Although potentially heresy on this particular mailing list, you may
want to get your feet wet with Django with just their development web
server rather than fighting a setting with mod-wsgi out of the gate.
Provided that you install it from the tarball (and preferably in a
virtualenv environment), then you will really need limited Unix skills
to be up and developing. Deployment to a server is a whole other
matter. :)
-Rob
On 7/6/10 12:04 PM, Bradley Hintze wrote:
Thanks Carl for the feed back. I know I need to get mor Unix savvy.
Maybe I'll see what I can find on the web, Unix for Dummies...:)
On Tue, Jul 6, 2010 at 10:33 AM, Carl Nobile<[email protected]> wrote:
I had mentioned some time ago to use a tar ball instead of the
installer you were using. Also your issue here and I'm not trying to
be insulting just honest, is that you need to have a better
understanding of UNIX type systems. Not knowing what a sources script
is is an indicator that you have little UNIX experience. Most of the
problems you are having stems from this I'm afraid. You are trying to
get a framework running when you don't have a good understanding of
the system you're running it on. The fact that you don't understand
the documentation is also an indicator of your need to become more
UNIX savvy.
As I said I'm not trying to get on your case, I'm just telling you
where your issues really lay. We all started off not knowing this
stuff, but had to learn it at some point if we wanted to use UNIX type
systems. In a few years you'll be the expert.
~Carl
On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 11:49 PM, Bradley Hintze
<[email protected]> wrote:
Thank you all for your patience I actually got an answer on django,
just download the tarball rather than the 3rd party installers and
that seemed to work. I now can do the django tutorial which is in
plain english. By the way, I am trying to read the documentation, I am
not ignoring it. I have a hard time following most documentation as it
uses jargo of the trade which is not known to me. However, as I said
this tutorial seems to be strait forward. I'll go ahead with that and
see where i get.
Thank you!!
On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 11:21 PM, Graham Dumpleton
<[email protected]> wrote:
On 6 July 2010 12:58, Bradley Hintze<[email protected]> wrote:
I am so sorry and plead for your patience. I think I need to start
over from scratch. I am totally lost. I am geting so many different
things thrown at me. Sorry Carl, your message threw me off (sourced
shell script??? what is that? is it .bashrc?). I started a new thread
on the Django mailing list where I do start from where I am at right
now, the beginning with bitnami-djangostack-1.1.1-2-osx-x86-installer
installed (which someone said I shouldn't be using???) If someone has
access to that list and could reply to the questions there in an
'Answer for Dummies' way, I'd appreciate it.
Unfortunately, you will get just as many divergent views on the Django
list as well and likely be equally overwhelmed.
In all of this, it is very important to read what documentation
exists. If you expect others to help at every point by answering each
detail, you are going to have a lot of trouble due to information
overload and/or people getting frustrated with you because you aren't
using the documentation.
If you are new to web programming, you probably want to go back to
some of the prior suggestions and choose a much simpler web framework
to learn the concepts than Django. A good one which is quite self
contained as recommended before is Flask (flask.pocoo.org). It is
really simple and code can be all in the one file if need be, making
it easier to understand. You also can use its own internal server
while you learn and don't need to worry about hosting under Apache.
Graham
Again, I truly am sorry.
I am a biochemist trying to learn web stuff.
On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 10:45 PM, Graham Dumpleton
<[email protected]> wrote:
On 6 July 2010 12:34, Graham Dumpleton<[email protected]> wrote:
On 6 July 2010 12:21, Bradley Hintze<[email protected]> wrote:
Thanks Graham,
I just installed Django and it failed to import. I'm sure it has
something to do with 'not being in my PATH,' whatever that means. I
wish Django had installation instructions rather than going strait to
the tutorial.
Being able to import a module is a completely different issue and
relates to Python module search path.
If you are getting that when using mod_wsgi, it will be due to one of
three reasons.
1. Your mod_wsgi is compiled against/using a different Python
version/installation than what you installed Django into.
2. You are using a virtual environment, or have installed Django into
your home directory and you have told Python under mod_wsgi where it
is.
Meant 'and have not told Python'.
Graham
3. The Django when installed doesn't have permissions such that user
Apache runs as can read it.
Personally I would suggest you not use
bitnami-djangostack-1.1.1-2-osx-x86-installer as you seem to be based
on post on Django list. These installers and other packaging systems
such as MacPorts and fink just cause more problems that they are
worth. Just use the standard Python installation on MacOS X.
