But Tim, the point of miscue is to work with the child to address those issues which are impacting meaning and certainly think that halting heading behaviors, unnecessary rereading and even over-correcting can certainly be impacting oral fluency. Again, is it wide and successful reading that builds fluency or fluency that ensures wide and successful reading. I suppose a bit of both, don't you?
Lori On 7/8/07 4:06 PM, "RASINSKI, TIMOTHY" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I applaud the child who reads haltingly in grades 2, 3, 4, 5 and comprehends > well. However, if that student is still reading haltingly in the middle and > high school grades it is going to catch up with him/her. A few years ago I > worked with 9th graders in Chicago, more than a few of whom were reading at a > rate of 20-30 words per minute on 8th grade passages. These students were > ready to drop out of school they were so frustrated. > > If a normal achieving 9th grader reads at a rate of say 160 words per minute, > any one hour reading assignment given to the student reading at 30 words per > minute now becomes a 5 hour assignment. I would offer that this student is > frustrated and, to be honest, I can understand their frustration. > > Unless we attempt to address these problems in the elementary grades we are > likely to end up with high school students (assuming they don't drop out > before high school) who are much like the ones I found in Chicago (and around > the country). > > I think we need to take a look at the big picture. Are we really doing > children a favor and ignoring their slow, halting, labored reading in the > primary grades because they seem to be understanding what they read? Just > thinking out loud here. > > Timothy Rasinski > 404 White Hall > Kent State University > Kent, OH 44242 > 330-672-0649 > Cell -- 330-962-6251 > FAX 330-672-2025 > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > informational website: www.timrasinski.com > professional development DVD: http://www.roadtocomprehension.com/ > <https://exchange.kent.edu/exchweb/bin/redir.asp?URL=http://www.roadtocomprehe > nsion.com/> > > ________________________________ > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Waingort Jimenez, Elisa > Sent: Sun 7/8/2007 11:24 AM > To: Mosaic: A Reading Comprehension Strategies Email Group > Subject: Re: [MOSAIC] Repeated Readings for Fluency - Question for Tim > > > > Hi Tim, > I don´t think anyone is saying that fluency is worthless. I think the > question was about a child who can read silently with comprehension but reads > haltingly aloud. I still believe that there is no cause to worry in this > case. To me, it´s the same issue that comes up when people say that until > children can name the letters of the alphabet and the sounds of those letters, > they shouldn´t be writing. I´m still not convinced that reading aloud > fluently is important if the child reads silently (probably fluently) and with > comprehension. As others have noted, reading aloud is a performance and some > people don´t do well when they´re on stage. > Any thoughts? > Elisa Waingort > Calgary, Canada > > Fluency can be a troubling concept > -- I agree; but please don't decide that it is worthless because of the > way some experts recommend it be taught. If done appropriately, I > think (I know from my own clinical and classroom work) that it can be > life saver for many students. > > > Timothy Rasinski, Ph.D. > Reading and Writing Center > 404 White Hall > Kent State University > Kent, OH 44242 > > email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Phone: 330-672-0649 > Cell: 330-962-6251 > Fax: 330-672-2025 > Informational website: www.timrasinski.com > Professional Development DVD: http://www.roadtocomprehension.com/ > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zoe Jackson > Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2007 8:35 PM > To: Mosaic: A Reading Comprehension Strategies Email Group > Subject: Re: [MOSAIC] Repeated Readings for Fluency - Question for Tim > > Your third paragraph sounds so sensible to me. I've had a gut feeling > recently that fluency is the present education craze, but a passing > phase. It is an easy improvement to be able to measure, but does it > actually develop comprehension skills. Thanks for your knowledgeable > input. > Zoe > On Saturday, July 7, 2007, at 09:10 PM, elaine garan wrote: > >> I'm not Tim, but I'll jump in here with a thought that might put your >> experience in a different perspective. >> >> Do you think it's possible that when he's reading aloud, he's so >> focused on how he sounds that he isn't thinking about what he's >> reading? This happens to me. When I'm reading in front of an audience, >> very often, I have no idea of what I've read. Maybe this is a sign > that >> he's a mature reader. How often do any of us read aloud? How often do >> we worry about how fluently we read or how we sound? And when we do >> worry about that, what happens to our comprehension? Most of us do > most >> of our reading silently. >> >> Beyond beginning reading, beyond first grade, there is a zero >> correlation between fluency and comprehension. In fact, fluency (in >> terms of a focus on wpm and even prosody) can actually interfere with >> comprehension because the reader is thinking about that performance >> aspect instead of meaning, especially if he or she is being timed. . >> The research supports that. So maybe this boy is a fluent as he needs >> to be. And if he's reading silently with comprehension, then why worry >> about how he sounds when he reads aloud since most of mature reading >> and even reading for tests is silent anyway? >> >> >> On Saturday, July 7, 2007, at 05:53 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >> >>> Yes he can. When he reads aloud he rereads constantly and has hardly >>> any >>> comprehension. If I ask him to read a page silently and tell me what >>> it's about >>> he can. He's a mystery. >>> >>> Sue >>> >>> >>> >>> ************************************** See what's free at >>> http://www.aol.com <http://www.aol.com/> . >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Mosaic mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> To unsubscribe or modify your membership please go to >>> http://literacyworkshop.org/mailman/options/ >>> mosaic_literacyworkshop.org. >>> >>> Search the MOSAIC archives at http://snipurl.com/MosaicArchive. >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Mosaic mailing list >> [email protected] >> To unsubscribe or modify your membership please go to >> http://literacyworkshop.org/mailman/options/ >> mosaic_literacyworkshop.org. >> >> Search the MOSAIC archives at http://snipurl.com/MosaicArchive. >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Mosaic mailing list > [email protected] > To unsubscribe or modify your membership please go to > http://literacyworkshop.org/mailman/options/mosaic_literacyworkshop.org. > > Search the MOSAIC archives at http://snipurl.com/MosaicArchive. > > > _______________________________________________ > Mosaic mailing list > [email protected] > To unsubscribe or modify your membership please go to > http://literacyworkshop.org/mailman/options/mosaic_literacyworkshop.org. > > Search the MOSAIC archives at http://snipurl.com/MosaicArchive. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Mosaic mailing list > [email protected] > To unsubscribe or modify your membership please go to > http://literacyworkshop.org/mailman/options/mosaic_literacyworkshop.org. > > Search the MOSAIC archives at http://snipurl.com/MosaicArchive. > -- Lori Jackson District Literacy Coach & Mentor Todd County School District Box 87 Mission SD 57555 http:www.tcsdk12.org ph. 605.856.2211 Literacies for All Summer Institute "Literate Lives: A Human Right" July 12-15, 2007 Louisville, Kentucky http://www.ncte.org/profdev/conv/wlu _______________________________________________ Mosaic mailing list [email protected] To unsubscribe or modify your membership please go to http://literacyworkshop.org/mailman/options/mosaic_literacyworkshop.org. Search the MOSAIC archives at http://snipurl.com/MosaicArchive.
