On 4/19/12, Jürgen Schmidt <[email protected]> wrote: > On 4/19/12 9:41 AM, Alexandro Colorado wrote: >> On 4/19/12, Rob Weir<[email protected]> wrote: >>> On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 2:07 AM, Alexandro Colorado<[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>>> On 4/18/12, Rob Weir<[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:36 PM, Roberto Galoppini<[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2012 at 7:08 PM, Alexandro Colorado<[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> On 4/17/12, drew<[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>> On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 11:15 -0500, Alexandro Colorado wrote: >>>>>>>>> My point is that we are going to be bombarded with support >>>>>>>>> questions, >>>>>>>>> regardless if we choose not to, is not up to us. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Sure you can redirect them to the ML/Forums, but that would be done >>>>>>>>> 99% of the time, which will frustrate the user and the handlers. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> That's the point I wanted to make based on the experience of >>>>>>>>> handling >>>>>>>>> these accounts in the past. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Like I said, I am more concern with solving the issue of operation >>>>>>>>> first than figuring out which new accounts to create and why/why >>>>>>>>> not. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Well, I am not advocating removal of any existing accounts. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I am sure you didn't. That is not what I said. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi Alexandro and all, >>>>>> >>>>>> Will @openofficeorg be under the Apache OpenOffice control? If this is >>>>>> the >>>>>> case, I wonder if it wouldn't be better to use that one instead of the >>>>>> new >>>>>> ones. In case I'd recommend to upload the new logo, as well as to >>>>>> update >>>>>> the short description. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> We've tried to contact the owner of @openofficeorg, to discuss putting >>>>> this account under PPMC control. We have no had success with that. So >>>>> we're going forward with a new account. It should be easy and quick >>>>> to get a similar number of followers once we promote it on the >>>>> homepage. >>>> >>>> Who decided this? you? >>>> >>> >>> Decided what? That it would be easy to get a similar number of >>> followers? That is purely my estimate, based on the fact that we've >>> managed to get almost 8000 users to sign up on the ooo-announce list. >>> Following someone on Twitter should is much easier than signing up on >>> an ezmlm list. So if we have 8000 there, getting more than 1500 >>> Twitter followers should not be hard. >> >> So you are deciding things? When you said 'we're going forward' you >> mean you are moving forward. > > I think you misunderstand something here. Rob decided not on his own, I
No way to prove that. > think it was the outcome of this longer discussion. and if the owner of > the existing account doesn't reply it is natural to move forward with a > new one, isn't it? > > What is your concern here? Rob contacted me on the matter, and I reply back into the thread and now he said that nobody replied and refer to his decisions as we, when he is the one alone making how things are shaping. > > Juergen > >> >>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> What I am advocating is the creation of a set un-ambiguous official >>>>>>>> Apache OpenOffice project accounts. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> what will happened when the unambigous official account get support >>>>>>> inquiries everyday? >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I had a look at the flow of questions and answers, it seems manageable >>>>>> to >>>>>> me. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I believe that there is work needing to be done to establish the >>>>>>>> Apache >>>>>>>> OpenOffice identity. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It seems to me that this is an appropriate step to further that >>>>>>>> goal. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Here my list of recommendations: >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. Rebranding existing accounts (see above) >>>>>> 2. Spend some time to choose (few) people to follow (maybe using >>>>>> keywords >>>>>> like office suites, odf, open standards, etc). >>>>>> As of today only Alexandro and Rob are followed by @openofficeorg, >>>>>> think we should spend some time to choose people to follow, so that it >>>>>> could be easier to engage in conversations using tools like >>>>>> googlefinder, >>>>>> Listorious, etc. >>>>> >>>>> That is an interesting point. Many people decide who to follow based >>>>> on recommendation engines that look at existing following patterns in >>>>> Twitter. So having a good set of mutual followers will help. >>>>> >>>>>> 3. Start simple. So announcements, news from our blog, new committers, >>>>>> etc. >>>>>> 4. Be consistent. Two message a day could be a good starting point, >>>>>> maybe >>>>>> once a day over the week-ends. >>>>>> 5. Don't follow back just for the sake of it, it's wise to follow only >>>>>> people we might want to engage with. >>>>>> 6. Start conversations with people we know, related projects, etc. >>>>> >>>>> For example, we might congratulate other OSS projects,Apache and >>>>> external, that make new releases, if these would be of interest to our >>>>> followers. >>>>> >>>>>> 7. Establish a clear policy about language style, but especially for >>>>>> how >>>>>> to >>>>>> handle "crises" >>>>>> 8. Use a tool to measure our improvements, both Klout and PeerIndex >>>>>> may >>>>>> be >>>>>> useful in this respect. >>>>>> >>>>>> Roberto >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sure I agree, but my point is really about how to do it based on >>>>>>> previous issues. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> //drew >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 4/17/12, drew<[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 11:02 -0500, Alexandro Colorado wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> I think this provide a bit of confussion on the user end. Also I >>>>>>>>>>> recognize the struggle of keeping the accounts active. Making >>>>>>> multiple >>>>>>>>>>> accounts will increase the job. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> The blog itself has not been updated that frequently, and I am >>>>>>>>>>> not >>>>>>>>>>> sure if this will increase as we get a release. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Most of the use of the accounts on my experience is support-like >>>>>>>>>>> issues. So relying on one single point of contact is also pretty >>>>>>>>>>> bad. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Having an AOO-Support and AOO-Annoucement is equally not good >>>>>>> strategy >>>>>>>>>>> in my account because people will tend to stick to the account >>>>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>>> they see crossing their path. (Just because we structure one way, >>>>>>>>>>> doesnt mean users will do so). >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> One of the issues of openofficeorg accounts both on Facebook >>>>>>>>>>> Google >>>>>>>>>>> plus and twitter had been the issue of keeping the content fresh >>>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>>> also interacting as a group as opposed to an individual. