Hi Lisa, I do not disagree with your characterizations of the manually sorted view as precise and static (without further manual sorts), or not very useful as time goes by without further manual sorts.
I think there will be two kinds of users that find the current Manual Sort implementation highly functional for them. First, I think there is a sizable number of MLO users (based on past input clamoring for manual sorting) that essentially want to manually sort their To Do's, without any automatic ordering. One example how this might be done taken from the Franklin Covey model: create 4 flags representing the Franklin Covey's 4 quadrants, Quadrant I Important & Urgent, Quadrant II Important, Quadrant III Urgent, and Quadrant IV Not Important Nor Urgent. The user would then multiple select tasks and quickly drop all of the tasks into one these 4 quadrants. You now have very quickly classified all of your tasks into 4 different quadrants. Next the user would probably manually sort some or all of the tasks within the urgent quadrants (I and III). It is probably not all that necessary to manually order the tasks within the other 2 quadrants, but it could be done. Now as new tasks come into the view they will fall within the No Flag category. These tasks can then be dragged to their appropriate quadrant. Note that this methodology requires no other automatic sorting. The user drags the task to the appropriate group, and then manually sorts the tasks within each quadrant as necessary. I think users who like to set their own order will like this approach as you can do it very quickly and the No Flag category shows them what hasn't been manually sorted. Note that this approach is not static nor does it become less useful over time because the user is applying future sorts as he/she sees fit. The second kind of user will probably want to use MLO's Computed-Score sort and then manually sort a few tasks to fit more precisely their needs. This user will probably work or complete those tasks that he has manually sorted, and do a fresh start with the Computed-Score sort and start manually sorting a few tasks again. As this user will be performing fresh starts, the list will not become less useful over time due to the frequency of the fresh starts. The view will only be static or precise until the user manually sorts or does a fresh start. I will probably be this kind of user. The third type of user will probably hold out for a combined manual / secondary sort. You obviously fall into this type of user. If Andrey can find a way to deliver a less inexact, less kludgy, and less tricky approach for combining manual and automatic sorts than the one you have described, I will most likely join you over on the dark side. :) Ron On Jan 28, 4:19 pm, Lisa Stroyan <[email protected]> wrote: > At 12:10 PM 1/28/2010, you wrote: > > >This notion of mixing manual sorts with other secondary sorts is not > >only not intuitive to me, but I don't know how you could possibly > >implement it. > > I've seen more complicated things implemented :) Basically, tasks > that had been moved would be the only thing that would have a > position indicator in the list. You would sort the other tasks, and > then insert the manually moved tasks into the saved slot. Therefore > if you moved most of your tasks the new ones would automatically sort > to the bottom....True, it would be inexact and perhaps a bit kludgy > (you would have to reset the indicators of where each task was each > time a task is deleted from the list, and what about "undo"?). And > it could be a bit tricky with multiple views... > > My main point though, is that if you are not going to allow secondary > sorts, don't put the manual sort into the sort criteria box. Leave > it alone, and turn the box off. Let me choose whether or not to lose > all the sort orders rather than doing it one way when I move a task > (resets sort order) and another way when I change back and forth > through the sort criteria box (it leaves them alone). Let me come in > each morning and "reset" my view so that it's back to the default, > so the original sort order is useful on an ongoing basis, and have > other views where I leave it completely manually sorted forever, as I choose. > > >to where they thought they should be in the view. If you have a list > >of 50 tasks in Computed-Score order and you want to move 3 to 5 tasks > >to the top of the list, or move a few tasks, that are near the top, > >down the list, I think Andrey's manual sorting works quite well. > > This is a great example of what I'm trying to point out. It does > work quite well....at first. By Computed-Score is very dynamic, and > switching to manual just got rid of all of that power. As time goes > by, everything gets added to the end, none of your computed-score > ordering updates even for the items already in the list that you > never moved, and it's not so useful anymore that you ever used > Computed Score in the first place. > > (this is the same problem that we are discussing in another thread > for the outline). > > My overall thought is this: Match the UI to the usage model. Get > the best usage model you can implement in the time allowed, but have > the UI support the one you choose. The current usage model is a > GREAT improvement over the old one - I LIKE the changes. I just > think it could be taken farther..... :) > > >don't believe that you are suggesting that if you are manually sorting > >that you must put all 50 tasks in a precise order, or else all you > >would be doing every day is moving tasks around your view every time a > >new task pops into the view. > > Well, actually right now they are put in that precise order as soon > as you move the first one - it might be a perfectly good order since > it was previously sorted, but it's both precise and static. At > least, from my experimentation that is how it works .... > > Lisa > > ---------- > Lisa Stroyan, mailto:[email protected] -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MyLifeOrganized" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/mylifeorganized?hl=en.