Easiest thing to do is run:
easy_install virtualenv
virtualenv myenv
source myenv/bin/activate
easy_install Django
django-admin.py mysite
python mysite/manage.py
Each time you want to work with it under Django builtin server,
remember to do that 'source' line where the argument is activate
script in that virtual environment.
When running under mod_wsgi you will need to do a bit of extra setup
to tell it where stuff installed. For that, see my talk slides and
video as mentioned at:
http://groups.google.com/group/modwsgi/browse_frm/thread/119ca215ee86888
Will save me a lot of trouble explaining it.
Graham
The problem I've seen with readings on UNIX shells and the like is
that they are filled with jargon rather than english that a beginner
can understand.
Thanks again,
Bradley
On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 10:08 PM, Graham Dumpleton
<[email protected]> wrote:
On 6 July 2010 11:51, Bradley Hintze<[email protected]> wrote:
Carl,
What do you mean by
'It needs to be put in your path. This is usually done by sourcing a
shell script before you start working.'
On a UNIX system, it means that the directory containing any
executable programs you want to be able to run must appear in the PATH
environment variable.
The PATH environment variable is consulted by your shell to find
executables without you needing to give an absolute path name.
For example, on my system I have:
$ echo $PATH
/Users/grahamd/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/X11/bin
As is, django-admin.py isn't in my default path. Ie.,
$ which django-admin.py
returns nothing.
Now, if for example django-admin.py was in:
/Library/Python/2.6/site-packages/Django-1.2/django/bin
then this directory would need to be added into the PATH environment
variable. For example:
PATH=/Library/Python/2.6/site-packages/Django-1.2/django/bin:$PATH
You could do this by hand, by having it in a special script which you
source, or be part of your account login scripts (.bashrc for bash
shell).
In the case of a virtual environment, the 'django-admin.py' command is
actually likely to be in the 'bin' directory of the virtual
environment. Further, the virtual environment supplies an 'activate'
script which will extend the PATH variable, as well as doing other
stuff, to list that bin directory in your PATH. To use that activate
script you 'source' it. Eg for modern shells one can say:
source myenv/bin/activate
This should give you a bit of an idea. I suggest you now do some
reading on UNIX shells, the role of the PATH environment variable and
the 'source' command in the shell.
If instead you are on Windows, then sorry, but someone else will need
to explain that one.
Graham
????
Thanks,
Bradley
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 5:33 PM, Carl Nobile<[email protected]> wrote:
django-admin.py is in Django-x.x.x/django/bin after expanding the
zip/tarball, etc.
It needs to be put in your path. This is usually done by sourcing a
shell script before you start working. If you are using windows you
will need to put it permanently in your path.
~Carl
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 4:37 PM, Bradley Hintze
<[email protected]> wrote:
Your right in avoiding Django. I installed it and can't follow their
tutorial because django-admin.py is no where on my machine. haha
Pylons it is I guess.
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 3:38 PM, Raoul Snyman<[email protected]> wrote:
On 25 June 2010 20:59, Bradley Hintze<[email protected]> wrote:
I just talked to him. He just doesn't know about python frameworks.
What frame work would you (and all reading this) recommend? Preferably
one with a startup tutorial that doesn't requie a degree in CS.
Personally, I use Pylons[0]. It's not one of those "do everything
under the sun" frameworks, it is more geared towards providing you
with a smaller, more flexible platform to work on, but it does mean
that you might need to write a bit more boilerplate code. If you would
prefer a system that comes with the kitchen sink included, you can
look at Django[1] or TurboGears 2.x[2]. Another, even simpler and less
structured than Pylons WSGI framework is Werkzeug[3].
Personally I steer clear of Django because it's inflexible, TurboGears
because I have to write too much in places where I would expect it to
just work, and Werkzeug because it is not structured enough for me.
Each framework has it's own pro's and cons.
[0] http://pylonshq.com/
[1] http://www.djangoproject.com/
[2] http://turbogears.org/
[3] http://dev.pocoo.org/projects/werkzeug/
--
Raoul Snyman
B.Tech Information Technology (Software Engineering)
E-Mail: [email protected]
Web: http://www.saturnlaboratories.co.za/
Blog: http://blog.saturnlaboratories.co.za/
Mobile: 082 550 3754
Registered Linux User #333298 (http://counter.li.org)
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