ‘Is it kind. >>>>> >>>>> RP :-) >>>>> My moral compass >>>>> Don't fear anything , but use your reasoning faculty to do the right >>>>> thing. >>>>> do not covet but earn and save for the needs of yourself and family. >>>>> Do not be lustful but be happy with your spouse. >>>>> Do not be arrogant but respect yourself and others. >>>>> Don't be angry but take care to do your duties. >>>>> >>>>> Chris: >>>>> If it harms none, do as you will. :-) >>>>> >>>>> Neil: >>>>> I don't really do creed Allan. Found too many people who talk them >>>>> and mean none. >>>>> >>>>> Molly made a comment about the end of my own submission which I >>>>> thought was valid so I chopped it.. only because it was my own >>>>> submission >>>>> I felt free to modify without group input. >>>>> >>>>> All of the submissions I found fascinating. The award for the most >>>>> original goes to RP. The difference in cultures shows up well. His >>>>> submission is extremely honest.. Molly's is an excellent way of handing >>>>> the >>>>> events of day to day basis. Chris's guide is another of wicca in general >>>>> (a >>>>> poor attempt humor) ☆ "burning at the stake is not allowed" . Neil's no >>>>> guideline and reasons given are very valid, showing effort not to fall >>>>> into >>>>> te next category. >>>>> >>>>> This category can maybe best described as a cork (being nice) >>>>> floating in the ocean of humanity being tossed around by whichever >>>>> direction the wind is blowing or the current flowing caught within the >>>>> gyres of greed and selfishness fostered by the news, games and >>>>> entertainment. >>>>> >>>>> To have a successful experiment we need to design a common moral >>>>> guidelines for the experiment. So gentle people start your shredders. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> تجنب. القتل والاغتصاب واستعباد الآخرين >>>>> Avoid; murder, rape and enslavement of others >>>> >>>> -- >>> >>> --- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> -- --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
