Send Motion-user mailing list submissions to
motion-user@lists.sourceforge.net
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/motion-user
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
motion-user-requ...@lists.sourceforge.net
You can reach the person managing the list at
motion-user-ow...@lists.sourceforge.net
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Motion-user digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: GCC optimizer is provably junk. Here is the evidence. (rmbusy)
2. Re: GCC optimizer is provably junk. Here is the evidence.
(Harlan Daneker)
3. Re: GCC optimizer is provably junk. Here is the evidence. (rmbusy)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2024 10:39:00 -0700
From: rmbusy <rmbusy+mot...@gmail.com>
To: Motion discussion list <motion-user@lists.sourceforge.net>, JB
<yona...@riseup.net>
Subject: Re: [Motion-user] GCC optimizer is provably junk. Here is the
evidence.
Message-ID: <77609d5d-a2b8-4c03-28ce-a27c369ef...@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
JB, that is the same toxic response that Dave was shining a light on.?
Good job!
Dave, thanks for bringing this to our attention.? Since Motion is one of
the "apps" you mention, it is very relevant to the readers of this
mailing list.
People may not understand the motivation for companies to sabotage OSS
(Open Source Software), but it's real, and it's all for profit.? If they
make the x86 code generation less efficient via the compiler, especially
for older CPU's, then most people will just think they need a new
computer, and viola, a new sale is the result.
Sticking your head in the sand about the issue is your prerogative, but
will not help the situation.
--
Rob.
On 3/25/24 05:14, JB wrote:
> On 2024-03-24 13:20, Dave Blanchard wrote:
>
> <SNIP a load of garbage we here at the Motion list didn't need to see>
>
>> Sincerely,
>>
>> Dave Blanchard (aka "the idiotic and self-righteous piece of shit")
> Because you don't know how to keep on topic in a mailing list, your
> 'aka' fits you quite well, as far as I'm concerned!
>
> JB
>
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2024 14:16:33 -0400
From: Harlan Daneker <hdane...@gmail.com>
To: Motion discussion list <motion-user@lists.sourceforge.net>
Subject: Re: [Motion-user] GCC optimizer is provably junk. Here is the
evidence.
Message-ID:
<cac1wkitckxowa42+sl0lnhdk9gwa6u3hnyeaaevyplt7wkt...@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
If there is a problem some of the programmers out there should chime in and *be
specific about what the problems are* *in layman's terms*. Also what do we
do about it other than complain? I am one of those people that would not
know. I do compile things occasionally including motion on a Fedora box.
Harlan
On Mon, Mar 25, 2024 at 1:40?PM rmbusy <rmbusy+mot...@gmail.com> wrote:
> JB, that is the same toxic response that Dave was shining a light on.
> Good job!
>
> Dave, thanks for bringing this to our attention. Since Motion is one of
> the "apps" you mention, it is very relevant to the readers of this
> mailing list.
>
> People may not understand the motivation for companies to sabotage OSS
> (Open Source Software), but it's real, and it's all for profit. If they
> make the x86 code generation less efficient via the compiler, especially
> for older CPU's, then most people will just think they need a new
> computer, and viola, a new sale is the result.
>
> Sticking your head in the sand about the issue is your prerogative, but
> will not help the situation.
>
>
> --
> Rob.
>
>
> On 3/25/24 05:14, JB wrote:
> > On 2024-03-24 13:20, Dave Blanchard wrote:
> >
> > <SNIP a load of garbage we here at the Motion list didn't need to see>
> >
> >> Sincerely,
> >>
> >> Dave Blanchard (aka "the idiotic and self-righteous piece of shit")
> > Because you don't know how to keep on topic in a mailing list, your
> > 'aka' fits you quite well, as far as I'm concerned!
> >
> > JB
> >
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Motion-user mailing list
> Motion-user@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/motion-user
> https://motion-project.github.io/
>
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/options/motion-user
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2024 11:55:07 -0700
From: rmbusy <rmbusy+mot...@gmail.com>
To: motion-user@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Motion-user] GCC optimizer is provably junk. Here is the
evidence.
Message-ID: <ac88b2cf-3232-7ae7-a50e-147232204...@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"
Harlan,
? Unfortunately this problem doesn't have an easy solution (other than
using a non-GCC based tool chain).? Alternate tool chains would likely
require the user to purchase them, which most people won't do.
? The problem the link outlines is the compiler generates less
efficient code than it should, and those involved in the development of
GCC are not receptive to input on fixing it (quite the opposite actually).
? In layman's terms, anything built with GCC, including the Linux
kernel, system drivers, and applications (like Motion) would run slower
(use more CPU cycles) and consume more memory than they would otherwise
(at least on x86 architectures).? Until someone produces an alternative
to GCC, with better optimization, we're pretty much stuck with what we
have today.? Maybe someone will introduce a fork to GCC, that provides
those improvements.
--
Rob.
On 3/25/24 11:16, Harlan Daneker wrote:
> If there is a problem some of the programmers out there should chime
> in and /be specific about what the problems are/ /in layman's terms/.
> Also what do we do about it other than complain? I am one of those
> people that would not know. I do compile things occasionally including
> motion on a Fedora box.
>
> Harlan
>
> On Mon, Mar 25, 2024 at 1:40?PM rmbusy <rmbusy+mot...@gmail.com
> <mailto:rmbusy%2bmot...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> JB, that is the same toxic response that Dave was shining a light on.
> Good job!
>
> Dave, thanks for bringing this to our attention.? Since Motion is
> one of
> the "apps" you mention, it is very relevant to the readers of this
> mailing list.
>
> People may not understand the motivation for companies to sabotage
> OSS
> (Open Source Software), but it's real, and it's all for profit.?
> If they
> make the x86 code generation less efficient via the compiler,
> especially
> for older CPU's, then most people will just think they need a new
> computer, and viola, a new sale is the result.
>
> Sticking your head in the sand about the issue is your
> prerogative, but
> will not help the situation.
>
>
> --
> Rob.
>
>
> On 3/25/24 05:14, JB wrote:
> > On 2024-03-24 13:20, Dave Blanchard wrote:
> >
> > <SNIP a load of garbage we here at the Motion list didn't need
> to see>
> >
> >> Sincerely,
> >>
> >> Dave Blanchard (aka "the idiotic and self-righteous piece of shit")
> > Because you don't know how to keep on topic in a mailing list, your
> > 'aka' fits you quite well, as far as I'm concerned!
> >
> >? ? ? JB
> >
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Motion-user mailing list
> Motion-user@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/motion-user
> https://motion-project.github.io/
>
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/options/motion-user
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Motion-user mailing list
> Motion-user@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/motion-user
> https://motion-project.github.io/
>
> Unsubscribe:https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/options/motion-user
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
------------------------------
------------------------------
Subject: Digest Footer
_______________________________________________
Motion-user mailing list
Motion-user@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/motion-user
------------------------------
End of Motion-user Digest, Vol 211, Issue 7
*******************************************