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I would argue to stop taking liberties on creating new accounts >>>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>>> instead take liberties on designing a good strategy to solve some >>>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>>> these basic issues that tackle these problems. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> So far I am not even sure how these accounts could be handle by >>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure and what are the requirements. Rob mention that >>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure should manage these, but I am also not sure how >>>>>>>>>>> long >>>>>>>>>>> will they take to proxy the messages specially when it comes to >>>>>>>>>>> support and we get 100 inquiries a day (for example). >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Hi Alexandro, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Good points - I would simply emphasize that I am not at all saying >>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>> the apacheoo accounts should be about support - not at all. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The ApacheOO accounts (lets focus on just twitter and identi.ca) >>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>> moment - would be used specifically as a broadcast mechanism. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> How I as envisioning it, at least. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> //drew >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On 4/17/12, drew<[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, 2012-04-16 at 00:50 -0400, drew wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Sun, 2012-04-15 at 18:25 -0400, Rob Weir wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2012 at 12:08 PM, drew >>>>>>>>>>>>>> <[email protected]> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 2012-04-11 at 17:43 +0200, Roberto Galoppini >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2012 at 4:09 PM, Rob Weir< >>>>>>> [email protected]> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Social media outreach, via Twitter, Facebook, Google+, >>>>>>> etc., >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> an >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> important part of outreach to users. Although the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Apache >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> developer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> community is firmly rooted in mailing lists, we know >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>> our >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> users >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> live in a different world. If we want to engage with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> we >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> need >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> use the tools that they use, and communicate the way >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> communicate. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Now that we're very close to the AOO 3.4 release, I'd >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like >>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> start >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with a project Twitter account, under PPMC control. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> By "under PPMC control" I mean something similar to how >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> we >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> treat >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> project blog: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- Any PPMC member, upon request, can have write >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> access. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- We can use the project's official logo in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> conjunction >>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> account. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- We would promote the account on our project's >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> website. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- We would generally treat the account as an official >>>>>>> voice >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> project, not as a personal account. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not saying we need to pre-review and and approve >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> every >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "tweet" >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sent through the account. But we should set >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> expectations >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> account is to be used in a professional fashion, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> upholding >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> standards of this project, not used to settle personal >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> disputes, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> promote personal business, etc. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> An option could be to agree on a simple guideline for >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that, >>>>>>> so >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> everyone knows how to handle it. I'm thinking not only >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> style of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> communication, but also about who to follow, how to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> engage >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> conversations, improve outreach, etc. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> There are already several Twitter accounts that use the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OOo >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> name >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> or >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> trademarks: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://twitter.com/#!/openofficeorg --- This account >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> has >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1571 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> followers. But it is not sharing any AOO status, no >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> links >>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> blog >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> posts, announcements, etc. Who controls it? Are >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> we able to get it under PPMC control? Can we rebrand >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> as >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Apache >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OpenOffice? