Roy T. Fielding wrote: > On Jan 5, 2008, at 8:45 AM, Alan Coopersmith wrote: > >> Joerg Schilling wrote: >>> "Shawn Walker" <swalker at opensolaris.org> wrote: >>>> At last check, it didn't. Rather, the ARC process and integration >>>> does instead. >>> >>> AFAIK, the ARC process is not an "opensolaris process". It is a "Sun >>> Solaris" >>> process. See a mail thread from Roy Fielding 2-3 weeks ago. >> >> Roy is mistaken, as the ARC is open to the OpenSolaris community. > > I am not mistaken. The ARC is an advisory board that some people go to > for sage advice on interfaces, after which their community can make > decisions (process) on the basis of that advice. The ARC has no > direct "process" role at OpenSolaris, nor is there any OpenSolaris > requirement associated with seeking the ARC's advice. People will do > so because the core contributors will make a decision to do so *when* > it is appropriate for a given community's scope, not because the > organization (or Sun) commands it for everyone.
I think some folks are talking past each other. I don't hear Roy saying that ARC is closed. What I do hear him saying is that the requirement to come to ARC derives from Sun requirements associated with Sun CTeams. That much is true. ARC itself tries to run itself as transparently as possible. (This was even true before OpenSolaris, although the transparency was limited in scope to just Sun engineering, rather than the whole world.) We don't have a good fill in replacement for the ON C-Team as far as ON goes right now. Until ON gets hosted outside of Sun, and is truly liberated, I'm not sure that a replacement for the current ON C-Team is strictly required. And I would *strongly* hope that the current C-Team rules would continue going forward by whatever OpenSolaris equivalent (Core Contributors or what have you) replaces it. Certainly I would be greatly dismayed if the requirement for ARC oversight was lifted without a suitable replacement. For those of you who seem to be worried that Sun isn't being open enough or that the process of opening up is stalled, I think its time to speak with actions rather than words. To that end, I am requesting that the OGB consider the following: 1) Create a list of projects and processes which currently are Sun internal, that need to be replaced or removed in order to make the process fully open. As part of this list, there should be specific ways that both internal and external folks can help out. A task list, if you will. 2) Formally request that an OpenSolaris ARC be formed, perhaps staffed initially with the PSARC membership, and that it be mandated to begin using tools available outside of SWAN at its earliest convenience. I am willing to volunteer to help Plocher adjust/adapt Sun internal tools to use on an external zone on OS.o. A deadline should be decided upon for the ARC processes to fully external. 3) Mandate that the RTI tools be made available outside of SWAN, with a fixed deadline to be decided upon by OGB. This is a key process, and it need not depend on SWAN. (Right now it depends on SWAN for bugster access... which brings me to...) I'm willing to try to help here too, if it is needed, btw. 3) Request a status report on the search for a bugster replacement. This should be made available to the membership at large. Unified defect tracking for OpenSolaris is required, and we need something in place soon. Ultimately, if this project is stalled, then we need to know about it and formulate some plan for corrective action. At this point, even a DTS that doesn't meet all of our wishes would be better than not having one, and bugster cannot reasonably be made open. 4) Formally create a role for C-Teams, to be assigned/elected by either the Core Contributors or the OGB, for consolidations. Mixing governance and C-Team duties is a mistake IMO, and ultimately I believe that we need far fewer C-Team members than we need Core Contributors. 5) Request an update on the transition to Mercurial. I know that this is in process and making headway, but the non-Sun membership needs to have an ETA on the transition, and also a list of ways that they can help out. That's an awful lot to do. But at this point, I think the leadership we elected needs to stand up, and take action. And, more importantly, the membership needs to know how they help with the process. The problem shouldn't sit entirely on Sun's shoulders, but until we know what has been done, what still needs to be done, and what the relevant problems are, we can't really ask too much of the membership at large in the way of help here. -- Garrett
