"Libertarian Socialism"? - I don't know, but that's maybe a fancy and dry
ideological term for a very messy real world phenomena that many UKers
called 'Butskillism' (after the Conservative, Butler, who brought in the
1945 Education Act, and the 1950's Labour Politician Hugh Gateskill, a very
non-ideological figure on the left). 'Butskillism' was a term coined to
describe the UK post-war consensus - joing the names of conservative and
labour figures. It was an anti-ideological consensus, directed at
combatting disease and ignorance and at building enough houses for those
made homeless by the war and so on. They cared little for hang-ups about
the approved ways of doing this, or formulating this into a 'philosophy'.
If you've just fought a war against nutters with fixed ideas you don't say
to yourself "lets go and find an 'ism'". You just want to live in a better
world. I think that accords with pursuing DQ - wanting to live in a better
world - don't you?
> From: "Horse" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Date: Thu, 7 Jun 2001 00:41:56 +0100
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: MD Old Socialists Never Die
>
> Hi All
>
> On 30 May 2001, at 22:52, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>> ROG:
>> Yea, I remember. I was hoping you would join in. (and I still need an
>> explanation of Horse's Libertarian socialism, but I can't seem to incite him
>> to join in to the depth I was hoping)
>
> OK Rog - consider me sufficiently incited to try and clarify this particular
> political position. I'm
> not sure why it should appear such an odd position any more than someone else
> being a
> christian democrat, a liberal democrat or whatever but the last time I
> described myself thus a
> number of people seemed to think I'd gone a bit strange(r!).
> Anyway I think it fits in perfectly well with the MoQ, in fact I don't really
> understand why more
> MOQites don't declare themselves to be of this persuasion.
>
> As a Socialist I believe that the state is required to provide and maintain a
> number of
> services and provide certain functionality. This includes but is not limited
> to the judiciary,
> military, utilities(electricity, gas water etc.), health services, transport
> infrastructure, education
> system and welfare/benefits system system. The Socialist state should act for
> the benefit of
> it's members, contrasting with the Fascist state which acts for the benefit of
> industrial
> concerns. I don't believe that the state needs to own all of the means of
> production but
> certainly a sufficient amount to ensure it's ability to provide basic services
> and functions.
>
> As a Libertarian I believe that individuals have certain rights which are not
> subject to
> interference in any form by the state. Free association, freedom of
> expression, freedom of
> speech etc. The individual can speak and act freely whilst ensuring that
> certain actions do
> not harm the Social base or other individuals - drink driving, drug addiction
> acts of violence
> etc. - although if the individual chooses to harm itself, then in many cases
> this is pretty much
> acceptable. I do not believe that anything goes and that the individual should
> be completely
> unrestrained - except in intellectual terms where, in line with the MoQ, this
> is the case.
>
> So as a Libertarian Socialist I would have thought that my position is fairly
> clear and
> corresponds with the MoQ. The state provides the basis for the Intellect to
> flourish as it
> manifests itself in the individual whilst controlling the biological aspects
> of the individual. The
> individual can behave freely without fear of reprisal or censure as long as
> it's behaviour does
> not harm society - with the exception of intellectual activity.
>
> This is not an overly detailed outline of my interpretation of Libertatrian
> Socialism as
> otherwise it would run to an awfully long post. My position does differ from
> some other
> interpretations as it is strongly influenced by the MoQ. If you read On
> Liberty by JS Mill you'll
> see this as the starting point for much of what I believe is a reasonable and
> achievable
> position - with a huge dose of Pirsig inserted.
>
> If you have any other questions I'll be glad to provide answers as and when I
> can.
>
>
> Horse
>
>
>
>
>
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