Cheers Ian
On 11/07/2010 22:58, Ian wrote:
Still spot on Horse.
Ian
Sent from my iPhone
On Jul 11, 2010, at 20:38, Horse <[email protected]> wrote:
Hi Steve, Dan, DMB, Ron, John, Matt, Platt and anyone else who's
interested
On 11/07/2010 02:25, Steven Peterson wrote:
Steve:
If those supporting Horse's action don't think Bo ought to be banned
then I am as confused as Matt is about what administrative action we
are talking about here. I mean, yeah, yeah, yeah...I agree that Bo is
all these flavors of horrible (and probably also a pretty good guy),
The impression I get is that no-one (myself included) wants to see Bo
removed from MD. Which is good - Bo is liked by many on the forum and
none of us want it to come to the point where Bo is removed. I know I
don't anyway. But what is required is that Bo stops repeating what,
for most, is the bleeding obvious. I.e. that Pirsig is either the
originator of the SOL or that he supports it in any way.
As both yourself and Matt have pretty much stopped reading what Bo
posts to the forum (a luxury I don't have if I want to be a good
administrator/moderator) you may have missed a number of people
asking Bo to 'shut the fuck up' and to stop being, as many correctly
see it, intellectually dishonest.
but what specific administrative action are we talking about? Is it...
1) a new forum rule where anyone claiming that SOL is Pirsig's idea
risks being banned?
Not a rule that will go on the website but a moderator request that
will have the same effect. See comments below.
2) a administrative request that Bo shut the hell up about SOL for a
while?
Tried that - didn't work! See comments below.
Also, please note that I'm not saying that there can be no discussion
of the SOL - just that it is not Pirsig's idea or supported by Pirsig.
3) a specific threat leveled at Bo that he will be banned if he in
particular continues to say that SOL was Pirsig's idea?
Not banned - removed from the list. See below
4) something else, like Bo will be banned if he continues to try to
woo every newbie that comes along by flattering them and telling them
about how they have blessedly managed to stumble upon the Great
Insight?
See below.
There are specific rules that relate to the forum which can be viewed
on moq.org and there are the general rules of any mailing list which
are that the list admin/moderator should keep some sort of order, try
and sort out member disputes and a whole bunch of other
admin/moderator type tasks. There is also a general rule that the
admin/moderators decision is final.
So what options do I have as moderator if, after asking someone to
stop doing something or behaving in a way that I think is incorrect,
they refuse and carry on as if I had said nothing? As far as I can
see I have three choices:
1) Do nothing
2) Moderate each incoming post from the offending member and only
pass those that I think are suitable
3) Remove the member from the list
If I do 1) I'm not doing my job properly, which I take seriously, so
that's not an option I would accept.
If I do 2) I'll have have to spend ridiculous amounts of time not
only checking posts for inappropriate content but also having
arguments from all and sundry that whatever I do is wrong and
censorious and that I'm an evil jack-booted bastard. I don't accept
this option either as I have far better things to do with my life
than waste time in pointless arguments.
Which leaves me with 3) and is the option I have chosen. Also
remember that removal from the list isn't necessarily permanent. If a
member agrees to stop whatever it was that I asked them to stop they
can come back onto the list. This has happened before.
If you know of other options then please let me know.
I've opted for 3 because this gives me a chance to stop offending
behaviour without having to waste time in pointless discussions.
Which, in my opinion, is what I've been doing for the last couple of
weeks and which I don't intend to continue.
Bo has been asked to stop one particular thing. If he chooses not to
do so he will be removed from the list. If anyone else chooses to
continue the behaviour Bo has been asked to stop, the same thing
happens. Very simple.
In addition to what I've said above, I would also repeat more or less
what I said in a previous post:
It would be a good idea to allow newcomers to settle into the forum
for a few weeks instead of, figuratively, leaping on them as soon as
they are through the forum door and have their coats off and regale
them with the MoQ according to Bo. Consider this an administrative
request and have the good manners to allow new members some breathing
space and settling in time.
I also think it would be a good idea that if an argument has gone on
for a certain length of time or number of posts and is getting
absolutely nowhere then I should and will call a time-out to all
involved for a cooling off and reflection period. I will try and be
polite and reasonable about this and will expect those involved to
respect my decision, live with it and not give me a hard time about
it or make stupid accusations
None of us think that Bo's SOL thesis is worth a darn and wish he
would stop harping on it, but what action are you defending here? I
thought it was 1) at first, but maybe it is 2) since you don't think
Bo ought to be banned. I thought Horse had done 1) in which case forum
rules are now:
#1 You must have read Pirsig's 2 books
#2 You may not say that SOL was Pirsig's idea
(Are there other rules to add to this list?) But perhaps Horse only
intended 2). I normally delete any posts addressed to or from Bo, so
I'm not at all clear about what has transpired. Is there a new forum
rule or not?
If my position isn't clear now then it is unlikely to ever be so.
Bo hasn't posted for a while so maybe he's taking time out to
consider what I and others have said. I hope so.
Bo and others are quite welcome to continue to promote the SOL but
with regard for what I have asked.
Cheers
Horse
--
"Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring
production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid."
— Frank Zappa
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--
"Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring production deadlines
or dates by which bills must be paid."
— Frank Zappa
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