Quoting Krimel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> > > > > > > > > [Platt]
> > > > > > > > > Whether a germ knows there's an independent reality or not
> > > > > > > > > is debatable since we don't know what it's like to be a
> > > > > > > > > germ. That a germ knows that it's better for it to be in one
>
> > > > > > > > > place rather than another can be assumed by its behavior.
> > > > > > > > > Similarly with an electron.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > [Krimel]
> > > > > > > > > If we don't know what a germ knows maybe we ought to just
> > > > > > > > > talk about what it does rather than making ass-u-me-tions
> > > > > > > > > about what it knows
> > > > > > > > > Similarly with electrons.
> > > > > > > > [Platt]
> > > > > > > > Every form of knowledge rests on assumptions.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > [Krimel}
> > > > > > > > This places a heavy burden on assumptions. So much so that I
> > > > > > > > think the burden of justifying the making of them rests on
> > > > > > > > those urging the assumption. In these situations what
> > > > > > > > justifies your assumption? What does it offer us?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > [Platt]
> > > > > > > By "these assumptions" I assume you mean the above about a germ
> > > > > > > and an electron.
> > > > > > > As for what it offers us, read "Lila."
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > [Krimel]
> > > > > > > It is you who says, "That a germ knows that it's better for it
> > > > > > > to be in one place rather than another can be assumed by its
> > > > > > > behavior."
> > > > > > > I am asking you to articulate your personal reason for urging
> > > > > > > this assumption. Can you tell me in you own words
> > > > > >
> > > > > > [Platt]
> > > > > > A better understanding of reality.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > [Krimel]
> > > > > > Better how?
> > > > >
> > > > > [Platt]
> > > > > Read "Lila."
> > > > >
> > > > > [Krimel]
> > > > > That won't tell me what benefit you personally see to assuming that
> > > > > a germ "knows" based on what it does.
> > > > >
> > > > > I believe you are capable of doing this but I could be wrong.
> > > >
> > > > [Platt]
> > > > I just told you. I believe you can read but I could be wrong.
> > > >
> > > > {Krimel]
> > > > Are you Pirsig's parrot repeating nothing? I have read and commented
> > > > at length on specific passages. Are you unable to articulate your own
> > > > beliefs or even to point to what you do believe in someone else's
> > > > work?
> > >
> > > [Platt]
> > > You asked a question and I answered. If you're not satisfied, that's
> > > your problem.
> > >
> > > [Krimel]
> > > I think this exchange, preserved here in toto, is an excellent
> > > illustration of someone who appears to 'just happen to believe"
> > > something but can't or won't articulate it. I thought you could do it
> > > but I guess not. Feel free to try any time you feel up to the task.
> >
> > [Platt]
> > Like I said, read Lila if you think I "just happen to believe." Maybe then
> > you witll "just happen to believe" something, too.
> >
> > [Krimel]
> > This issue is not what I think or what Pirsig thinks it is whether are not
> > you, Platt, can state your beliefs. It is still on open question.
>
> [Platt]
> If an open question to you it's your problem.
>
> [Krimel]
> If your inability to express yourself is my only problem things are looking
> better than I thought.
Then I'm happy for you.
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