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That could be a good starting point, I think. It seems >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like >>>>>>> if >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you're >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> only one who can send DM to the actual owner's account. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://twitter.com/#!/openoffice -- This account seems >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> unused. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Only one >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tweet. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd try to get that it too. It's better than ApacheOO, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>> you >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> might >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> want >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to put the full name in the Settings> Account> Name. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Roberto, Rob >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I just did so now, and followed up with an email to the >>>>>>> account >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contact >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in the whois database for the domain listed, the linked >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sub-domain >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> has >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> been dead for a while IIRC, though the main site is alive >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anyway, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'll >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> report back when (or if) I hear anything back. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Drew, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> It has been 5 days now. Have you received any response from >>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>>>>>> domain >>>>>>>>>>>>>> owner? >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> No nothing. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> If not, I'm ready to go with a new account: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/apacheoo >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> a good account name for an announcement stream, even with the >>>>>>> other >>>>>>>>>>>>> IMO. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Howdy all, >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Wanted to follow up on this. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> As I think about, IMO, this is a good moment to use a new >>>>>>> account(s) >>>>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>>>> a more formal, account of record if you will, for the project; >>>>>>> Apache >>>>>>>>>>>> OpenOffice. The use of the apache in the account name makes >>>>>>>>>>>> very >>>>>>> good >>>>>>>>>>>> sense to me for this purpose. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> The flip side of that then would be to treat the existing >>>>>>>>>>>> social >>>>>>>>>>>> media >>>>>>>>>>>> account as more community, less formal, voices. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Anyawy - the apacheoo does get my vote for an appropriate name, >>>>>>>>>>>> for >>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>> project account. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I took the liberty then to register the same name with the >>>>>>> identi.ca >>>>>>>>>>>> network. >>>>>>>>>>>> http://identi.ca/apacheoo >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> IMO identi.ca, which has a smaller user base then twitter, >>>>>>> represents >>>>>>>>>>>> an >>>>>>>>>>>> important target group to the project. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> The two accounts, if we use them for this, should be tied >>>>>>>>>>>> together. >>>>>>>>>>>> Certainly at the level that a post to the identi.ca should >>>>>>>>>>>> automatically >>>>>>>>>>>> broadcast to the twitter network. (easy to do) >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> A couple of thoughts on 'formal account of record': >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Would recommend that the accounts not be used to follow lots of >>>>>>> other >>>>>>>>>>>> accounts. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> The accounts should not be used to re-tweet others messages. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> The accounts should _not_ be used for auto-generated scheduled >>>>>>>>>>>> postings. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> The accounts do need to be used on a regular basis to build up >>>>>>>>>>>> followers. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Ability to 'follow' the accounts needs to be easily done within >>>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>>> main >>>>>>>>>>>> web infrastructure and there should be some naturally well >>>>>>>>>>>> fitting >>>>>>>>>>>> locations where that can be done. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Anyone using the accounts should remember to keep the message >>>>>>> focused >>>>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>>> the project. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Well, that's a good spot to shutup huh :-) and let folks add >>>>>>>>>>>> their >>>>>>>>>>>> wisdom here. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> So what you think - Use the new ApacheOO accounts? >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> //drew >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> //drew >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have it configured with the BirdHerd service, so up to 10 >>>>>>>>>>>>>> PPMC >>>>>>>>>>>>>> members will be able send tweets via that account. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Rob >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //drew >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <snip> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Alexandro Colorado >>>>>>> OpenOffice.org Español >>>>>>> http://es.openoffice.org >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ==== >>>>>> This e- mail message is intended only for the named recipient(s) >>>>>> above. >>>>>> It >>>>>> may contain confidential and privileged information. If you are not >>>>>> the >>>>>> intended recipient you are hereby notified that any dissemination, >>>>>> distribution or copying of this e-mail and any attachment(s) is >>>>>> strictly >>>>>> prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please >>>>>> immediately >>>>>> notify the sender by replying to this e-mail and delete the message >>>>>> and >>>>>> any attachment(s) from your system. Thank you. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Alexandro Colorado >>>> OpenOffice.org Español >>>> http://es.openoffice.org >>> >> >> > > -- Alexandro Colorado OpenOffice.org Español http://es.openoffice.org
