I went back and read Sam's post to, in fact, make sure that I did not overreact. Given that the justification given by both of you is that he purportedly demanded to have this fix put in place is a bit far fetched. I believe you're giving the term "pronto" far too much reverence. He got excited and thought it would be prudent, which I am of the opinion that we need more people excited about open source projects, to inform the developers of an issue he encountered and that he was able to find a solution and thought it would lend value to the NH project and its 67,000 downloaders. Yes, I entirely concede that he got overly excited, but my god people it could just be his personality. He was by no means stomping up and down demanding that you make the change now, you could just as easily rewrite his statement as such:
Judging by my experience I'm assuming that NH has lost potential developers because of this. I would recommend that someone with commit rights look at Martijn's blog post and get this up in the downloadable zip on the front page. Hopefully this could be done fairly quickly in hopes of helping others out there that may be encountering the same issue! This has the exact same meaning. It is also valid to point out that the word Pronto is not usually used, in American English at least, as a forceful demand of expedience. It is typically a more light hearted phrase, in fact I have never encountered anyone that has used it in such a manner as how it is being interpreted here. While this all may be semantics, had he said "I suggest someone with commit rights look at what was done and get this up in the downloadable zip on the front page, now!" then I would be in the exact same boat as all of you. That is not what he said and it still begs the question why it was justifiable to retort with a sarcastic hubris remark such as "By the way, for tonight, we all will take an Alplax to sleep a bit because we are worried if you will go for something else than NH." Disregarding the rest of the his response, the tone and under current of disdain in this mere statement is equivalent to just saying "We don't really give a shit whether you use the product or not, so shut up and move on." So, in closing, Fabio's contributions to NH are greatly appreciated. I still respect him highly for not only his contributions to NH and the open source community but also his skill as a developer that is quite evident through the source and through his blog. I, also, know that he can be very helpful when he is so inclined. He, however, is a voice and being the lead developer that voice is a bit louder than everyone else, for better or for worse. That means when he gives these short hubristic remarks as he has done with Sam. Or he responds to someone with one word answers or links to the NH reference manual rather than explaining an issue as he has done with me, he is setting a very negative tone for the entire project. One of the main reasons that NH has such a huge learning curve is that the documentation is quite lacking in substance. This is not saying anything bad, as this is quite often the case with open source projects, but it means that more people with varied skill levels and personalities are going to find their way to the user groups and post what may seem like trivial questions but to them it is very challenging. I would rather see someone who thinks answering those questions is a waste of time just not bother with answering versus giving the types of remarks we have seen. I apologize for the long response. I, unfortunately, see this happen all too often in open source projects and honestly is a limiting factor of open source projects and their proliferation IMHO. Thanks for your time. On Thu, Jul 16, 2009 at 7:28 AM, Stefan Steinegger<[email protected]> wrote: > > Indeed. Fabios answer might be emotional (I found it funny by the > way). But Sams post is just ridiculous. Working since "one and a half" > week with NH and demanding binaries including a certain feature > "pronto"?? Fabio just points out what scale this project has, how many > people already depend on in and that features aren't requested this > way. > > On 16 Jul., 06:45, Markus Zywitza <[email protected]> wrote: >> Oh it might be that when you are working on your spare time on such a >> project, you won't be too happy when someone comes and tells you to do >> something "pronto". >> >> If you also look at the reason, that he can't compile NH because of having >> VS Express, then all you know is that the person in question is not able to >> read howtobuild.txt or readme.txt or whatever. All you need to build NH is >> the SDK and NAnt. >> >> -Markus >> >> 2009/7/16 Josh Rogers <[email protected]> >> >> > All he was trying to do is make a valid suggestion, while it may have been >> > boisterous, I do not understand the irradic barrage of belittiling >> > comments >> > and answers from you Fabio. There is no one that will say the learning >> > curve for NH is anything less than steep, yet you treat question posers >> > with >> > hostility and disrespect. I have been nothing but respectful of you and >> > your contributions yet you gave me the same flippant attitude as you gave >> > this person. >> >> > Being part of an open source project, not to mention the lead developer, >> > automattically places you in a position of spokesperson for that project. >> > Whether that is what you want or not that is the truth. >> >> > I am sure I won't be missed either but I will not be using NH anymore nor >> > will I consider it for future products while this type of attitude prevails >> > in the project. >> >> > On Jul 15, 2009, at 6:02 PM, Fabio Maulo <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > 2009/7/15 Sam Kimmel < <[email protected]>[email protected]> >> >> >> I'm 99.9% sure that NHibernate has lost potential developers because >> >> of this (it almost lost me and probably would have if I didn't find >> >> Martijn's blog entry). >> >> > I'm sure you read NH-forge wiki and some others blog posst about how use NH >> > in medium-trust.The 67000 downloads of NH is because there are many silly >> > developers using NH to play a little bit with something completely >> > unusable. >> >> > By the way, for tonight, we all will take an Alplax to sleep a bit because >> > we are worried if you will go for something else than NH. >> >> > I want give you a cache to learn a little bit: >> > <http://lmgtfy.com/?q=NHibernate+medium+trust> >> >http://lmgtfy.com/?q=NHibernate+medium+trust >> >> > -- >> > Fabio Maulo > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "nhusers" group. 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