Hi , Mr Buchanan, stunning quality abstraction, wide spectrum ,differentiated and to the point , Wilders is a polariser, a very provokative one, the dangerous kind.
They pulled him aboard the main tripartite now, to exploit his importance, ..the guy is a real David Copperfield/illusionist, one of his demands to step aboard of this newly formed government was that the rest of the tripartite agreed in advance to put a stop on immigration.;Strangely enough also the immigration to reunite families. They agreed in advance,.......even agreed on the percentage he is introducing, i think its about 30 % cutdown on immigration compared with the previous years. Hmm, charged with inciting....yes;on any occasion, any platform, any political speech he is raging against the Brown danger. < If convicted? well, if it is a first conviction for facts like this, (his case) he will walk out of court with a symbolic conviction. But this is just what he is trying to provoke,....Furthermore, as sitting part of the government it will prove to be impossible to convict him. He will walk, taking all the generated Barnum advertising for granted. Now , DMB, as you know , my wife is Muslim, Turkisch, and maybe one is tempted to think that i'm the biggest advokate of Islam, or the Quran or Koran, But in fact , i am not. i'm married for 26 years now, interracial marriage, and i have never encountered difficulties with my wife, or her environment, or Muslim people in other country's, but quit frankly this is because i'm very tolerant. I have no problem with Islam what so ever, But i dispise and reject totally, the polarisers, the fundamentalists, the hardliners. I totally reject violence, dogma's, or hatred projected towards others.It is not acceptable, period. And i have no intention what so ever to step outside my role as observer. "Man is the measure of all things," -->not religion, or it should be like this, same goes for the Christians, and others. Yes , shouting 'Fire' in a crowded theather, This is what Wilders is doing all the time... But then, if you come to think of it 9/11 is setting the theather called America on fire.....and tell the world outside that religion was at stake......Strangely enough in a country that is most tolerant towards religion, if compared with the countrys advokating Islam. Do i believe there is a place for a mosque around ground zero? well, no, and i do not believe there is a place for Mosques in my country, as well as i do not believe there is a place in Afganistan for Dutch windmills, or coffeeshops. I am not very sure if Americans know what i mean to say by that. My wife masters Arabic and can quote out of her head from the Koran, i know every phrase literally, let my asure you all there is no resemblance with Mein Kampf, none what so ever. To be honest, some of it is completely congruent with the bible,and yes Jesus(Isa) is mentioned,but in a different context. So yes, i know both, knowledge is the mother of wisdom. I think , personally that the freedom of speech is evolving towards a social corrected model, even in country's like America. Greetzz, Adrie 2010/10/5 david buchanan <[email protected]> > > Platt said to All: > > Dutch politician Geert Wilders is being tried for "hate speech." He is > charged with inciting hatred against Muslims. If convicted he faces up to > one year in prison. It will be interesting to see if intellect wins this > battle to be free of social control. If not, who will be next to be silenced > by the lower level? > > > > > dmb says: > > That's not how I see it. Wilders is not all that different from the > far-right politicians in this country and I'm not at all surprised that > Platt would take his side. Birds of a feather flock together, especially > right-winged birds. Like those who oppose the so-called "ground-zero mosque" > and the preacher who had to be talked out of his public Koran burning party, > they're not really interested in defending free speech. Quite the opposite. > In an effort to protect their own culture and religion, they're showing no > respect for the other guy's rights. And of course if you invoke a principle > to protect your own view but dismiss it when it comes time to protect the > other guy's view, then your stance is unprincipled. Then the idea is not a > principle at all. It's just a convenient excuse and a rather meaningless > form of self-flattery. One way to test just about any principle is to simply > put the shoe on the other foot and talk a little walk. > > > Have you heard about the leftist muslim politician from Vermont? He says > the bible is a fascist book and compares it to Mein Kampf. He says that > Christianity is "the ideology of a retarded culture" and wants the good book > banned. He held a bible-burning party to commemorate the Salem witch trials > last year. Naturally, there is a small percentage of far-left nut cases who > listen to this guy and take it upon themselves to act. You probably heard > about that 19 year-old who's on trial for beating a christian cab driver > simply for being a christian. Of course people like Michele Malkin and Rush > Limbaugh are calling for his head. They want to put him on trial for > inciting hatred against Christians. No, you haven't heard about this guy > from Vermont because he's pure fiction. Or rather, he's an inversion of a > composite of the real thing.... > > > > From the September 10, 2010 edition of the Christian Science Monitor: > ParisAs the world focuses on Florida pastor Terry Jones, a September 11 > event in New York City will include a surprisingly successful European > politician who has spent his career defaming Islam, and who has produced a > film that features a Quran in flames. > Geert Wilders, head of The Netherlands “Freedom Party,” will speak Saturday > at a “rally of remembrance” that includes congressional candidates from New > York and North Carolina, a taped message from former United Nations > Ambassador John Bolton, and support from radio talk host Rush Limbaugh. > Mr. Wilders is widely known in Europe for a platform to ban the Quran, > along with new mosques, and Muslim immigrants – and for his incendiary > speeches. He calls Islam “the ideology of a retarded culture” and likens the > Quran to “Mein Kampf.” > > > > > dmb continues: > > As I see it, the right to free speech is supposed to prevent this kind of > tribalism, this kind of religious hostility. This intellectual principle is > supposed to protect freedom of expression but this freedom is not served > when it's used to muzzle the expression of others. As William James puts it, > a pluralistic society like ours is supposed to tolerate anything that is not > itself intolerant. Wilders seems to be a bigot-provacatuer. He uses what > even the law recognizes as "fighting words", and I don't just mean when he's > talking to his poker buddies. And our right wingers just love him for it. > This kind of us-vs-them mentality is not intellectual or principled and it's > not about freedom. It's about defending white supremacy and christian > dominance in an increasingly multicultural world. It's part of larger > pattern of reactionary paranoia. It is the social level's immune system > overheating, acting out against perceived threats. > > > Everybody knows that people are likely to get hurt if you shout "Fire!" in > a crowded theater. If you shout "food fight!" in a crowded cafeteria, > everybody knows that people are likely to make a mess. And so it's not at > all a stretch for me to believe that inciting hatred is a real act, one > that's very likely to cause real harm to real people. There is a wide array > of crimes that can be committed with nothing more than speech. Inciting a > riot and perjury spring to mind. Slander and treason are punishable by law. > One can be convicted for conspiracy to commit a crime, even if the crime > itself was never carried out. To make these things illegal does no harm to > the principle of free speech, none whatsoever. Neither does the law against > inciting hate. Tolerance is not served by tolerating intolerance. Free > speech, Mein Ass. > > > > > > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html > -- parser Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
