Hi Ron, (Marsha,)
On Sep 1, 2009, at 12:32 PM, X Acto wrote:
"In philosophy, an objective fact means a truth that remains true
everywhere,
independently of human thought or feelings. For instance, it is true
always
and everywhere that 'in base 10, 2 plus 2 equals 4'. A subjective fact
is
one that is only true under certain conditions, at certain times, in
certain places, or for certain people."
-wiki
Ron:
I charge Bo with this line of thinking concerning all living beings,
anywhere
in the universe, that they see and think in terms of "subjects and
objects"
That this Objective fact, IS the intellectual level.
Steve:
I completely agree that it sounds very strange to say that the
intellectual level is a single fact/value rather than the collection of
ALL intellectual patterns of value. Certainly the habit of mind that
involves asking "is this subjective or objective?" is one such pattern
of value, but it is just one. Asking this question is not the only
habit of mind/pattern of thought/intellectual pattern of value/pattern
of manipulating symbols that stand for patterns of experience.
Unfortunately, Bo has gotten stuck on defining the levels as each
having a single value rather than collections of patterns of value of
four types as Pirsig has defined his MOQ. Of course Bo is welcome to
develop his own MOQ, but he has not demonstrated to me that thinking of
each level as "the value of X" has much value, though he insists that
doing so is the only way for an MOQ to make progress. It sounds like
you are having the same frustration.
Best,
Steve
Moq_Discuss mailing list
Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
Archives:
http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
