I definitely appreciate the concerns about state abuse that is why I mentioned it up front and posted it here.
But I do wonder what we are morally obligated to do that is legal with the technology tools before us to help people self-isolate or the state enforce necessary quarantines. With a mother in her upper 70s and a grandmother at 95 in assisted living, this feels very real to me - they and potentially millions others around the world could die unnecessarily if the spread is not more effectively slowed. In my home state, I have various political connections and I would love to be able to document and say, this is what South Korea did (with some detail beyond the phrase in the article that says, " racking potential carriers like detectives, using cell phone and satellite technology.") I heard Trump mention today that Google was helping with a website and had 1000+ engineers on it (that seems like a lot) to help people figure out if they should be tested and where to test. Taking that the next step and saying, "you tested positive ... do you want help identifying and letting those we think (and you verify) you've been very near for X days know" seems like a logical extension. Steve Steven Clift <http://stevenclift.com> - Founder and Volunteer, E-Democracy.org cl...@e-democracy.org - +1 612 234 7072 @Democracy <http://twitter.com/democracy> - Facebook <https://www.facebook.com/stevenlclift> - LinkedIn <http://linkedin.com/in/netclift> On Fri, Mar 13, 2020 at 4:49 PM Christiana Mauro <c...@gmx.com> wrote: > Yes, attention to social spending priorities would be preferable to this > scheme. Emergency powers invite much more serious societal problems than > stigmatization. > > *Sent:* Friday, March 13, 2020 at 6:41 PM > *From:* "Gil Pradeau" <g.prad...@my.westminster.ac.uk> > *To:* "Michael Meyer" <mock1...@gmail.com> > *Cc:* "Róbert Bjarnason" <rob...@citizens.is>, "Steven Clift" < > cl...@e-democracy.org>, democracy-c...@googlegroups.com, TICTeC < > tictecbymysoci...@googlegroups.com>, newswire <newswire@groups.dowire.org> > *Subject:* Re: How are mobile carriers/Google/Apple helping track > Covid19? Hey South Korea! > I am not sure I want my neighbours, colleagues and family know about the > last love hotel I went, neither with who. It is curious that none of > shameful reactions that happened in Corea (stigmatisation) were mentioned > in the previous articles. Breach of privacy has a cost and I would prefer > to see rich countries spending more money on public healthcare in order to > mitigate future overwhelming crisis. > > > <https://www.westminster.ac.uk/centre-for-the-study-of-democracy> > > Gilles Pradeau > > Doctoral Researcher > University of Westminster > 32-38 Wells Street, London, W1T 3UW, United Kingdom > Website <http://budgetparticipatif.info/> Academia.edu > <https://westminster.academia.edu/GilPradeau> Twitter > <https://twitter.com/gilpradeau> > > > On Fri, 13 Mar 2020 at 17:30, Michael Meyer <mock1...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> As we are beyond isolation and more into containment and flattening the >> curve, I guess contract-tracing becomes less relevant. Still I wonder if >> not more could be done even in democracies with good data protecton if >> people voluntarily share their data for specific purposes of tracking. >> >> Michael (Meyer-Resende) >> >> On Fri, Mar 13, 2020 at 4:47 PM Róbert Bjarnason <rob...@citizens.is> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi Steven, >>> >>> I agree with Doreen that the surveillance aspect is worrying especially >>> to implement this in a state of an emergency and as contact tracing is >>> becoming less effective in many countries. Iceland has now done 1.188 >>> tests, with 128 infections and 951 in quarantine ( >>> https://www.covid.is/data) - per capita US numbers would be 1.8m tests, >>> 128k people infected and 951k in quarantine. The government is now close to >>> becoming overwhelmed with contact tracing and is moving to the next stage >>> of an over 100 people assembly ban and school closures. >>> >>> Regarding using commercial tech to track contacts, it is probably best >>> to start planning now for the next pandemic, make the process it into laws >>> and regulations and make sure to mitigate the surveillance issues in the >>> safest possible way. >>> >>> Best, >>> Robert >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Mar 13, 2020 at 3:30 PM Steven Clift <cl...@e-democracy.org> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Fyi ... >>>> >>>> https://www.facebook.com/groups/221979475862484 >>>> >>>> And: >>>> http://coronavirustechhandbook.com >>>> >>>> ht/ Edward Saperia >>>> >>>> >>>> On Fri, Mar 13, 2020, 9:43 AM Steven Clift <cl...@e-democracy.org> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ---------- Forwarded message --------- >>>>> From: Steven Clift <cl...@e-democracy.org> >>>>> Date: Fri, Mar 13, 2020, 9:38 AM >>>>> Subject: How are mobile carriers/Google/Apple helping track Covid19? >>>>> Hey South Korea! >>>>> To: poplus <pop...@googlegroups.com> >>>>> >>>>> I've read that South Korea has used tech to track down possible >>>>> contacts between those testing positive and those who may have been >>>>> exposed. >>>>> >>>>> I haven't heard if this being used in Italy, the UK, US, etc. Is it? >>>>> >>>>> Is there a detailed article about this anywhere? (Any language.) >>>>> >>>>> Does anyone here know more about this? >>>>> >>>>> One article: >>>>> >>>>> "Thousands of miles away in South Korea, authorities have a different >>>>> response to a similar-sized outbreak. They are testing hundreds of >>>>> thousands of people for infections and tracking potential carriers like >>>>> detectives, using cell phone and satellite technology." >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-response-specialre-idUSKBN20Z27P >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> My related post on Facebook: >>>>> >>>>> https://www.facebook.com/groups/opengovgroup/permalink/2615192822045631/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> Steven Clift >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "TICTeC" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to tictecbymysociety+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>> To view this discussion on the web, visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tictecbymysociety/CAO9TZ0V80Bh9KrUDsYLRj0vGwrTkPdEzZPQhcMKysHOph58hBQ%40mail.gmail.com >>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tictecbymysociety/CAO9TZ0V80Bh9KrUDsYLRj0vGwrTkPdEzZPQhcMKysHOph58hBQ%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>> . >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "TICTeC" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to tictecbymysociety+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> To view this discussion on the web, visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tictecbymysociety/CACJwbuhOWA%3D4Z%3DE_tkQ_NrDv-u0KcF-8OkBRAGB8-2FaWYDt2A%40mail.gmail.com >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tictecbymysociety/CACJwbuhOWA%3D4Z%3DE_tkQ_NrDv-u0KcF-8OkBRAGB8-2FaWYDt2A%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> . >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "TICTeC" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to tictecbymysociety+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> To view this discussion on the web, visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tictecbymysociety/CAMmpm-KNFkT08c0CRi3YTzJW1n8H%2Bk_0LYfr%2Burid5jY0qs5VQ%40mail.gmail.com >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tictecbymysociety/CAMmpm-KNFkT08c0CRi3YTzJW1n8H%2Bk_0LYfr%2Burid5jY0qs5VQ%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . > > > > This message and its attachments are private and confidential. 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