[Winona Online Democracy] Hello Winona Online Democracy, I had the same question, who are Quinn and Larry Rand? About the silk stocking comment directed at the Green Party....the point is a good one but people have to realize that while Green politics, economics, and ideas go back decades, the organization in the U.S. is very new and very small. It's like expecting a 5 year old to have travelled the world, speak 10 languages, and play Bach from memory. The ideas are mature and well established but the party's organization is new and still forming. The Green Party is young but growing quickly. Give us 2-5 years and hopefully you will see "captains" in every precinct or...maybe a new kind of political structure. ;-> Dwayne Voegeli ------------- >From: "Duane Peterson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "Jim Hanzel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [Winona] Response to Mathematicians' remedies to electoral >process >Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 13:59:42 -0600 >MIME-Version: 1.0 >X-Priority: 3 >X-MSMail-Priority: Normal >X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 >Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Precedence: bulk > >[Winona Online Democracy] > >Who is Larry Rand?. The thinking is sound and a good analysis. We have >always needed the ground troops to get out the vote. That holds true for >both major parties. >Duane M. Peterson >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Jim Hanzel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2000 11:17 AM >Subject: [Winona] Response to Mathematicians' remedies to electoral process > > >> [Winona Online Democracy] >> >> >Date: Tue, 28 Nov 2000 11:06:11 -0600 >> > >> >> >> >>Quinn, >> >> >> >>Interesting stuff, but I wonder about one section: "If, as polls >showed, >> >>most Nader voters would have voted for Gore over Bush, then most of >those >> >>voters' second choices would have become votes for Gore. Under this >"single >> >>transferable vote'' system, Gore would have won." >> >> >> >>Nader's biggest votes came in states that were already in Gore's camp; >the >> >>closest Nader came to costing Gore a state was in Oregon, but I don't >know >> >>of any states that Bush won where a total of the Gore and Nader votes >> >>exceeded the Bush vote. Do you? >> >> >> >>This idea, however, has been strongly promoted by the Democrats as a >whip >> >>to keep Green voters in the Democratic fold. >> >> >> >>The real reason that Gore and the Democrats have come this close to >losing >> >>was something far more embarrassing: turnout. The voting rate for >> >>Gore-Bush was a point LOWER than the over-before-it-was-over Clinton >> >>re-election campaign. The traditional way for the GOP to win is to run >a >> >>boring campaign and keep turnout low; the way Dems win is to fan the >flames >> >>and get voter turnout high, especially in minority areas. Gore's sheer >> >>dynamism and charisma coupled with his utterly fascinating talent at >> >>oration and media events failed to do this. >> >> >> >>One thing for certain: if Nader and Buchanan had been granted their >legal >> >>rights to be on t.v. debates, the election would have been different. >Bush >> >>and Gore both came off better than they should have, because each was >busy >> >>trying to be the other and confuse the voter in the middle into voting >for >> >>him. This played into Bush's strategy by keeping the swing voters away >> >>from the polls on voting day; neither candidate was interesting to them, >> >>and they were too moderate to vote for Nader or Buchanan. >> >> >> >>All four candidates ran truly lousy campaigns, let's face it. Gore was >> >>Bashful, Bush was Dopey, Nader was Sneezy and Buchanan was Grumpy. >Only >> >>Bush took his home turf, so big surprise, it looks like he wins (had to >> >>steal Florida to do it, the nitwit). >> >> >> >>When "Big Jim" Thompson, Illinois' sexually adventurous former governor, >> >>was asked to name his crowning political achievement over four >consecutive >> >>terms as governor, he said, "I carried my precinct in all four >elections." >> >>He was not being flip; he is a true politician. Gush and Bore are what >> >>your basic pinkie ring Bridgeport precinct captain would disdainfully >call >> >>"silk stocking" candidates -- too important to carry their own precinct. >> >>The Green Party, whose platform I like a lot, seems to be an entire >party >> >>of silk stockings devoid of any real precinct captains, who are the >people >> >>who win elections. No real political activist likes working for silk >> >>stocking candidates. If Al Gore can't carry his own precinct, he should >> >>not have declared. >> >> >> >>Larry Rand >> >> >> >> ---------------- >> This message was posted to the Winona Online Democracy Project. >> Please visit http://onlinedemocracy.winona.org to subscribe or >unsubscribe. >> Please sign all messages posted to this list with your actual name. >> Posting of commercial solicitations is not allowed on this list. >> Report problems to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> > >---------------- >This message was posted to the Winona Online Democracy Project. >Please visit http://onlinedemocracy.winona.org to subscribe or unsubscribe. >Please sign all messages posted to this list with your actual name. >Posting of commercial solicitations is not allowed on this list. >Report problems to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > ---------------- This message was posted to the Winona Online Democracy Project. Please visit http://onlinedemocracy.winona.org to subscribe or unsubscribe. 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