Since no else is commenting, I will.  I think that IRV (Instant Runoff
Voting) and PV (Proportional Voting) are two of the worst ideas to come
down the road in a long time.  

Simply put, IRV creates a system in which the candidate who receives the
most votes may actually lose to a candidate who receives fewer votes but
is a popular "second choice".  PV effectively means that you vote for a
political party not a person.  As proposed in Minneapolis, it would also
require all or some of the city council to be elected at-large.  

The system isn't broken.  The majority of city council members are DFL
because that is who the voters chose.  

Perhaps the Green Party or the Independence Party will prove viable long
term.  Republicans could win elections in the city but are dragged deep
into the mud by a national and state party committed to wreaking havoc
both here and abroad.  The Minneapolis Republican leadership, like Lee
Eklund, Carleton Crawford, and Connie Nompelis are good people all but
when Grover Norquist and Ann Coulter represent the soul of your party .
. . 

Jim Bernstein
Fulton
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of David Shove
Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 3:15 PM
To: Leurquin, Ronald
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED];
[EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [Mpls] GOP Caucuses

I am an advocate of IRV and PR.

On Mon, 22 Dec 2003, Leurquin, Ronald wrote:

> Maybe the comments below form a good argument for proportional
> representation and even instant runnoff elections.

Perhaps they do. But look at it from the point of view of the DFL
incumbent - which is what most of the council is. The present
winner-take-all system has gotten them where they are. It puts up
formidable obstacles to challengers - meaning once you're in, you're
pretty much in for life. And if you leave after many terms, there's
usually a nice corporate job to repay you for the public resources
you've
given it. So why would they want to change it?

Of course we the public suffer, but what are we in the great scale of
things compared to our honorable elected-for-life officials?  As far as
they're concerned, a "public servant" is a person in the public who
serves
them.

There is an adage that power never surrenders power voluntarily.

The only strategy I know of that works is to have another party that
takes
enough votes away from them in election after election that some of them
lose their seats, the rest of them fear it, and PR and IRV are the only
way to lessen their loss. Then they will fall all over themselves
putting
it in yesterday.

I suggest that that other party is the Green Party. It's already bigger
in
Mpls than the GOP, and has Zimmermann, Johnson-Lee, and Young. Re-elect
them, and elect a couple more Greens - and watch the DFL put in PR and
IRV
overnight.

But any third party would do, so long as it makes incumbents lose.

--David Shove
Roseville

 for so long I have
> personally felt that the better choices always got wiped out before
the
> final elections because they lacked charisma, money, or some other
> reason that had nothing to do with thier actual ability to do the job
> they were running for.  It seems like the crap rises to the top way to
> often ion our present system now. Ron Leurquin Nokomis east
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